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2250 Pts - Warriors of Chaos
I havent played for 5 years and need some advice.
I have 75 points to spare. I think about having the 2 large regiments in the middle, and the giant and the chariots on the flanks. I'm testing a tournament army, and will be facing vampire counts in a friendly game, wich I has never beaten. Darn Bloodknights :-P
Infernal puppet is banned
1 Sorcerer Lord of Tzeentch, 410 pts, Level 4 Upgrade, (Ward save 4+)
1 Disc of Tzeentch
1 Book of Ashur
1 Talisman of Endurance
1 Chaos Sorcerer of Tzeentch, 200 pts, Level 2 upgrade, (Ward save 5+)
1 Disc of Tzeentch
1 Dispel Scroll
1 Talisman of Protection
1 Exalted Hero of Tzeentch (Battle Standard Bearer), 210 pts (In the warrior regiment)
1 Sword of Anti Heroes
1 Enchanted Shield
1 Favour of the Gods
1 Acid Ichor
20 Chaos Warriors of Tzeentch, 375 pts, full command, Halberd, Banner: Gleaming Pennant (reroll first failed leadership test)
40 Chaos Marauders of Khorne, 250 pts, full command, Great Weapon
1 Hellcannon, 205 pts
2 Chaos Chariot of Tzeentch, 140 pts
1 Giant of Tzeentch, 245 pts
Total Cost: 2175
why gleaming pennant if you have a BSB in your unit, which already let you reroll leadership tests...
better take an other banner, (the eternal fire banner or rarturous banner)
you take a lot characters with you, i would drop the lvl 2 and take a unit of knights instead... it gives you an extra (good) unit
you have 2 sorcerer of tzeentch... i think it's a bit wastefull
i would drop the champion of the marauders to
as for a winning all round tournament list, (don't have really experience with it but still) i think you shouldn't take a giant...
it will probably be shot to pieces
better take an extra unit of warriors, boost you knights, take a warshrine or something
that's what i think at least
Question - Why the ban on the puppet? Is this the rules for the tourney, or for your vampire "friend" so he can spam-cast with impunity? Smells fishy to me. . . .
aside from that.
Giants - as mentioned they get shot to hell. no save at all makes them very suseptable to all forms of shooting, sheer number of shots will see wounds put on this guy. MoT isn't so good for him either, as 6+ is nothignt o wet your panties about.
If you take him, always mark him with slaneesh. ASF yell and bawl ftw.
Magic - I find tzeech a fickle lore. 2 very powerful spells (flickering fire and pandamonium), 2 decent spells (Treason and gateway), and 2 crap spells. Problem is that alot of these spells are situational and may not be good against the army you face. I truely prefer the shadow lore to all other lores availible for a tourney list, as -d3 stats is ALWAYS useful no matter who you play. I suggest you try it aswell as it's a goood starting point.
Also, 2 mages is slightly overkill, at 400pts and 200pts respectivly. I find 1 level 4 with spell familiar works good enough as you get the +4 for cast/dispel (huge), and with 5 dice to throw at spells the odds of getting the spells you want/doubles and picking the spell you want is very high. it is also one less mage to babysit, and the magelord can hold his own in combat well enough.
Full command - never bring champions, as they are a waste. They lack the rules that force them to issue/accept challenges so you pay alot of points for +1 attack, all here will agree it is a waste.
Chariots - again unsure if a 6+ ward is going to do anything, but you made the right call in bringing a pair of these things. with 2 chariots, a giant, HC, lone magelord, and fat maraders and warriors your opponent will be forces to split his shooting concentration to only a few of these units. 1 chariot on its own will be shot to bits, but with this many choices 1 should make it into combat no problem.
missing - You have no fodder units and nothing that moves really fast. I would trim points around marks, uneeded items from characters, and command for at least 2 units of 5 dogs. Dogs are really good because
A) You can use them to re-direct frenzy troops, marchblock, and generally break-up the advancement of the opponent's army.
you get 2 useless drops at the start of the game wich reveal nothing of your placement. Since chaos tend to have a lower unit count than others it's easier to counter-deploy and create favorable combats. So, your giant goes here, then I put my sphinx on the oppisite side of the table. having more drops might mean you don't get the +1 for the first turn roll, but also means that you can make sure your troops are where they need to be and fighting the people they need to fight. This is a HUGE factor in battles IMO and is easily overlooked.
If you can scrape a bit more I would get a unit of 10-20 maraders with no/minimal gear and mark of slaneesh and have them act as a bodygard unit for the casters (ditch the discs). I think that having them out on their own with only 4+/5+ wards is asking to have your magic phase taken from you. Might work to your advantage but I think it's just setting up for disaster.
Overall - A good foundation but I think you could def trim points with marks and re-tooling your characters. add some dogs, maraders, spawn warshrine ect. Might also consider adding another 10 to your horde, with 40 you opnly need to lose 10 guys before you start to lose attacks.
Other treats - Bring the 3rd eye of tzeech on your lower level caster. This way if he rolls 2 crap spells you have access to all the spells the opponent has. Just imagine what could be done when you have access to the lore of light, the new TK magic or the Waaagh magics, or even lore of life. again it's a bit of a gamble but can be well worth the invenstment.
just a bit before I head off for my own game, good luck with your list =D
you have the sword of anti hero's which is great as Vampire counts now consist of 1 unit of grave guard with lots of characters in it (namely a vampire lord, wight king, vampire bsb and maybe another vampire or king)
give him the bronze Armour though to protect him from killing blow
however i would not take lore of tzeentch as its pretty useless tbh
if its just a friendly game take heavens for the re-roll all 6's (killing blow is horrible)
if its for a tournament take shadows as its just awesome
Thanks for the advices, I'll try to create a more trimmed list. There are alot of facts that I can use.
- Yeah i see that dropping the unit champions is a good choice, it's better to add another troop.
-I'll think to drop the giant, maybe the level 2 sorcerer even if it's a good backup. Maybe make him shadow and the third eye. Add some hounds and some knights..