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Roughly a 1k game vs the Beasties of our beloved gods.
Sorcerer lvl 2 - Fire, spell familiar.
Exalted MoT, BSB
12 warriors - MoS, shields - Sorcerer goes here. Full command.
12 warriors - MoT, shields - BSB goes here. Musician
2 units of 5 dogs.
That brings me to roughly 802 pts
Other than the familiar I haven't added items or gifts. I'm just short of a unit of knights though ...
I'm thinking of another block of no frills warriors with shields, just because at this level they should be decent enough to hold their own. That woudl bring me roughly to 994. I could of course switch out the shields for halbs and use them to be my killy unit while my other two units of warriors tarpit the beasties.
Since I'm new to WoC still and have never faced the beasties I was looking for opinions on my list.
I know he runs blocks of gors and ungors with one unit of bestigors. I expect him to use magic more than I am used to, he's not a minotaur guy at all.
First thing to note: the list is illegal. You have more than 25% of your points on heroes.
I think the thing to do to rectify this in a game this size is to have a single character and forego a BSB.
I'd go with: Exalted, MoT, Halberd, Book of Secrets (Fire), Spell Familiar, Charmed Shield [169 points] or some variety thereof.
Yes this has consequences on a miscast, but deal with it. If you want a combat character and a wizard it's the only way. If not then just go with the wizard, magic is a game changer.
The problem with chaos is that our units are quite expensive and we need a certain critical mass to get the momentum going. We struggle in smaller games as it is, but you will struggle even more if you plough too many points into characters and chaff units.
In terms of units:
2 x 5 dogs: meh, if you like. They're ok for screening and delaying deployment but you have nothing worth protecting at the moment.
Scyla: I'm not a fan to be honest, I don't pick him in a 3k list so I certainly wouldn't invest 10% of my list in this guy. He's unreliable and weakly protected. I guess there are ways to exploit his hero's fate ability, but in a game this size he's probably not worth it.
CWs: Always a solid selection. How you kit them out is personal choice really. I don't know much about Beasts of Chaos, if they don't wear much armour and are only toughness 3 then HW and shield is fine, go MoT. If they're big on armour or have higher toughness then you probably need halberds. I'm not a fan of MoS, I'd take MoK every day of the week for the same benefit + extra killiness. I don't think being baited is such a big deal, and in this size game he won't have much to bait with anyhow. You just need to get out there and beat things up ASAP - MoK delivers.
My choice would be to put a slab of marauders in there. They're dirt cheap, expendable and hit damn hard. 30 marauders w. GW, MoK, Std, Mus = 192 points. I would put this in instead of Scyla and your illegal second character.
With the spare points I would fill out the two CW units with a few more bodies (15ish) and add something else threatening. Perhaps a Chariot?
You can take the mark off the BSB and have enough points for a unit of knights. Making the Scyla a regular spawn would help free up some points too. Then you can get a unit of knights and maybe talisman of preservation for your exalted.
I don't know how I feel about the BSB at such small point levels, but I've never played a 1k game. I want to suggest to drop him, and add a block of marauders. I do know, I love my BSB re-rolls.
/smacks self on the head.First thing to note: the list is illegal. You have more than 25% of your points on heroes.
Color me embarrassed, my math was so bad it's sickening.Very fair but I love the fluff, I get stuck on fluff over cost/value, after all I'm only playing friendly games.Scyla: I'm not a fan to be honestI just love the idea of having angry monster dogs on my side. Again it's a fluff thing. Plus I'm obsessed with the idea of screening units.x 5 dogs: meh, if you like. They're ok for screening and delaying deployment but you have nothing worth protecting at the moment.Maybe you're right, I'm just not sure about Marauders. We have the warriors and I just feel like the Marauders are such a waste of space.Originally Posted by cheerio
Thanks for the responses so far. I'm going to re-think the list.
well, in mind you want to keep the fluff stuff
i would take:
sorcerer lvl 2 fire
armor of zhrakk, spell fam, 6+ws and charmed shield
12 warriors of tzeentch (sorcerer in here)
flame banner (or something, don't have the book with me)
personaly, i wouldn't take scyla, maybe one time just for fun
actually, just thinking you could drop the chariot, and take 2 spawns and give them MoT
(if you can find 10 more points somewhere give it MoS for ASF)
I have found Marauders to be invaluable when facing beast men specifically because of Bestigors. They are toughness 4, so warriors don't always kill them very fast, and at strength 4 and great weapons they really mess up our armor saves. My answer? Some dirt cheap Marauders. It doesn't matter what armor modifiers he has because I run mine without, and because I run mine with Great Weapons, they have the strength to mess him up. So what if he butchers them; they exists to die and hopefully bring something down with them.
If he is going magic heavy, there are some things to watch out for. He is probably going to take the Lore of Beasts which some nasty buffs. What you really need to. Watch out for, however, is Transformation of Khadon, which is stupid good at low points levels. To help deal with sorcerers like this you may want to invest in some kind of Cruise Missile, probably Horsemen or Knights, and charge in there and allocate all attacks possible to him. Add in something to help prevent him from getting the spell off in the first place, like a Dispel Scroll, then you should be peachy.
@Krull : Your list is illegal. Too many points on magic items and you have two items of armour (Bronze armour, charmed shield).
I agree with Papa Wheely. Marauders are great!
Half of list selection is realising the purpose of the choices you're taking. The purpose of Marauders is to be cheap and expendable. Don't waste points on armour, shields, ward saves etc. Just tool them up and point them at the enemy. For ~6 points a model you can hit twice per turn at S5 WS4, which pretty much makes them one of the best value for points infantry in the game. Go for a large unit so they survive the casualties while crossing the battlefield. When you get to the other side you will have ranks in abundance and hit damn hard!
dam right, but it's right on points though
but maybe go for: dispell scroll, charmed shield, and the 6+ ws talisman (25+5+15)
and true about the marauders, they die fast, but are expendable, and can take out strong expensive troops of the opponents with them..!!
More to think about ...I have found Marauders to be invaluable when facing beast men specifically because of Bestigors. They are toughness 4, so warriors don't always kill them very fast, and at strength 4 and great weapons they really mess up our armor saves. My answer? Some dirt cheap Marauders.
Thanks for all the replies so far, I'm pretty sure I'll be going with warriors, marauders, a lvl 2 sorcerer - I was set on fire but now I'm not sure. I'll crank out the list later tonight and see what you guys think about it.
Just as updated ...Holy brutality Batman! The Bestigors ripped through my warriors, be they sword/board MoT or halb wielding banner of ragers. It's not that the latter didn't take down a good chunk of Bestigors but they wound you so easily! I'm going to run a few proxy games against the Beasties, I'll sub some warriors and orcs as Marauders with GW to see how they work out against Bestigors for me.I have found Marauders to be invaluable when facing beast men specifically because of Bestigors.
I had gone into the game thinking I could tarpit the Bestigors with my MoT warriors, wipe out his gor and ungors on the flanks and then flank the bestigors ... pff, round one of combat and his bestigors absolutely rolled my warriors, routed them and killed my general. In the words of the immortal Private Hudson "Game over man, game over!"
I will drink your milk shake! I will drink it up!
I just bought my wife a mini-van, the gods of Chaos have nothing on reality.