Welcome to Librarium Online!
Ok I've been reading up on the "Our list sucks" section and want to voice a combination that I think is very strong for heavy magic that I do not see much. This is not my original idea but I want to throw it out publically because I dont see it in many lists. This setup was advised to me by Lord Borak so I will credit him for giving me the setup.
-Skull of Kataan
-Rod of Torment
-BoS and Power Familiar
I have looked at this setup and think it is extremely strong. Its 10 PD and a bound spell that can do SO many things for our list. These 3 guys are in my opinion a stronger option to a normal Level 4 Gateway blaster and Nurgle mage. This setup throws out 5 magic missiles a turn (3 flickering fires, Rod of Torment and either fireball or pyroblast) On top of that I love the treason spell because it can cut a large chunk out of a GW or halberd wielding unit pretty easily.
I just love this setup because the big Gateway caster is mostly used to try and destroy an entire unit. This is great but does it really complement the rest of our army? Our army is VERY strong at combat. We are heavyily armored and deadly as heck. But we can still lose combat via outnumbering and flanking. We are also easy to outmanuever and march block. (Im a fan of foot soldiers so cav army people please dont tell me to go full cav to fix this. Its just my personal preferance.)
This setup is great to get rid of these disadvantages. Wardogs, Fast Cav and flyers flank us and march block us. These missile attacks can easily eliminate those low number low armor units. Helps make our units still march and avoid losing combat to flanks. The other thing is we rely on kills not ranks. A bad round of combat rolls and we lose to static resolution. This caster setup can Spew missiles and strip a rank or two off of many units all over the board. The ability to weaken units so our troops can clean up the remainder is much stronger strategy imo than trying to overpower and gateway single units to peices.
This setup is also very reliable. They throw out ALOT of spells and each one gets +2 casting. This makes dispelling really rough. Many of those one dice Flickering fires are gonna need 2 DD to dispel and I am fine with the enemy doing that since DD are not in high quantity. Oh and complaining about no flyers to kill cannon crews. Fly, PewPew and cannon crew is gone with these guys.
I just see this as being strong for its versatility, its difficulty to defend since it cant be taken care of with scrolls effectively, and the lack of miscasts which eliminates friendly fire and ending your magic phase early. You can even do massive damage on a more consistent basis if you want that than Gateway if you just focus fire.
And my last point is that it is a solid way to defend from magic. Sure only 5DD but with 3 Level 2s, you have a high chance of getting pandemonium on one of those guys. End your magic phase with using the pandemonium mage's non-flickering fire dice plus a pool dice and make the enemy's magic phase that much harder. Hes either gotta use 3 dice to get rid of it or hes gonna be shaking every time he picks up more than two dice to cast a spell.
Well sorry for the long post and thanks for those who read it all. I just feel very strong about this setup because I feel it complements our army and helps with many of our disadvantages. Give me your opinions, input and criticizms
I like this build a lot actually. It's 11 PD if I'm counting right, with +2 casting. I'm not a huge fan of single guys without protective items, as shooting and enemy magic can very quickly make single characters have a very bad day. (Also why I'm not a fan of the flying BSB ) But with some good positioning and terrain usage, you could keep them around long enough to do some real damage. 3 Flickering Fires alone is nasty, and looking for 2s on one die to cast it is even nastier.
Also, just because they are on discs doesn't mean they can't join units. If they start to get cornered or end up in a bad spot, keep some infantry handy within 20 inches and fly them into their ranks. Won't do much against melee, but will help them against magic/shooting.
A roll of a 2 is a failure, no matter what. You need at least a 3 or more unmodified casting value.
Flying characters can't join units, even other flyers.
That said, I like your build a lot. And, yes, Treason is awesome. For that reason, I would try to fit a spell familiar in there, to have more chances of getting it, or pandemonium.
Last edited by Coorran; April 7th, 2009 at 20:48.
"How do you stop a Chaos Knight from charging? No seriously, HELP!" André le Bouffon, jester of the Bretonnian court - last words.
@ the 3 casters:
I love it! I just changed my fast list to fit these guys in.
Ive heard the concept before normally with 1 lord.
check out my new list here (Super fast pure dmg list. (no DP :O ))
@Brocksamson sorry man, flyers can only join flying units, a thing we don't have.
I'm not sure you need the discs though. Why not put them on a barded horse and run them with some chaos knights? 1turn and they are in range of pretty much all the enemies on the table. You could even take the magic missile banner for extra punch. I don't think you even need the skull of katarn. Zap everyone in the first 3 turns and then charge with your chaos knights after that.
Don't get me wrong, the discs are great, but barded horse gives them a 2+ and then you can split out before they get into combat.
How about putting them on foot in a chaos warriors unit with Banner of Wrath.
Sit back and enjoy the firework...
I must say that i love the idea! i've always wanted to go for a magic heavy footslogging army, magic is so much fun in fantasy...it can make you do amazing things, or it can totally blow up in your face!
but this is just what i was looking for, i have a sorcerer on a disk in my 1k list and i'm very pleased with his performence for now ( treason of tzeentch is even more of a slap in the face of your opponent if you let him roll the dice "mehehe nice rollin, YOU just killed half YOUR unit of greatswords!") but 3 sorcerers on disks! that is just....scary. even without gateway ( which i have never managed to cast yet but good luck with a lvl 2 sorcerer anyway) the lore of tzeentch is very powerfull and can hurt like hell!
I'm totally going to give this a try soon. what's the total amount of points for the 3 of them? Don't have my armybook here right now
hehe...units slaughtering themselfs...funny...
Well for mounting these little dudes you can do whatever and it should work well. Barded horses work well. They are roughly the same points but you get +1 save at a cost of ignoring moving over terrain and an extra 6 inches of movement. Either will work but I think disks work great for just giving an added threat of my magic being all over the table. This turn I am over here shooting down your fast cav and the next I can be in the back corner flaming up your cannon crew. There will be some battles where the maneuverability is not needed but there will be some where it works greatly. Disks arent as well armored but allow you to place yourself out of harms way better. Plus MoT mages fluff wise should be on disks and I think they are cool
And for putting them in a knights unit I am not a fan of doing that with them. They can always leave the unit I guess but I just dont want to be assulting with them because they are in all reality 200 point knights.
Putting them on foot is another option. I personally dont like it because they can get caught up in combat easier and then the whole EotG thing will be fun to deal with. And also Flickering Fire is an 18 inch spell. You will be shooting at the second turn at the earliest. And you wont be able to pick your targets as much or get in range of the cannons in the back. Now mounting these guys on horses, disks or just a good pair of boots is up to the player. I think either can work well for different purposes, I just personally have to favor the movement of the disks.
@ Buckero0 again
Skull of Kataan is a nifty little item. 50 points and it give all 3 casters a total of +2 to cast. I didnt mention I plan on running these guys in a squad formation earlier. Is it worth it? It wont help casting flickering fire but it helps it from being dispelled. A cast of a 4 will turn to a 6. whos gonna throw 1 DD at that. and rolls of 5 or 6 arent even possible to dispel with 1 DD. Plus it helps with other spells. Fireball will cast on a 3+ instead of a 4+, Treason will cast on 7+ and pandemonium on 6+. And heck if spell generation goes corky and I dont get pandemonium or treason I will most likely try my luck at flinging some exalteds across the table. My thought is with the skull that I am going to be casting a lot of spells with one or two dice. Gateway is still out of reach with 3 PD even with +2 to cast but call to glory would be the only 3 PD cast. So over 90% of the time im casting with 1 or 2 PD. The extra plus one may seem overpriced for 50 points but it shows up on 3 casters for about 5 to 6 spells each turn.
With my setup for them on disks they cost a total of 625 points
Im debating giving one of them bloodcurdeling roar as well if I can empty out a few points. What yall think abou that?
Last edited by sdefreit; April 8th, 2009 at 05:53.
I used this to. The problem was, that you don't really have an answer to big things like dragons. Flickering fire won't bring him down AND has a range wich is to short. You will always have to get in range of the beast. For now i'll just stick with my DP.