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Ok, I know a manager from the local GW shop, and he recently went on a trip to a GW presentation about the HOC update.
Here is what is changing for sure:
New plastic lord box mounted and on foot, with different daemonic mounts (daemonic mounts will be horses, not juggers or beasts of slaanesh worms or discs anymore, which sucks, but hey you can still use the midels as proxies for horse mounts)
Warrior box remains the same (cheaper in points)
Maurauder box remains the same
new chaos hounds which looked very warped by chaos (10 plastic in a box)
rumored cultists are just that: a rumor. I was told flat out they wont be making cultists.
New maurader horseman (5 plastic in a box, supposed to look way better than old ones)
New Chais knights (5 plastic in box, old puter knights now in plastic, and totally new plastic horses, big evil horned ones!) (cheaper in points)
hellcannon is now a normal army choice, still takes 2 rare slots...giant and spawns as well.
Chosen point cost is down as well, and now you can mix and match marks all you want, which means you can have a tzeentch general leading khorne troops with slaanesh spawns and nurgle chariots...cool eh?
Also, Tzeentch champions dont have to be magic users anymore, and sorcs can be marked tzeentch.
MoN is now 20 points not 50
MoT = 10 points and gives a 6+ ward save (this is brutal I know)
MoS = Same
MoK = Frenzy and magic resistance 1
Undivided is going to be abolished (ouch)
Oh yeah, NO DEMONS OR BEASTS...PERIOD!
(what a kick in th n**ts)
there will be no "special rule" for chaos like the high elves (asf) and dark elves (hatred for all). It was decided that lower point cost and allowing the mixing of marks was enough to make the army strong enough for 7th edition.
All I have to say is im lucky i chose a khorne theme and not tzeentch...which has been completely neutered. So far, the list has been cut into pieces, no new rules to help, no new models, and token point reductions. I am personally going to use the HoC book till november...because this list has way too many cons in it and makes a semi competitive list and makes it way worse. (this list againstmore competitive armiess like empire and lizardmen is in for an a** kicking)
I personally wont buy the new models as they are coming out in november and i want my army done by august. but ill plan my army around the new mixed marks/ lowewr point cost model. Check the army list section to see my proposed army list. GW better make an EXCELLENT army book in november...if Chaos becomes an inflexible army like ogre kingdoms ill leave the hobby and focus on something else....GW has screwed over enough gamers in the past and i refuse to be one of them again.
Heres what id like to see in november:
a replacement for furies in the warmachine hunting role
a warmachine in the special slot
warriors going to 10 points or staying 12 and getting a movement boost
new units for core andd special to make the now bare bones list more interesting and to prevent every chaos mortals army from looking the same ( unbreakable infantry, or maybe a reliable shooting unit would be nice)
Fix the TZeentch mark...thats just really unfair to tzeentch players...their armies are badly mauled by this list.
Lots of new items and spells are needed
An option to use beasts or Demons as special opr even rare would be appreciated ( I wanted bloodcrushers as a rare in my khorne mortals army personally)
I hope I sound dissapoionted because i am atm. I finally came back to this hooby after 10 years wanting to play chaos, i start collecting and painting and this pathetic temp list comes out. I feel like GW gas just told me to go F*&@ myself.
Thank you, Ninja
Last edited by Ultimo Ninja; May 12th, 2008 at 00:59.
The WD temp. list is posted up in the rumors on Warseer.com
I am so disappointed by the list that I'm hanging them up till November with the hopes of new troop types. The roster is so bland it hurts. IMO GW should be ****ing ashamed of this temp listing. The complete circumcision of beasts and daemons turns Mortal Chaos into a gun line's 'shooting jelly fish in a barrel' and wastes people's time and money spent on those couple units that you can no longer field.
With mounted marauders as special you're hard pressed to take more then 1 unit since they are competing with knight and chariot slots.
You get 2 core choices (hounds don't count as min.) and the giant/spawns are identical in roll.
Onto the marks of the gods:
NO MORE UNDIVIDED
Khorne only gives frenzy to units. 1MR to chars. (Frenzy officially applied to mount, that's good)
Tzeench..... WOW.... 6+ Ward save...that's it, no dice. Freaking joke.
They pretty much just hacked up the magic item list without adding much at all to it, only taking away. Get this... mundane item costs for characters: GW 20pts, Halb 15pts, shield 15 pts ... lol the Enchanted Shield costs 10pts. There is no magic lore lists in there so who knows what that means for mark specific lores.... if there are any anymore for mortal.
This better be a skeleton list of what is to come.
Hmm, to the first post, just because its a GW manager, doesnt mean its definite. Saying that, my local Manager is usually pretty good on things, so possibly.. but dont take it all as definite.
To the second post, interesting... You sure about those item costs? not even GW are that stupid... surely... hmm... OK...
Sorry Phoenix, but it's pretty much definate. Many people have held the list and said the same things.
I don't know what on earth people were expecting out of this list, but I like it, and I'm probably the only one. Nearly all models are cheaper,as are the marks, and the Hellcannon is now 100% legal.
This is not much of an idication about the book in Novemebr, expect that be a little different. That's where we will see Chaos magic lores, more magic items and perhas the rumoured Cultists. All this list is, is a good indication of where you should start playing your core/special/rare for the next book.
Shame Daemons and Beasts have been taken out, but that's the way Chaos is going, and I accept it. Instead of one uber army, with each seperate army not being all that viable, once the mortals and beasts get done, we'll see 3 seperate, but awesome armies, each one competetive. AFter all, had they not split up, then the Current Daemon book wouldn't exist in it's current glory. If mixing was allowed, it would be a lot more toned down...
I'm still pumped. I may now have to look into converting my own hell cannon, throwing in Daemon Prince, dunno.
Last edited by timk1111; May 9th, 2008 at 23:54.
I play mono Slaanesh, with about a third daemons, a third beasts, and a third mortals. Personally, I'm a lot more worried about the removal of daemons and beasts from the list, than anything minor like shuffling around point costs. The ability to mix units from the three lists in a single army is something intrinsic to the composition of most Chaos lists, and the vast majority of players I've met seem to do this. By removing this essential option, it rips several entire units out of most armies. Whilst revisions and rereleases are expected every few years, I don't think simply splitting up player's lists into thirds, leaving many of us with lists that won't be playable without buying a good proportion of our armies all over again, is a good thing.
Last edited by Sophia; May 10th, 2008 at 10:07. Reason: typos whut
Drag queen of LO... HAETRS GONNA HAET!
Savlar (6k), Executioners (full company!), Farsight (500 points), Warriors of Chaos (6k), Dark Elves Cult Of Pleasure (4k), Nomads/Caledonians/ISS (infinity), Clan Wolf (BT)
Aw crappers (sorry for the language). The only real good thing about this is the plastic Chaos Lord, Knights, and Marauder Horsemen. I find it absurd to think that Mortal Chaos Characters should be costlier than before; let's hope the book is worth the wait whilst playing with the scrapheap that is this temporary list.
Wait so MoT no longer grants power dice? If so, then the magic is getting seriously nerfed.
Its really those Buddhists we have to watch out for.
Good spells are not much use if you dont have dice to cast them. Remember Horrors count as a wizard now (although their spells are decided by their unit size)
I presume that while Tzeentch champions dont HAVE to be magic users that they can if you pay the points for it?
The name refers to facial hair, not playing style.Originally Posted by A news vendor's stand, London, June 1940