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Hey LO! Long time lurker, first time poster here.
Yesterday my 3k WoC army was thoroughly dismantled by one model, my opponent's bloodthirster! Here's what caused me such grief:
It's a character: Meaning he deployed it last and all the way across the table from my platter of 50 marauders (which could've slowed him down), and he could force challenges with my characters, each of which the bloodthirster handily dispatched in a single combat round (even my Chaos Lord!) This sent my units with characters fleeing as the overkill made CR improbably hard to make break tests.
It flies: Meaning it could avoid units that could hurt it and flank/rear charge with ease, negating rank bonus, supporting attacks, etc.
It has MR: Meaning my spells did nothing to it.
It is unmatched in CC: Meaning it won every fight it was in.
Notes: All my characters had 3+/4+ saves at least and I didn't take a hellcannon, though it would take some hot dice to kill a bloodthirster outright with hellcannon shots.
So how do you guys react to seeing a bloodthirster across the table?
with extreme difficulty
it can fly, is immune to magic weapons, cant magic it to death, and generally has killing blow
the best way to deal with it is to just tie it up all game
if your using a chaos lord, give him tzeentch, a disk, talisman of preservation, the 2+ ward against flamming attacks a great weapon and crown of command
this lord will be nearly unkillable and if you just run him at the bloodthirster you may be able to just keep him tied up all game
yea i play deamons and the bloodthirsty is the nasty cc thing in the game. There maybe 3 other models that can stand toe to to with it. I think 2 for them are part of the deamon army. Best chance is tie it up or get really lucky with the hell cannon.
a few things to mention here.
First of all, the bloodthirster will never negate rankbonus other than the + 1 from flanking.
quote from page 52.
"A unit is distrupted if an enemy is attacking it in the flank or rear, and that enemy unit has two or more ranks of at least five models. "
so your units will almost always be steadfast against a monster attacking you in the flank.
I have had great succes with a hero on a disc with helm of many eyes and glaive of putrefaction. He managed to do 1 unsaved wound to the bloodthirster before he got slaughtered, but after my suicide, he couldn't do squat with it for the rest of the game. (str2, T2) Fear the mighty str 2 thunderstomp!
Lore of shadow is quite handy aswell, as you can debuff him with enfeebling foe and the withering, making him much less dangerous. If he engages one of your rank and file regiments, buff them with mindrazor
Quote Lord Borak
Now now lads. This is a forum about grown men playing with toy soldiers. Lets be adults please.
Thanks for all the ideas!
I'm not going to be able to tailor my list just for the possibility of seeing a Bloodthirster; I'll be facing all kinds of armies in the upcoming tournament season. jgascoine011, do you think your unkillable lord would be a smart choice for a general purpose list?
Vanish, thanks for reminding me of the rules for denying rank bonuses, it wouldn't have made a difference in my last game but it's something I definitely need to keep in mind for the future. Lore of Shadow is widely praised in this forum, but I haven't used it yet. I'll give it a shot since it looks strong against any opponent.
Yeah, I would agree that lore of shadow is definately a good way to combat this monster - almost every hex negates his magic resistance so can be used to really soften him up to such an extent that your regular units are able to put the boot in, and if something with mindrazor hits him then there wouldnt be a whole lot left at the end...
The preferred build for bloodthirsters was with the obsidian armour, firestorm blade and soul hunger (or something like that where they can reroll failed hits) but it may have changed now fire resistance is available to all armies - i know that if I were to face one I would probably send my disc rider into the fray with the hope that he does have those flaming attacks (which gives me a 2+ wardsave thanks to the dragonhelm) and also being immune to thunderstomp removes another of its big advantages and since I am also a flyer I can hopefully catch hold of him before he starts charging my units to pulverise him.
Other then that, theres not alot you can do against him - he can pick his combats and kill almost any character he wants as they are forced to challenge him, so perhaps just big blocks of marauders to try and beat him on combat res (or if they cant beat him, at least tie him up for several turns while they are steadfast, and focus on trying to kill the other parts of his army) - khorne daemons are very very powerful against warriors, and a pretty tough match up, but at least you have the small consolation that they have no missile fire (at least not if it is a pure khorne army) or magic so you will be at full strength by the time you do engage his units.
You can protect your characters too, by moving them tactically out of units when he is nearby. For example, if the thirster turns up on the left flank then move the character to the right side of the unit - he will not be able to charge him as there will not be room to fit in and the unit will have to take the hit instead but at least you get to have a few strikes back instead of a challenge that is instantly lost.
I suppose, another way would be to bring out kholek - I think he is capable of killing a bloodthirster.
nope kholek wldnt work as his weapon is a magic weapon so wont work against him
how many points is this tournament
if its at 3k or more then i wld go with the unkillable lord, he is not as good as the dark elf 1 but he shld be able to hold up a bloodthirster or an entire unit
other than that i would take 50 marauders and go 5 wide, 10 deep with slaanesh, greatweapons and full command but this will be difficult as he can fly so will probably just stay away from them
yea the bloodthirster is a massive pain in the ass especially at small points values however hopefully he wont be taken in a tournament with all the cannons going about as empire, dwarves, high elves and dark elves will rip the blood thirster to shreads with all there shooting
jgascoine011: The tournament season will have games at 3000, 2500, 2200 (closed list), 1500 (swap armies with your opponent so you play AGAINST your own list), 1200 (blind doubles), and 1000. I typically include a sorcerer lord and have only added a chaos lord when practicing for the 3000 point event. My friend who plays DoC brings his bloodthirster when practicing for the 2000+ point events; he plays a mixed list with lots of mobility (fiends, flesh hounds, flying units and characters.)