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Unnamed2000 Pts - Chaos Army
1 Chaos Lord @ 442 Pts
Mark of Tzeentch; General; Lore of Tzeentch; Shield; Barding
Blade of Blood
Armour of Damnation
1 Chaos Steed
1 * Aspiring Chaos Champion @ 174 Pts
Mark of Tzeentch; Lore of Tzeentch; 2ndWeapon; Chaos Armour
Sword of Might
1 Wargor @ 180 Pts
Mark of Tzeentch; Lore of Tzeentch
14 Chaos Warriors of Tzeentch @ 275 Pts
Mark of Tzeentch; Heavy Armour; Shield; Standard; Musician
15 Chaos Warriors of Tzeentch @ 316 Pts
Mark of Tzeentch; 2ndWeapon; Heavy Armour; Standard
20 Marauders @ 120 Pts
20 Marauders @ 120 Pts
4 Chaos Knights of Tzeentch @ 172 Pts
Mark of Tzeentch; Barding; Heavy Armour; Shield; Standard
5 Chaos Warhounds @ 30 Pts
5 Chaos Warhounds @ 30 Pts
9 Beast Herd (Gors) @ 140 Pts
Unruly; 2ndWeapon; Standard
Casting Pool: 13
Dispel Pool: 6
Models in Army: 108
Total Army Cost: 1999
This is my first attempt at a Choas List rip it up. I plan to use the hounds to screen the knights/hit flanks/ whatever. The marauders and beast herd to screen the warriors. The Wargor runs with the beast herd to give them a punch if they make it to combat.
This is a fine choice for a Lord, I expect he'll be charging around with the knights. Although I'm sure you'd like to get him stuck into combat quickly (which is no bad thing), you shouldn't forget that by doing this, your infantry will be deprived of being able to use his excellent Leadership. You have to weigh up if this is an ability you're willing to lose.Originally Posted by ezekiel09
The Blade of Blood wouldn't be my first choice of weapon for a Tzeentch Lord, I would more than likely go for something cheap like the Sword of Might or Sword of Battle, so I can also give him the Staff of Change! This wonderful item is pretty much mandatory for Lords of Tzeentch as it maximises their magical ability which kind of justifies their cripplingly high points cost. You can find the points for this by ditching the Steed and the Armour of Damnation. Finally, swap the mundane shield for the Enchanted Shield.
You also don't need to tell us that he will be using the Lore of Tzeentch, if he's got the Mark of Tzeentch it's pretty obvious already!Again, a good hero choice, but you've made an error in his equipment, I'm almost certain that when equipped with a magic weapon, you can't also use an additional hand weapon. You have to use a shield or nothing at all (I think, others may clarify this).Originally Posted by ezekiel09Another decent choice, but once more, I dislike the weapon. A spell familiar (to make best use of his 360 arc of sight and good maneuverability) plus either a shield or two hand weapons might be better.Originally Posted by ezekiel09Well done for not taking units of 12 warriors as so many players seem to do, but 14 and 15 are barely enough, although you might get away with it. In my experience, chaos warriors do not win by causing casualties, they win by being so tough the enemy can't kill any of them, and having ranks, banners and a Hero to cause the casualties for them. For this reason, the second unit should also have hand weapons and shields, a 5+ heavy armour save won't protect them much and they'll likely die frighteningly quickly (especially since there aren't many to start with!)Originally Posted by ezekiel09Nice big units of marauders, excellent! But Flails!? :blink: Where's their armour and shields, and why haven't they got a full command group?! Marauders without armour will drop like flies, you'll be lucky if any of them survive the game! I regularly use a unit of 25 marauders with light armour, hand weapons, shields and full command (sometimes led by a Hero) and the enemy almost always underestimates them, then gets a beating when they engage (and I usually have at least half a unit left by the end, often more).Originally Posted by ezekiel09Good support units, you have the right idea for the uses of your Warhounds, but obviously don't expect miracles from them. The Beast herd is best used in supporting your infantry blocks by flank charging enemies already engaged by the warriors/marauders. I'm not sure why you've listed Unruly as part of their equipment though, as it's a special rule that all beast herds have... :huh:Originally Posted by ezekiel09
Also, if you're planning on having a Wargor lead the herd, you don't need a Foe-Render as well, you'd be better off including a Banner and Musician to improve their combat resolution and rally tests respectively.
A word about your knights, you should consider them as a support unit just like the others here. Don't expect a tiny unit knights to be able to break a fully ranked unit of solid infantry on the charge. It probably won't happen, which will leave your very expensive knights up diarrhoea creek without a paddle. They'll also likely come under heavy incoming fire and possibly lost a model or two before they even reach the enemy. However, if you use them to charge down the flanks, they can avoid most of the enemy firepower, sweep away enemy scouts and flanking units and crash into the flanks of enemy infantry blocks as your foot troops hit the front.
Hope my experiences are of use to you
Last edited by Tzeentch Lord; May 22nd, 2006 at 16:50.
"Peace, through superior firepower."
Yeah the unruly listing came from Army Builder, I just copied and pasted the list from there.
I wasn't sure about the 2nd hand weapon on the foot champion, but I will take it out.
The wargor has that weapon as I have model with a Great Weapon already, but hey I have not bought much if anything of the army yet, still working on painting what I have first.
Thanks for the opinions and suggestions.
I agree with much of Tzeentch Lords' advice.
The Staff of Change is manditory in my opinion. It really increases your magic effectiveness, not to mention the fact that you will *rarely* ever miscast with it. This allows you to be throwing an extra dice or two at those important spells.
The main issue I see with your list is it's vulnerability to panic. I would recommend putting your lord on a disc instead of a horse so that he can be where he needs to be to keep order.
A unit of 4 knights is more of a support unit, not a direct hitter. They shouldn't have a standard, as they can lose combat very quickly and give your opponent free VPs.
Your warrior units are pretty good. I think Tzeentch Lord touched on basically everything you need to know about them. Slaanesh can get away with fielding units of 10 without fear of panic, but Tzeentch needs to have some numbers to assure that you don't bail.
Your marauder units might need a bit of work. I'd actually suggest breaking them into 3 units. One large unit of 20-25 with armor/shields and full command, and then 2 units of 10 with flails and a musician. The small units are wonderful charge-baiters, and can be used both to draw the enemy forward, and to hit flanks. The large unit can provide great static combat resolution.
I dislike the wargor, as he is alot more points which could be better spent elsewhere. In my opinion your other two casters should provide plenty of magic.
A unit of 5 furies is a great choice in any chaos army. You've also skipped out on one of the biggest advantages we have. Core chariots! Our chariots are wonderfully strong, and provide plenty of oomph on the charge. I recommend at lest 1, but preferably 2.
The Hierarchy Chaotica: Kinky Sex > Change > Disease > Blood
98% of the population actually believes these stupid statistics. If you're part of the 2% of humanity with a brain, put this in your profile.
Furies?! :huh: Cripes! :blink: I've just thought of something else you've completely forgotten about! Screamers! You have a large Tzeentch army without any Screamers! No Tzeentch horde is complete without at least a minimal unit of these superb flyers. Easily superior to Furies (and twice the price of course), they can solve so many of your problems. Namely artillery and enemy wizards. But they can also do so much more, they march block, they can slash attack when they have nothing else to do, they can hit enemy units in the flank and rear that you have already engaged with your infantry, etc, etc.
You should definately free up about 165 points for a unit of 5 of these flying gems!
Don't know about the Disc idea though, personally I'd much prefer to have my Lord leading a big unit of warriors or marauders, which is not only cheaper, but also much safer. If you take a Disc for him to ride, then the Golden Eye of Tzeentch for the 3+ Ward vs shooting is also pretty much mandatory to ensure his safety against small arms, Bolts, cannonballs and the like. Whereas if he's in a unit of infantry, he gets a superior 2+ "Look Out Sir!" save against the same thing, and it's free! (and he's also completely immune to small arms fire).
Finally, don't concern yourself by the fact that the Wargor model has a great weapon. You can still arm him with whatever you like. Just remember to let your opponent know that he has something other than the great weapon before the game starts.
"Peace, through superior firepower."