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Just a quick thread to garner the general consensus regarding the "manipulation" of the rules to ensure 3++/4++ Chosen?
The following table shows how this can easily be done,
(If the Unit is given the Terror Banner and the Chosen Champion has the 5 point EoTG)
Roll-# of Combinations
3----2 +T (To 2)
4----3 +S (To 3)
6----5 +AS (To 7)
8----5 MR 3 (To 7)
9----4 +Ld (To 10)
11---2 Terror (To 12)
While i accept it is perfectly withing the rules does anyone consider such tactics as poor sportsmanship?
With a Warshrine as well the chances of the magical 12 are nearly a certainty.
Thoughts Gentlemen please?
Remember the Favour of the Gods item does not let you modify a natural 2. So you're not guaranteed a 4+ Ward.
Otherwise, yes, I think it is perfectly acceptable. You've invested 260pts in two shrines AND all the specific Magic items into getting that 4+Ward & Stubborn. I think that's a very high price to pay for the bonus so is fair.
I'll bite, I realize what the EoTG is and how the Favour adjusts it, but I have no idea what that chart means or how it 'guarantees' a roll of 12. Am I missing something obvious?
Since it's not 100% garaunteed, I'd say it's still OK. Try not to think of it as manipulating, more like seducing the Eye of the Gods: warshrines are our little black dress and velvet choker.
Lolithen, it's a continuation of an old post, so don't worry if you don't get it: also the chart isn't correct anyway [Chosen don't reroll 7's with Warshrine Blessings].
Sona si Latine loqueris.
Which is just as well because I look terrible in that outfit.
Lolth, Basically you select certain rolls. Now by 'select' I mean using favour to get certain results or adjusting it so that you force a re-roll and then adjust that untill you get the desired result....
You want a 3/4 a 5/6 and a 8/9. 10/11 is covered by you already causing Terror. Now if you have all these results already (either with the Chosens special roll or from a warshrine) the only possible result you can roll is a '2' or a '12' without changing the result with favour (to a pre-existing ability or gift) and gaining a re-roll. This means you can keep re-rolling and re-rolling until you get that 12 or roll a 2 and fail.
You do need 3 shrines and a chosens initial roll to do it though. Which is highly expensive.
im a warriors of chaos player myself and i hate it when i see people do this with there chosen even without the 3 warshrine thing (which tbh i wld consider pointless spending that many points on just to get a 3+ ward and stubborn on ur chosen which if you play against any1 with common sence will just avoid)
the whole thing of causeing terror then re-rolling nearly every result until you get a 3+ ward is just cheesy, if you are going to play like that then in the end no1 will play you
and why not just spend your points on 1 big unit of warriors (i.e. just take 1 unit of warriors a lord, bsb and sorcerer), this is perfectly legal but its boring to play against
There is a guy at my store who uses teclis, 40 phenoix guard, 40 spear guys and the banner that makes his unit immune to magic and now no1 plays him because its a boring game and no1 wants to waste 2hours playing against him
although on saying all this there is a guy at my store who does do the whole terror re-roll thing with his chosen and ever game iv played against him he got the 3+ ward and iv beet him every game, manly becuase i give his chosen a hell cannon to kill while i deal with the rest of his army
there was 1 game i played against a different warriors of chaos guy and on his turn1 he got 3+ ward on his chosen and then infernal gatwayed my knights (which had my lord in them)
i really wanted to say good game and pack my things away as i cldnt be botherd to play for an hour when to me there was no point continuing, however i didnt but i didnt really have a fun game as it was one sided the whole match
maybe its just me but i play to have fun and i want the other guy to have fun also so i wld say dont do it as its boring for the other guy to know that he pretty much ahas no chance of winning from turn 1. i even re-roll my warshine result if i get a double 6 now
Thanks Borak, I get it now..
And to jgas, admittedly it's a bit lame, and if someone does it everytime, they'll be the ones to suffer if no one wants to play them, but at the same time, if you win every game they do that in maybe they're doing you a favor. As far as packing your stuff up and leaving cause you lost a unit of knights and a lord to Infernal Gateway, well, that's not very sportsmanlike is it? I mean, he got lucky, and you still had other units to play with.
For example, last game I played against DE, I was losing terribly mainly by rolling 11's twice and my warriors unit with my lord fleeing off the table in turn three. But I had a marauder unit with ONLY a Chieftain left, who somehow avoided getting murdered by the 30+ spearmen he was up against, and caused two wounds himself, and forcing that unit to flee, which he.. by himself, overran. Now a year from now I'll have forgotten that unit of warriors running off the table, but I'll never forget my single Marauder Chieftain chasing down 35 or so Dark Elf spearmen single-handedly and wiping them from the board.
That made my day.
Excellent post jgascoine011,
My sentiments are generally the same, i've used Chosen and had the opportunity to re-roll there initial role by using Favour of the Gods,
My main issue is the selection of the Terror Banner
I felt it a little "cheesy" and kept the increased armour save.
He never had the Lore of Metal.......
I'd never do it in a friendly game, competetive or no. That being said, in a tourney setting, I'd do it without blinking. It's a strong unit that works and other people would be cringing as much cheese as possible out of their lists as well. Also, it's not invulnerable, even if it's close (dreaded 13th anyone? )
i played the rest of the game but it was just a boring game when i cld have played some1 else which wld have been much more fun and interesting
as for your dark elf game
today i played against woodelves
my knights charged his tree kin, killing them and over running into his treeman and dryads
i won the combat and he rolled double 6 for his Ld on his tree man which fled off the bored
my warrior unit then charged his archers which got shot to bits leaving only my hero left which then killed his bsb, winning combat by 1 and he rolled a 10 for his test, he persued, catching and killing them
my point is that yes there is a huge element of luck but dont be cheesy and create an unbeatable unit
if you use the terror banner to make sure the chosen dont get something rubbish like fear or terror then fine but dont use it to make sure they get a 3+ ward