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2500pt Tourney List- tear it to pieces
Hey, just posting an army list i was hoping to run in states, i was planning to go a fluffy army of Tzeentch but when i entered an earlier "warm up tourney" i lost on comp (second lowest despite having several "useless" options to have a theme to my army) so i decided to make my army as broken as possible! Tear this list up!
Lord SpikyDeath: Chaos Lord, Barbed Steed, Mark of Tzeentch, Chaos Runesword, Talisman of Presevation, favour of the gods, shield, Sporific musk. General.
Shh'narr: Sorcerer, Level 2, mark of Tzeentch, Disk of Tzeentch, enchanted shield, blood of Tzeentch, talisman of Protection
Narr'shh: Sorcerer, Level 2, mark of Tzeentch, Disk of Tzeentch, Charmed shield, Infernal puppet, Opal Amulet
Severin: Exalted Hero, BSB, Helm of many eyes, Collar of Khorne, Great Weapon, Mark of Tzeentch
Warriors: 15, musician and Standard, Mark of Tzeentch, shields
Warriors: 15, musician and Standard, Mark of Tzeentch, shields
Warriors: 15, musician and Standard, Mark of khorne, Halberds, Razor Standard
Marauders:40, mark of Khorne, Musician and standard, Great Weaons
Lord SpikyDeaths Spiky Death: knights, 8, Mark of Nurgle, Banner of Rage, Standard and Musician
Possibility: Dropping the Marauders to 2 units of 20, dropping a warrior for the extra points needed
Quick note: I am not running stream on my lord and Third eye on my Blood Sorc as i ran out of points and shaved them off. Now, Go nuts people!
Last edited by tanfew; May 29th, 2011 at 01:35. Reason: I forgot the GW on the 'Rauders
Try two units of 18 warriors 3 units of 30 marauders and drop a couple of knights.
The only real thing I think you should change is opal amulet to talisman of protection, 5+ ward all the time is better than 3+ ward one time.
this army would get destroyed in a tournament sorry
1st of all i really think you need a level 4 sorcerer with shadows however that is up to you and if you prefer the chaos lord then ok but i wld give him the axe of khorne instead as it is better
then your level 2 sorcerers
give 1 of them the 3rd eye of tzeentch
your warriors are far too small and S4 is just not killy enough
they will just get steam rolled
drop 1 unit and make the at least 21 strong and dont give them mark of khorne as its too easy to flank them
to show you how easy it is:
you charge a unit of dogs which hold, you win combat and overrun into another unit
he then moves his unit to the flank of them
you win combat and over run
he then flanks you
again dont make them frenzied
also no warshrine?
this is a very fluffy army but it wont win a tournament however
i think you are thinking too much in 7th ed where small units is what u needed
now its big units and strong magic
As for not making units frenzied, I again disagree. There are times where you do want to be able to restrain and such, but getting another five or six attacks out of a unit of Knights can make a world of difference, particularly if you are fighting high SCR. Also, you are implying that he is hobbling himself by not using a Warshrine; yes the Warshrine is good, but I see it as more of a fluffy option than anything in his list. I almost never use one and I do just fine. Then again, I run duelling Hell Cannons.
Also, how do you figure that the Ax of Khorne is better than the Rune Sword? Yes, Killing Blow can be a godsend, but so can weapon skill 9, thus making even WS 4 opponents hit on 5s. Plus, the Rune Sword gives an extra attack. This is not to say that the Ax of Khorne isn't a great weapon, it is, but it is simply different from the Rune Sword, not better.
I do somewhat agree about the level 4 sorcerer, they are great. The bonuses to cast and dispel are awesome and have saved my butt a few times. That being said, two highly mobile casters helps with target saturation and forcing the opponent to make decisions, thus giving him more options to make a bad decision.
@tanfew : I think your list looks pretty good and does not require drastic changes. I think that changing the Mark on the Marauders from Khorne to Slannesh could help you so that you don't lose a combat and then subsequently have to take fear tests. One thing you may want to include, although you would have to juggle points to do so, is to include the Book of Secrets on your Chaos Lord so you can take Miasma. I did something similar with a Hero and a unit of Nurgle Knights. With Miasma you will make almost anyone hit you on 5s in combat and, if you get it off in time and on the right unit, save you from stand and shoot reactions, keep an enemy from fleeing, etc. I pulled that unit on a friend who plays Bretonians, and he was shocked at how ineffective his charge was on me.
But on the whole, I think it is a pretty strong list. It's certainly not broken, but neither will it get steamrolled.
with the mark of khorne they HAVE to over run or pursue. the restrain thing isnt too bad but against some1 who knows what they are doing they they will just have those knights chasing warhounds, or dire wolves all day until they decide they are in a position to flank charge them
on marauders its not too bad as they are cheap and kind of disposable and will have ranks to make them steadfast but on knights or warriors i wld never run them with khorne in a tournament
in a friendly game then fine and yea those extra attacks from the knights are useful but not when they are chasing dogs for 6 turns
I find it funny that people always complain about the bait aspect of frenzy, and forget that you do the same thing to control it. Due to new rules, I'd prolly screen my frenzied unit with 10 hounds. A little bit more expensive, but the timing for releasing a frenzied unit is a little slower than most think. If they do present you with a good opportunity we can still split charge.
You're spending points on a lot of stuff that looks really cool on paper, but isn't really necessary. For example- the Discs. I'm not sure what you're going for with that. Are you going to send your Wizards out to pull double-duty as Hunters? They'll get targeted by spells and shot to pieces before they get halfway there. Running them inside your units lets you get a great LOS! save, saves points, and lets them worry more about casting than about hiding from enemy casters and gunners.
I also disagree with not fielding Frenzied units. You do know that in 8th, you can take a LD check to keep from charging with a Frenzied regiment. Being Warriors, we tend to do quite well with these. Yes, it takes skill to know where you might end up, and make sure that you're not being baited or trapped into a bad charge, but that's true of any unit, Frenzied or not. I run a pair of Frenzied units in my list as well, and it's rare that they find themselves run about the board anymore.
Not so sure about the Warshrine. I have one in my list, but they're just massive tar-pits. They don't really get a lot of attacks, they can boost a unit, but half the time I only manage to pick up worthless MR or LD boosts when I'm hoping for Strength or Attacks. He has plenty of Tarpits in the army already, in his Tzeentchians and the Marauders. If anything, he needs stuff that can dish out damage.
I'd get a Hellcannon if anything. It does all the same things as a Warshrine (T6, 4+ Armor, 5+ ward from the crew) it just does them better with the S5 attacks, Unbreakable, Thunderstomp, and Terror.
Tanfew- if you could manage to free up points for a Warshrine, I would look at making one of those Tzeentch units into Khorne Halberdiers. You can use the Tzeentchians and the Shrine to guard your flanks or pin an enemy, while your Halberds take names.
Not sure where you're suggesting to change the Marauders over to Slaanesh though. Fear isn't that big a deal anymore. Tzeentch would keep them in the fight if they had Shields, or Khorne would help them be the kind of grinder-unit that you suggested for using against Hellpits and the likes.
KEEP THE BOOK OFF YOUR GENERAL! The 1D6+1 for Miscasts results means that you have a 25% chance of getting yanked off the table, and a 100% chance of taking a S10 hit to the face and everyone around you. I run mine on my BSB (I know- not much better to lose your BSB, but he's less pricey at least). Miasma is definitely a crazy awesome spell though, for all the reasons you've given. I'd just run one of the Sorcs with Shadows instead of marking him Tzeentch.
Cool guys cheers for the input i'll definitely have to look at getting it fixed up a bit now xD.
Now, a few more notes: I am running the Collar on the BSB for a 5++ ward save (cause of Tzeentch) and the helm with a Halberd (Str 6) is just rude. I run him in the Khornate unit and use them as an anchor for the two Tzeentchians to deny flank charges with.
The Knights are currently 5x2 with the lord on a Large base (which the Tourney organiser hasn't talked to me about yet so i dunno if i can actually do that for a normal cav model but yeah) and are backed up by the two tzeentch sorcs who float around behind them for the (albeit lower) LOS! roll (as they are warbeasts which count as cav) and i found with them i only need to survive a single cannon ball before they've either rushed out and hunted the Warmachines or have casted enough to get their Points back (at which point they are SD flank chargers or Points denial, becuase they are so fast)
I realllllly want to get the Hellcannon into this army but i just can't seem to get it to work unless i was to drop the knights down to 5 (to have a seven facing) and drop some of the extra upgrades AKA sporific and favour. But then, i'm losing a lot for a single (very scary) stone thrower/ MC
The Marauders have GW, i totally forgot to write it down xD my bad.
I can't take the Tally of Protection on my BSB as it is already on one of my Sorcs (hence why he has the collar instead)
I found, with Warriors, i really needed that LD 9 for my army a lot, and having a sorc lord just doesn't get there IMO.
Unfortunately with the marauders the COmmand is already modelled so I would prefer to keep them (standard/Muso is still nice) But i probably could keep them if they are that useless :/
just a quick thought
drop favor of gods for enchanted shield? it saves 10 points
Favour is only 5 pts and i already have an enchanted shield in the army xD cheers for the input though