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  1. #1
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    1500 points, Campain list

    First off, this campaign centers on characters. They will lvl up from week to week, which explains why this list is character heavy.

    WoC 1500 Campaign List
    HEROES
    Valwyrd the Mad (Exalted Hero): Halberd; Mark of Tzeench; Chaos Runeshield; Demonic Mount
    Khagligula Silvertonge (Chaos Sorcerer) : Level 2 Mark of Slaanesh; Acid Ichor; 2x Dispel scroll; Steed of Slaanesh
    Gloom (Chaos Sorcerer): Mark of Tzeentch; Level 2; Power Familar; Death's Head
    CORE
    Chaos Warriors x12
    · Mark of Nurgle
    · Shields
    · Full Command
    · War Banner
    Chaos Maruader Horsemen x5
    · Mark of Khorne
    · Flails, Light armor, and throwing axes
    · Full Command
    Chaos Warhounds x10
    SPECIAL
    Chaos Knights x5
    · Mark of Nurgle: 30pts
    · Champion/Standard
    · Halberds
    RARE
    Chaos Ogres x3
    · Great Weapons.
    Total: 1496 points

    I am looking for critiques, but bare in mind the purpose of the list. The ?'s i have are in regards to the horsemen: to expensive? is it to cheesy to try to use MoK with the free reform fast cav rule? Can my fast cav sorcerer on the steed of slaanesh join this unit, and is it a good idea?

    Nurgle is on the Knights to ensure that they actually get in the fight this time (had khorne on them last game and lost them all wtihout even getting into combat... sigh) I am also concerned that i dont have enough infantry... what would you do to remedy the situation, keeping in mind that i can't do much about the points spent on the characters?

    Thanks for all your help!

    Brogan Ironbrow

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  3. #2
    Member flemingm's Avatar
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    If you like khornate knights, don't lose their mark just to ensure they get into combat. Nurgle is a stupid mark for them anyway, seeing as they already have a 1+ armour save and a weapon skill of 5. Simply put a unit of 5 chaos hounds in front of them. Split the unit of 10 you already have, and put the other unit of 5 in front of the chaos warriors you possess, thereby providing wthem with an effective meatshileld that can last a turn or 2 of enemy shooting and not panic the warriors behind them if they flee.

    Good luck rolling your Lord's 6+ ward save. Switch it for a mark of khorne or nurgle which better suits the challenges that he will no doubt have to face, because chaos cannot refuse challenges. Give him a rending sword (re-roll fails to wound, helpful in challenges) or a chaos runesword (+1 A, +1 Str, +1 WS, making him pretty statistically good in combat) instead of merely a halberd, because although rune shield is a good defensive object, with his high initiative and relatively good toughness, your lord will be striking first in challenges involving magic weapons, and thus will not need the bonus of this expensive shield.

    Khorne is great for knights of chaos, because it confers the frenzy upon it's steed, giving the steed an extra str 4 I 3 attack, as well as giving the rider another S5 magic I5 attack, meaning they are more likely to break the units of infantry or the like that they charge.

    Champions are a great waste of points, especially with knights. Woohoo 1 extra attack for 20 points. Yes it may be a strength 5 magic attack but big whoop he doesn't confer any additional bonuses upon the unit. You'd be better off with you original mark of khorne, and sit a unit of hounds in front of them to ensure they make it to the battle line.

    Chaos Knights can't get halberd, they can only get lances as weapon upgrades. Don't worry, they have magic str 5 weapons which will do the job however.

    Your marauder horsemen have too many weapons. Make a choice. Do you want them to outflank an enemy and pelt them with throwing axes or do you want them to break in an enemy's flank with their flails. I'd suggest flails with the mark of khorne personally, because khorne prefer combat to ranged, and you have higher strength in the first round of combat than throwing axes. Furthermore, you have an extra attack from obth the rider and the steed, meaning that in combat you can dish out enough wounds to break most lighter armoured breakable opponents. Thats my opinion however.

    nurgle and shields is a bit overkill on defense, maybe give them mark of Slaanesh so you don't lose them if you lose combat to a pursuit, because they are expensive and vulnerable to being outnumbered.

    Ogres are alright but I strongly suggest taking chaos armour with them, for they are more likely to weather enemy fire before getting properly stuck in with great weapons.

    I hope I have been of some help.

  4. #3
    The Shrubber sdefreit's Avatar
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    Here are some thoughts I have

    1) Like said before drop the champs. Youll save points and they for the most part are negative with our army rule.

    2) Your MoK marauder horsemen, cruise missiles as we call them are a little out of wack. With having frenzy they arent going to use those throwing axes much. Drop them, they arent worth it. And drop there command. Champion isnt worth it and you dont want this weak guy challenging. This unit is designed to be a cheap flanker for us at a cheap cost. Keep them cheap and simple. They are expendable so its a really bad idea to put a banner on the unit. Your handing out free VPs. And the musician isnt worth it either. Just go cheap MoK horsemen with flails and possibly LA if you have 5 points leftover on your list and there isnt anything else to do.

    3) Give those knights a musician. And I am also not a fan of MoN. I dont think its worth the points, but Im also not a fan of MoK. WoC is a pretty slow army overall and I dont like giving our fast units frenzy (exclude M horsemen because they are fast cav). Sure knights hit like a truck with MoK but they do without it too. A warhound shield will help but a good enemy with fast units and archers can still bait them. I prefer to keep them unbaitable, and give them the ability to attack exactly what I want them too. A less powerful but more critical attack is better than a monsterous attack power on a crap throw away unit. Which is what will get thrown in front of MoK knights.

    4) For your combat character I would personally go with putting him on a barded steed. He is cheaper and the base size is smaller. I only say a smaller base is better here because a 6 wide knight unit is easier to manuver than a 7 wide knight unit. You will get more armor at the cost of a little less offense and loss of fear. Imo demonic mounts just arent worth the points.

    5) Chaos ogres arent a bad choice. They pack a decent punch for their cost. But Dragon ogres are better. More survivable, faster, and Str 7 for chariot breaking and tin can opening
    A unit of three will cost 231 points though with GWs. But if you drop the things I recommend you should have room. Lets see. Drop the champs, command and axes from the horsemen, the exalted's mount to barded. This will acctually give you the exact amount of points needed to bump your ogre unit into a Dragon ogre unit with GWs. Well that worked out nicely.

  5. #4
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    Ok, keeping your advice in mind, here is what i have changed.

    WoC 1500 Campaign List
    HEROES
    Valwyrd the Mad (Exalted Hero): 234 pts
    · Mark of Nurgle; Favor of the Gods; Filth Mace; Bronze armor of Zhrakk; Demonic Mount
    Khagligula Silvertonge (Chaos Sorcerer) : 195 pts
    · Level 2 Mark of Slaanesh; Acid Ichor; 2x Dispel scroll; Steed of Slaanesh
    Gloom (Chaos Sorcerer): 185 pts
    · Mark of Tzeentch; Level 2; Power Familar; Death's Head
    CORE
    Chaos Warriors x12: 257 pts
    · Mark of Slaanesh
    · Shields
    · Full Command
    · War Banner
    Chaos Maruader Horsemen x5: 140 pts
    · Mark of Khorne
    · Flails and Light armor
    · Full Command
    Chaos Warhounds x10: 60pts
    SPECIAL
    Chaos Knights x5: 250pts
    · Mark of Khorne: 30pts
    · Standard
    · Ensorcelled Weapons
    RARE
    Chaos Ogres x3: 180pts
    · Mark of Nurgle
    · Great Weapons and Chaos Armor
    Total: 1502 points


    The mark and weapons on the lord made sense. I think a huge part of what inspired this list originally was my last fight, which was against a very nicely designed Dark Elves list. So i wanted my lord to actually see battle this time, and to survive it. I think what i have now is better, as i cant be one-shotted, and i have a good chance of returning some wounds. I added the favor of the gods to replace the halberd.

    In my last game, i lost my entire unit of warriors and Festus to a failed panic check, so i think your idea about Slaanesh is a great one and have decided to use it.

    For the marauders, it was really hard to give up the axes. i wanted to try the whole move into range, face away, and pelt people, but i think that i was asking that unit to do to much, and ended up droping them to get points elsewhere.

    For the knights, i guess i am willing to try one more time to use Khorne, i just had a VERY sour taste in my mouth after seeing what a few units of dark riders did to my expensive heavy hitter unit. I ended up loosing every single knight with out even getting into combat... bleh.

    The ogres i beefed using chaos armor and mark of nurgle. I figured the mark would really help with the low WS on these guys, and they now have the armor to stay stuck in for awhile.


    Well thanks for the excelent critisism, and dont be afraid to supply some more. I hope to go in tomorrow for some games to test this list out. I will let you know how it goes.

    Brogan
    Brogan Ironbrow

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    OMG, your 100% right about the Dragon Ogres... Lets see what i can come up with...

    WoC 1500 Campaign List
    HEROES
    Valwyrd the Mad (Exalted Hero): 199 pts
    · Mark of Nurgle; Favor of the Gods; Filth Mace; Bronze armor of Zhrakk; Barded Steed
    Khagligula Silvertonge (Chaos Sorcerer) : 195 pts
    · Level 2 Mark of Slaanesh; Acid Ichor; 2x Dispel scroll; Steed of Slaanesh
    Gloom (Chaos Sorcerer): 185 pts
    · Mark of Tzeentch; Level 2; Power Familar; Death's Head
    CORE
    Chaos Warriors x12: 257 pts
    · Mark of Slaanesh
    · Shields

    · War Banner
    Chaos Maruader Horsemen x5: 130 pts
    · Mark of Khorne
    · Flails; axes; Light armor
    ·
    Chaos Warhounds x10: 60pts
    SPECIAL
    Chaos Knights x5: 240pts
    · Mark of Slaanesh
    · Standard/musician
    · Ensorcelled Weapons
    RARE
    Dragon Ogres x3: 231pts
    · Great Weapons
    Total: 1497 points


    Woot, got my axes back (i mean come on, 10 points? seems worth it to me.) And i can see what the knights can do without Khorne. i am actually excited about this, as i can now choose to screen any unit i want, based on deployment, instead of having to alocate one unit of houds to the knights. I also have a pretty fast force, as everything but the warriors is going to be able to race around the battle field. 7 PPD means magic is decent, so i have some ranged, and if i need to march into heavy fire, my hounds can shield the warriors.

    I will consider more revisions, but i think its time for some playtesting. I will let you know how it goes.

    Brogran
    Last edited by Brogan Ironbrow; June 26th, 2009 at 19:01.
    Brogan Ironbrow

  7. #6
    The Shrubber sdefreit's Avatar
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    Im liking it a lot more. MoS is not the best mark for knights though. They already cause fear, and they shouldnt be taking panic tests for the most part with a 1+ save. Plus if they do its rerollable anyways. Thats ten points you can shave off for added fun somewhere else. I would leave em unmarked imo. Thats what I do. I say nay to the marks and just add a 6th knight in my list. You already got the exalted in there so your good to go already.

    Ok you may or may not like this but looking at your list I am starting to ask...Why warriors? I love the models and they are extremely tough. But your entire army is fast. Id make a second Marauder cruise missile and get another fast unit out of the remaining points. Youd have 152 points leftover after replacing them with a cheap cruise missile. Bring back the ogre unit possibly? I just think this could be a nice move since it would give you an entire army that will be in your opponents face fast. The warriors just dont seem to fit this specicfic list.

    Also on the doggies. Think about maybe making em two unts of 5. It wont change anything point wise, but it can give you more versatility for deployment and you can screen multiple units. Just a small thought.


    You could drop the warriors for 3 different options imo:
    1) 2 cruise missiles and 5 dogs
    2) 1 cruise missile, chariot and 5 dogs
    3) 1 cruise missile and Ogres (chaos armor and GWs)
    Last edited by sdefreit; June 26th, 2009 at 19:21.

  8. #7
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    I lke the idea, but before i do, i have some concerns.

    Can the marauder horsman end a move facing away from a unit, and then reform AND charge on the next turn? The rules seem to indicate this is the way they work, but i want to be sure before i go to the table with them.

    No warriors means no place for the sorcerers to hide. this begs the question: can the slaanesh sorcerer join the marauders? and if so, is it a good idea?
    I kinda like the idea of a chariot, could the sorcerer sit in that? it says its an option for him, and it would be a bit cheaper than buying the extra unit...

    Ok, so i revised because i love the idea of all that mobility... here is what i came up with:

    WoC 1500 Campaign List
    HEROES
    Valwyrd the Mad (Exalted Hero): 199 pts
    · Mark of Nurgle; Favor of the Gods; Filth Mace; Bronze armor of Zhrakk; Demonic Mount
    Khagligula Silvertonge (Chaos Sorcerer) : 195 pts
    · Level 2 Mark of Slaanesh; Acid Ichor; 2x Dispel scroll; Steed of Slaanesh
    Gloom (Chaos Sorcerer): 285 pts
    · Mark of Tzeentch; Level 2; Power Familar; Death's Head: Chariot
    CORE
    Chaos Maruader Horsemen x5: 110 pts
    · Mark of Khorne
    · Flails and Light armor
    Chaos Maruader Horsemen x5: 110 pts
    · Mark of Khorne
    · Flails and Light armor
    Chaos Warhounds x5: 30pts
    Chaos Warhounds x5: 30pts
    Chaos Warhounds x5: 30pts

    SPECIAL
    Chaos Knights x6: 280pts
    · Standard/musician
    · Ensorcelled Weapons
    RARE
    Dragon Ogres x3: 231pts
    · Great Weapons
    Total: 1500 points
    So, all characters now have mobility. I have my sorcerer on the chariot which makes him pretty viable as either a damage or magic user. he will have the mobility to get to where he can be used.

    I have 2 cruise missle units as core, nice and fast and can do some damage to boot.

    I have 15 warhounds now. just to make things difficult. they can be used for screening for all my important units.

    The knights are now a unit of 6 with no mark. they should still be pretty deadly so i think they will work fine.

    Again, tell me what you think, i really do appriciate all the advice.

    Brogan
    Brogan Ironbrow

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    The Shrubber sdefreit's Avatar
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    Well throwing a sorcerer on a chariot is a good idea. Very nice.

    As for your horsmen question, I know you can reform after your move to avoid charging the next turn, but if I understand what your saying correctly I dont think you can do that. Frenzy units and even normal units charge before normal movement. Plus now that I think of it fast cav or not a unit can never charge after reforming. I remember it saying in the rulebook that if you charge you are only allowed to wheel.

    Im gonna keep throwing some comments at you. First off you can put your MoS guy in with the horsemen. His steed is fast cav too so you wont bog down that units movement. Here is another idea. Put the slaneesh scroll caddy in the chariot and put the Tzeentch on a disk.

    Also where is your exalted going. Im scared of that knight unit having too big of a front to manuver.

    This list is looking nice though. Go play it and see how you like it.

  10. #9
    Mr. Sinister Dfred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brogan Ironbrow View Post
    Can the marauder horsman end a move facing away from a unit, and then reform AND charge on the next turn? The rules seem to indicate this is the way they work, but i want to be sure before i go to the table with them.
    I wish! That'd be cheesy awesome! Unfortunately ... you must declare charges first, prior to any other move, which means you would not be able to change your facing and charge in the same turn. Regardless, I'm almost positive you're not allowed to reform while charging with fast cav. You'd think I'd be 100% on that, considering I use Marauder Horsemen in every game I play. The way I play it, whatever formation the unit is in when I declare the charge, that's the formation they contact the enemy unit with. I haven't referenced the fast cav rules for ages, so I'm not totally confident. If I'm wrong, I'd love to hear it!
    The Blessed of the Four
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    Something wicked this way comes.

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    As to the fast cav, thats pretty much what i figured. Still, for the price of hte points, its worth it.

    I just found out that we are switching to 2000 points this week (sigh, you would think they would have anounced that at the last meeting) Any ideas what to do with another 500 points? I am considering a Giant (i have the model, and i am going to be substituting one of the marauder units and the dragon ogres as it is, i want to keep it to a minimum) that leaves some points for core/specials. maybe another knight unit. maybe another character. i dont know. i will have to think about it awhile.

    Brogan.
    Brogan Ironbrow

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