Starting warmachine

[Wafflebob]

Seems that there are a lot of these "starting" threads but I'm going to make another one.

I've been looking at warmachine for a while. I saw quite a few posts about people leaving warhammer for it and I started poking around the battle college. I love the models and from what I've seen from the rules it seems like it's a lot more..in-depth and tactical. Not to mention it seems like it's a whole lot cheaper to get started.

Not to mention I prefer the smaller game and skirmish style of play rather than huge units that are supposed to soak up lots of damage and kills.

So a couple things I'm wondering.

About how long does a game take to play? Do you end up with lots of rules disputes as in warhammer where you seem to end up spending 1/4 of your playing time looking up obscure rules on how to handle different situations?

Another thing is army playstyle. I'm looking for what will hopefully be an army with a smaller number of models. Not because I'm trying to save money, but because I've played horde style in warhammer fantasy and 40k and want to avoid it this time. I'm looking for a small elite force if that's possible. Also I prefer the 'jacks to anything else. I've been looking at Khador, will they work out ok as a smaller force consisting primarily of powerful jacks? Is there a faction that does this better?

[ArtificiallyEnhanced]

Been thinking the same thing myself recently, I'll sit and watch too.

[Kelter Skelter]

Not to add to the post count without adding any information but, I'm equally as interested in starting as both of you so I will also be watching this thread.

[Blood_Blade]

To the OP: From all that you've said, I think Warmachine is the game that you're looking for. I'll answer your questions as quotes:

Originally Posted by Wafflebob

About how long does a game take to play?

A regular sized game of 500 pts or 35 pts (Mk I and Mk II respectively) will take anywhere from 45 to 90 min as long as both players know the game reasonably well.

Originally Posted by Wafflebob

Do you end up with lots of rules disputes as in warhammer where you seem to end up spending 1/4 of your playing time looking up obscure rules on how to handle different situations?

I have had a few rules disputes over the past 3 years of playing, however they are usually worked out fast (the rulebook is generally clear). If there is/has been a wording error, Privateer Press keeps a faq section open on their home forum where you can ask game developers your problems. They answer questions usually within 24 hours at the latest, and unlike the phone line GW had set up, their rulings are consistent.

Originally Posted by Wafflebob

Another thing is army playstyle. I'm looking for what will hopefully be an army with a smaller number of models. Not because I'm trying to save money, but because I've played horde style in warhammer fantasy and 40k and want to avoid it this time.

I would suggest the taking of units in Warmachine as they truely support your warjacks effectively. However, taking 2 or 3 units is by no means going the 'horde' route in this game. As an example; I only run 23 models in my current 35 pt list.

Originally Posted by Wafflebob

I've been looking at Khador, will they work out ok as a smaller force consisting primarily of powerful jacks? Is there a faction that does this better?

Khador as a whole, lives off their troops. This is not to say that they're a hordes style army, but more that they have really good, really tough/hard to hit troops that will lay a smack down when given half a chance. Khador can definitely run a 'jack heavy force, but it is more dependent upon what 'caster you would like to use and less about what faction. eIrusk, pButcher, eButcher, pVlad and Karchev are Mk II 'casters that are efficient when working with multiple 'jacks and have differing degrees of success.

One thing you will find in Warmachine is that by using the same army and switching your Warcaster, you will have completely changed the focus and abilities of your entire force. Also, Warmachine can be played almost any way you want. There are many suggested additions to forces, and some very effective combinations that you can find on the internet. However, you will almost always do better with a force you play a lot than a list you copied off of a guy who won a tournament.

As an aside, Mk II Warmachine will be releasing January 2010 and the Beta for Hordes Mk II will be released late November 2009. I would suggest only buying models (as the models come with their own rules) and not any books until these release dates arrive. You can find the Warmachine rules on the Privateer website now, or right here, and the Hordes rules will be released in the same format.

[Wafflebob]

Hey thanks for the response!

I've actually been reading quite a bit on BattleCollege and from what I've seen Khador has a lot of cool troops.

Primarily the reason I wanted to run a jack heavy list was to reduce the number of models, but also because I'm sick of human faces and the like. I've noticed that a lot of the Khador models, particularly the highly recommended ones are fully armored and almost look like mini warjacks.

I think I'd really like warmachine. I've been reading the warcaster's section and it's really crazy how much your choices change the way the army plays.

Seems like a big change from warhammer fantasy.

[Blood_Blade]

If you are really interested in starting, but are not sure what to buy I'd suggest the following:

1) Download the Mk II rules from the Privateer Press site. They're now in their complete form, and will not change in the January 2010 release. Also, you can begin to familiarize yourself with the core rules.

2) After you think you know the basics start looking for a battle box game. These games, although possibly phased out in Mk II, include 1 caster and 2-4 'jacks. They're great for learning the basics of each faction as well as giving you an idea of how a game will run. The boxes are set up as follows:

Khador:
Sorscha, Juggernaut, Destroyer

Cygnar:
Stryker, Ironclad, Lancer, Charger

Cryx:
Denegra, Slayer, 2 Deathrippers, Defiler

Menoth:
Kreoss, Crusader, Revenger, Repenter

note: none of the Warcasters are their epic versions


3) If you can't find any games near you, check out Warmachine on Vassal. There is a strong community going right now and you shouldn't have many problems getting some games in.

Vassal
Warmachine Vassal Mod
Warmachine Vassal Forum

As an aside, don't jump into the game to fast. Play a dozen low point games and get a feel for the game before shooting for bigger battles. This is largely because experienced players will rip your head off (in a nice and graceful manner hopefully). You need a solid grasp of the rules and tactics for your force before you go out into battle as Warmachine relies on in game tactics, combo's and buffs, all of which will seem odd to starting players.

[Wafflebob]

Thanks again for all the assistance! I'll probably have to check out vassal until I can find and meet with some local players.

I downloaded the rules set and the cards from their website and have been reading through them, along with the battle college.

I'm having a hard time picking an army to start with so far. I love the Khador models, although the lightning from Cygnar seems really cool too. Not such a fan of the Cryx or Menoth models though. I like the Cryx heavy jacks and warcasters but not much else.

[xbanditsx]

I recently got in touch with one of the Press Gangers from the New England area and set up a demo game at a shop near me for next weekend. The guy was very enthusiastic and excited to play a few games with me and introduce me to some of the other players at the store.

I got a little lucky in finding him, but I bet if you contact your local shop they'll know one around and will probably have an email address.

[Wafflebob]

I'll check with my local shop when the owner is in. He has lots of connections like that. Not so sure though. Lately all they carry is Flames of War and Warhammer stuff. And they've cut way back on their Warhammer products due to GW's practices.