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I am finding that our combat is lack luster vs the asf rerolled misses of the high elves. Almost all of their elite infantry have strength 5 or 6 and destroy my knights before they can do much. Our mighty chaos warriors do not seem to fare much better, that is assuming they even make it to combat. I am finding without a shooting phase I am weakened to a point where there is little left when I engage with all of their units at full strength.
They have a book as well as a character where all doubles are irresistible, so countering magic is not an option. Purple Sun eats hellcannons and trolls before they can say boo!
My thoughts are to hope to get off a pandemonium or just run a nurgle spam to try and buboes them nasty mages. And never take anything with initiative less than 5 again....
Any suggestions on how to deal with this army that has been shown too much lovin' from GW?
Larger units of core that can handle taking some casualties before striking back. Like Khorne Marauders with great weapons. Hellcannons to hit mages and special units like Swordmasters from a distance. A Sorcerer Lord with Shadow magic to debuff the initiative of their troops. Infernal Puppet and/or Black Tongue for their mage(s).
These are some ideas.
Totally agree with MascisMan, he pretty well said it all. To give more specific assistance it would be helpful if we knew the list you are running, and what type of list you are facing off against?
Last edited by mercenary; August 2nd, 2010 at 05:02.
Match up equal Init... aka watch out for PG. His high init means nothing anyway if he has enough bodies... he'd still be hitting you back pretty hard with the new step up rule anyway. The ASF hatred is pretty harsh, so like I said, match inits. SMs don't get to reroll hits against knights/warriors, they have the same init and the ASF unit must have a higher init for it to work. Same with WLs.
TBH chosen are great vs. SMs now... the +1 WS really comes into play. He's now rolling 4s to hit and not rerolling, so they whiff half their attacks.
Fear me, mortals, for I am The Anointed, The Favored Son of Chaos, The Scourge of the World. The armies of the Gods rally behind me, and it is by My Will and by My Sword that your weakling nations shall fall. - Archaon, The Everchosen, Lord of the End Times
If you're going to be striking last you may as well hit hard. Dragon Ogres with GW's and other big tough monsters might be good as they're harder to wound and hit back hard.
In my math-hammering Vs HE Swrdmasters I found that the key to taking them out point for point is to go for models that do not pay for WS or Init. Khorne marauders with GW own them if taken in big blocks. I know flails have the same to-wound roll on elves as GWs, but on any reasonable sized block the combat will go to multiple rounds. A 10x4 block does very well against HE swordmasters, but will be getting thin after round two. I would imagine a 10x5 block of MoK GW marauders to be about the perfect size for going up against HE.
Plus those Marauder units are cheap (compared to warriors). 40 Marauders, MoK, Great Weapons, and Full Command is 250.
I wonder what an army consisting of Sorcerer Lord, Exalted BSB, Exalted Hunter/Challenger, 3 units of 40 MoK Marauders, 2 units of Marauder Horsemen with throwing weapons, 2 Warshrines, and 2 Hellcannons would do.
Last edited by MascisMan; August 2nd, 2010 at 17:49.
Yup blocks of MoK GW Marauders that take casualties are no biggies at 6 pts each! A Horde will mow down HE. 4+ to hit and 5/6 chance to wound, probably no armor save. With 30 Marauders, that's at least 28 attacks (assuming a HE frontage of 5 wide on 20mm bases). So we're talking roughly 12 wounds.
How many SM can he have?
"How do you stop a Chaos Knight from charging? No seriously, HELP!" André le Bouffon, jester of the Bretonnian court - last words.
When they ignore their first miscast of each magic phase, they do not blow themselves up...
I agree with powerclaw regarding using Dragon Ogres with GW to hammer HE units. With the high str value armor saves should be all but ignored. With the HE pesky magic phases Pandemonium and the Black Tongue/Infernal puppet combo is more important than ever. Also think of giving your warriors MoT with the blasted standard so they can walk past shooting with a 4+ ward save. There is also a new scroll in 8th edition that gives a 4+ward save for 1 use only at 15 points. It is totally worth it if you can save even 1 Knight, Chosen, or heaven forbid your General.
5000 pts of WoC, 5000 pts of Orcs and now 3000 pts of Ogres...What was I thinking ????