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I'm new to the site, but old to the hobby. Just getting back into it after a decade away (See my intro thread here (Every time I think I'm out, they pull me back in)).
Long story short, I'm just getting started on my first 8th edition army, and I have yet to play, or even watch, a game with the latest rules.
Actually, the last time I played WHFB was actually back in 5th edition (HeroHammer!), so my assumptions on what's good and what are probably way off.
I've been trolling the forums for tips and strategy, but I thought I may as well just start a thread of my own to discuss my ideas and develop my fledgling warband. I'm sure this is a tired topic, so feel free to just direct me to another thread that may answer my questions. I won't be offended.
It seemed like the Battalion Box was a good place to start, and I ordered the sorcerer lord on foot as my first leader. Figure he will come in useful no matter where I take this army.
Anyway, what would be a great help is advice on speccing these guys out, and maybe tips on where to go next. (I'm thinking Marauder Horsemen)
Primarily I'll be practicing against my brother - who is starting a similar VC army.
Eventually, I'd like to build towards something flexibly competitive.
Here's what I was thinking, more or less:
1 Chaos Sorcerer - for shooty support mostly
- Upgrade to level 2 - Is this worth it?
- Mark of Tzeentch - wild guess...
12 Chaos Warriors - Killy
- Mark of Khorne - for extra killy once in combat
- additional hand weapons - for extra killy once in combat
- shields - for cover till in close combat
- standard bearer - seems worth the cost
- champion - every little bit helps
- Blasted Standard
20 Chaos Marauders - soak up all that ranged while the warriors get into position
- Mark of Khorne - is this a waste on this small a unit? Would they be better with a MoT?
- Flails - totally not sure on this one, seems like something I'd have to test to see if that first round hits hard enough
- standard bearer
10 Chaos warhounds - any reason to split this in two? seems like these are best used as a distraction, would 2 disposable units make sense?
- pass on poisoned attacks - Seems too pricy to be worth it, if these guys are mostly fodder
- scaly skin - 6+ was usually a pass for me before, am I going to think the same again?
5 Chaos knights
- mark of Khorne
- standard bearer
- Blasted Standard
TOTAL: 994 POINTS
I didn't really look too heavily into the gifts or magic items for the Sorcerer - Is it worth dropping a standard or a mark from one of those units to give him one?
Some of the upgrades I took just because I wanted to try them out and had points to spend to 1000, but if I really trimmed the fat, this list with "Just the Models" would only be about 650 points. Would I be better served keeping it simple and going for a lean 750?
Are the standards worth it? Should I be looking at the other options besides blasted?
Are there any units where the command is just a waste of points?
What about the weapon specs - do you recommend a change?
Thanks in advance, any advice is gratefully welcomed.
Last edited by Dallas Raines; February 25th, 2012 at 00:25.
Mate, before anyone else notices, you need to remove the individual points costs from your post, whole unit costs only (copyright games workshop stuff and all).
then, I reckon your post would do better in the army list section of the warriors of chaos section.
That said, well done, welcome back, and have a virtual cookie!
...and I'm back. Emergency over.
There's lots of cool stuff for sorcerers, blood of tzeentch, third eye of tzeentch, infernal puppet. Give it a serious look.
Halberds seem to be the weapon of choice for warriors, statistically at least. 18 seems the optimal unit size, maybe drop some upgrades for greater numbers.
Marauders probably need more numbers and great weapons. Mark of Khorne is no waste here.
With so many frenzied units you need the hounds in two units to stop them doing silly things in the compulsory moves phase. Bloch the charges you don't want to make.
You can only have one blasted standard in the army, so ditch it from one unit and bulk up the numbers.
The army may be difficult to control, with so much frenzy around.
I've also never put poison on warhounds or scaly skin.
Scaly skin maybe depending on your opponent I suppose. I always play DE which always has a -1 modifier to armor when they shoot so it is worthless
As far as arcane items for your sorc, here they are to me in priority of importance....
1) Infernal Puppet
2) Dispel Scroll
I never leave home without a puppet. I try not to leave without a dispel scroll but often times I have to so I don't just carry a second sorc just for a dispel scroll.
Drop the Upgrades on the dogs. NEVER worth it. A 6+ save means nothing against s4 or higher or any special thing giving a negative to armor and poison means nothing when thy get shot to teeny tiny bits. Then you split the unit and use them as distractions and to keep your troops in line.
Sorry! Didn't even occur to me.
Thanks for the heads up, removing them now.
If this is the inappropriate thread, can a mod move it for me?
Thanks for the cookie!
Each of your units is a bit small. Warriors work best as 18-24, Marauders 36+ at least, and knights 6-8 IMO. I'd say drop one of those three units (nudge nudge... the Marauders) to bulk up your other two and give you some breathing room on points for upgrades and items. Your warrior unit should have no problem filling your required core points.
Run dogs unupgraded and 5 models only as fodder.
Run warriors either Tzeentch with a shield for a 5+ parry save, or Khorne with halberds for 3 Str5 attacks per guy. The second version is decidedly less defensive so plan accordingly. I would probably use a Tzeentch bunker in a small list and let the knights do the smashing.
Knights... Nurgle knights with Banner of Rage works wonders for me. Still frenzied, so they hurt, but they are also harder to shoot and WS3 unit only hit them on fives in combat, which can help a lot. Also, that banner gives them permafrenzy, even if they lose combat.
GL on your return, it's probably a lot to absorb. Look at some threads to see some other topics and options too.
Fear me, mortals, for I am The Anointed, The Favored Son of Chaos, The Scourge of the World. The armies of the Gods rally behind me, and it is by My Will and by My Sword that your weakling nations shall fall. - Archaon, The Everchosen, Lord of the End Times
Hi all - thanks for all the great tips. This really is valuable stuff.
I guess I should have clarified - I'm looking to spec out the models I just bought as a starting place. (sorcerer, 20 marauders, 12 warriors, 10 hounds, 5 knights)
I would like to spec them with an eye towards expanding my forces a little bit at a time, but basically right now I am working with what I have.
I promised myself I would actually finish painting and basing these models before I buy more.
I want to arm them so they will be useful when I expand - Unfortunately I think the Halberds don't come on the warriors sprue? Maybe I'll just order that bits set.
I'm definitely looking to think about my next purchase because I'm literally pacing at the gates to start work on these, but for now I want to put together my first list with these 48 models.
Thanks for the warm welcome!
So - with that in mind, do you think I should still shoot for 1000 points, or trip down to a tight 750 until I can add more models?
Believe it or not, we're in the same boat, well similar, since I'm coming back from herohammer with an almost complete Warriors of Chaos Army and don't have to worry about this stuff. W00t!
Were I you, I would play at 750 purely as a stopgap until the rest of the army has reached 1000, then the low numbers in your regiments means less as your opponent has commensurately less.
To build up to 1000 I would have to consider building up both those blocks of infantry, another box of marauders gets the unit size to 36,which is much more survivable and gets more marauders swinging great weapons. Flails are all well and good, but less effective in a protracted combat. Another Box of warriors can build up the unit you have to 18, fielded in 3 ranks of 6, with a further 6 left over for building the third box of warriors up to 18, or building the first regiment to 24 for extreme situations.
If you like Additional hand weapon on the warriors, think Mark of Nurgle, Banner of Rage, AHW, Shields, and full command. Then put Festus the Leechlord in for poisoned attacks and regeneration.
Finally, maybe a hitty hero? Something Battle Standard Bearer flavoured.
Just make sure that once you've done that and painted a load of monotonous rank and file units you give yourself a break and paint something shiny and fun like a hellcannon or a shaggoth or some trolls. Painting too many marauders makes you go a bit strange in the head. It's not permanent though, as far as I can Lobster.