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Hi fellow WoC fans, i have spent the last month trying to figure out which Warhammer army will suit my play style. Personally i believe that WoC is exactly what i am looking for.
The problem is that i just don’t have the time or the skills to assemble and paint an army. Therefore i am required to purchase the army and have it professionally painted at the same time. Sounds easy but it isn’t, what i need to know is what units i am going to need for a 2500 pt army so that i can get them all done at the same time.
So my question is what are the essential units and bits that i will need for the majority of match ups and then what other units am i going to need on the sideline to bring in for specific match ups?
I have been reading allot and have the army book etc, most of the advice is great i can see the value of many units and how generally they are used. Ultimately i am looking for opinions followed by sound reasoning of what i am going to need etc.
Also if anyone has any cool painting ideas and or color scheme images etc i am happy to look at them and might even get my army painted that way. When it is done i will post it up with full credit to those people who came up with the ideas....given i use them.
Thanks for reading
Why? What is your play-style? Warriors of Chaos can be a horde army; a small elite army; a cavalry army; a footslogger army; a character-oriented army; a character-lite army; a magic-heavy army; a magic-lite army; a monster army; a human army. Each individual unit can be configured to be a rock-hard immovable anvil or an unstoppable killing machine.
We need more information than you've given us.
I'm not going to take the time to tell you you haven't the time to assemble and paint an army, but I most certainly am going to tell you - knowing nothing about you except that you have enough limbs to write a post - that you have the skills to assemble and paint an army. It may not be Golden-Daemon winning, but then 99.9% of armies aren't. If you don't have any interest in painting an army, that's one thing; but don't make the mistake of looking at the pictures of models in the Army Book and thinking that's what your army has to look like - as I said, most armies don't, and it isn't expected.
That sounds pricey...!
See my first comment. There are as many different tactics for Warriors of Chaos as there are Warriors of Chaos players. You need to give us a bit more information about what you actually want to do!
Again, we need much more information from you.
Re: painting, oftentimes, you'll find that colour schemes are suggested simply by the Mark you give to a unit. There are some pretty standard painting schemes, which will generally involve red (Khorne); green (Nurgle); blue/yellow (Tzeentch); pink/purple (Slaanesh).
Last edited by el_don; August 6th, 2009 at 20:12.
If you could somehow proxy an army for a few games it'd do wonders for you. I could tell you all day that the flying banner of the gods/dragon ogre combo is nasty, but if you can't get it to work or it just isn't your style, I'd be asking you to buy models you won't use.
Same with slow v. fast. You could go a massive amount of warrior/chosen/marauders and slowly march across the field, or you can go horsemen and knights and get in your opponents face by turn 3. The options are endless in this deceptively customizable army.
Have you played any other type of game that you enjoyed that you might be able to tell us why?
Also, I hate painting and don't have the patience for it, so don't feel bad by not wanting to do it.
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Magic heavy armies and/or character anvil armies that role up the middle is what i currently like the idea of. However i don't want to get pigeon holed into one or two styles of play. I would like to get enough units so that i can try different things and adjust to what feels right for myself. Money isn’t the number one priority here and getting more units that i need is fine as i am not the type of person to settle for one style of play.
Units that i like:
Tank: lords or magic guys
Warriors: these guys are deceptively powerful. So much so, that they make Chosen arguably not worth taking. They're capable of standing against most anything that your opponent can throw at them; they have a potential 2+ armour save; they have WS5, they have potential S6, they have two base attacks. They're absolute close combat monsters.
Typically, you'd run these guys in units of 12 - that gives you a good-sized frontage to maximise your damage output in combat without costing you the world in points. There are any number of options for gearing them up, but the most common - and versatile - is a combination of Shield and Halberd. That gives you great solidity for taking a charge from any enemy foolish enough to try it, and the ability to make counter charges of your own and really hurt units.
Arguably there isn't much point in taking full command with these guys - taking a Champion just means you have to challenge with him, which you won't always want to do. A Musician and Standard Bearer can do wonders, though - especially given that the Standard Bearer can take a Magic Banner for the unit, making them even harder to break.
The choice of Marks on your units will help determine what you actually want them to do. However, generally speaking, you're going to want either Slaanesh or Khorne - and probably the former, unless you have some special aversion to it. Having a unit as powerful as Warriors refusing to go anywhere unless they actually die can make them incredibly difficult to shift.
A standard unit might look like this:12 WarriorsChosen: I don't have so much experience with Chosen; as I said above, the standard Warrior is hard enough that these guys are often just not worth the extra points. The same unit I listed for the Warriors would cost an extra 48 points - that's 8 Warhounds to you and me - and you get an extra point in WS and a random roll on the Eye of the Gods table for it. Not worth it, in my opinion, in an army which already lacks in numbers and units.
Mark of Slaanesh
However, the Chosen are quite remarkably hard as a unit and have all the same unit upgrade options as Warriors. With their free Eye of the Gods roll you can potentially get a unit of supreme power for your game - and the option of taking a Magic Item on the Champion might make him worth taking.
Chosen, however, do make very nice targets for anyone on the other side of the board armed with a bow/rifle/cannon. They're not very popular with anyone who's faced with the prospect of meeting them in combat. To that end, while you can give them Slaanesh/Khorne as per the Warriors, another option is to give them a combination of Mark of Tzeentch and the Blasted Standard, for a combined 4+ ward save against shooting attacks. That does leave them open to Fear/Terror causers, though, and anything else that causes Panic rolls. A compromise might be the Mark of Slaanesh and the Blasted Standard, which leaves them immune to Panic, Fear and Terror and still confers a 5+ ward save against shooting - which, on top of a 3+ armour save, might really be all you need.
A standard unit might look like this:12 ChosenKnights: what can I say? Take them. As many as you can get your hands on. In my opinion, these things are our best unit. Kitting them out isn't quite so contentious as our other units, and most people seem to have agreed on a common set-up.
Mark of Slaanesh
The Lances/Ensorcelled Weapons question raged for ages, until people realised that the Lances were a situational +1 strength that cost 5 points and removed the Magic Weapons. That's as opposed to, you know, actual [i]lances[/l] - Games Workshop shafted us there. Almost no-one these days will take Lances on their Knights. Most people I know who do justify it by saying "but they're Knights - they're supposed to have lances!"; meaning that it's a personal fluffy choice, rather than a tactical one.
Khorne is a bad idea on these guys, as they don't want to be led around by the nose. Unless, of course, you can shield them effectively using Hounds or another cheap unit (pssst! Use Hounds!). Slaanesh isn't so valuable, as they're already Fear-causers, which means they'll take a Fear check against Terror-causers, but nothing else. They also get the army-wide Panic reroll. If you're lacking points, it's an option, but I don't think it's optimal for Knights. That leaves Nurgle and Tzeentch. Personally, I feel that the question is situational. With Tzeentch, you know what you're getting - a +1 ward save. Nurgle can be more tricky to work out. Essentially, I feel that against some units, Nurgle is better than Tzeentch, but not against all of them. See one of the numerous Nurgle/Tzeentch threads to find out more.
As with almost all our units, unless you're putting a Character in the unit who needs protected (see: Sorcerers!), there's little call for Champions. They're just an enforced challenge, which often isn't any good to you. A Musician and Standard Bearer are options according to personal taste.
A common banner to put on these guys is the Banner of Rage - I mentioend earlier that Khorne often isn't used; this is another reason why. You can get all the benefits of the Marks of Nurgle or Tzeentch, and then add a Frenzy you can't lose. You must have shields for this unit, though.
In terms of numbers, you need at least five, and I tend to think that, as with the other heavy-hitters in our army, you want a large frontage; I'd run with six where possible.
A standard unit might look like this:6 KnightsHowever, with Knights, every little upgrade is somewhat pricey. You can easily justify a unit of five naked Knights, which costs 200 points and will do a lot of hurt to anything they bump into. Even without upgrades, they're hitting with ten WS5 S5 attacks, five WS3 S4 attacks and have a 1+ armour save.
Mark of Nurgle
Banner of Rage
Dragon Ogres: are one of the few units that might be able to justify a Champion upgrade, as per the thread on our forum discussing them. Dragon Ogres are a nasty unit, and provide a nice bit of variation if you're fed up of Knights but want a fast, tough, hard-hitting unit.
They're one of only two units we have who can provide S7 (the other being the Dragon Ogre Shaggoth), which makes them invaluable against heavily-armoured armies and Chariots. They can take a decent amount of wounds without losing a model (a unit of four with a Champion will statistically take five wounds from shooting before losing a model) and can dish out a serious amount of pain. Their armour save and toughness aren't the best, granted, but a unit of four is likely to get across the board with several models intact and cause some pain.
Their high movement makes them a useful flanking unit, or an alternative to you cavalry in the middle of the board. They can even be used as an anvil in the centre of your army, if you want.
A standard unit might look like this:4 Dragon Ogres----------
I do, however, also want to say this:
Just because the Marauder Horsemen and Chaos Warhounds have poor stats compared to the Chaos Knights does not mean they should be discounted. You'll hear from almost everyone on this board that Horsemen and Warhounds are two of our absolute finest units. Almost no-one would consider fielding an army that didn't include at least a unit or two of one - if not both - Horsemen and Warhounds.
These guys are the units that will win you games. Take them, all day long. For the cost of the Knights unit I mentioned above, you could include:5 Marauder HorsemenNow, don't get me wrong - your unit of Knights will absolutely destroy units in a game. As I said, you should be taking them. However, my point is that the 'weaker' looking units have their place in our army, too. You should definitely not ignore them. I couldn't recommend these units highly enough.
Mark of Slaanesh
5 Marauder Horsemen
Mark of Slaanesh
6 Marauder Horsemen
Mark of Khorne
So far this is what i am looking at. As for marks sort them out latter.
Piant theme: Death Knights i.e Arthas from WC
-2x 12 Warriors
-2x 6 Knights
-Tez Lord on Disk
-1x Lord (foot)
-1x Sorcerer (foot or mounted?)
-Deamon Prince (can you use the 40k model it looks cool?)
-Warhounds: how many?
-Marauder Horsemen of Marauders on foot?
I don't see why you couldn't use the 40k daemon prince, provided he is properly mounted on the right sized base.. he is wielding futuristic weaponry so it will look strange.
The new Daemon prince, should it ever be released it pretty awesome though, I can't wait to pick it up. Even if I will rarely use it.
There is no problem using the 40k Daemon Prince even if he does have a gun mutated into his arm, it's a daemon it can look like whatever you want though it's probably best to remove the space marine helmet attached to his waist.
BEN DIESEL FTW!!!