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Thread: Sneaky Tactics

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    Sneaky Tactics

    Greetings folks,

    I recently decided to get back into the game (having moved to a country that actually has GW stores!) and have just started collecting a HOC army. I promised myself that this time I would only buy each unit after I'd finished painting the last, so I've got plenty of time plan what I want. I've got what I think is a pretty cool plan in mind, but I was hoping some of you may be able to advise me on whether it's a viable strategy :shifty:

    So anyway, here is what I'm thinking:

    Characters:
    We all know chaos is a little sub-optimal in the long range depatment, so my cunning (possibly) plan is to go for magic superiority. I've alway found that if both of you have a couple of magic users you often end up just dispelling eachother into the ground, so I'm thinking of using all my available character slots for spellcasters. In 2000 pts I was thinking

    1 x Mounted Lv2 Sorcerer of Chaos [Undevided] (General)
    defensive magic item

    1 x Mounted Lv2 Sorcerer of Chaos [Undevided]
    Power Stone

    1 x Great Bray Shaman Lv3 [Undevided]
    Power Stone
    Dispel Scroll

    1 X Bray Shaman Lv1 [Undevided]
    Dispel Scroll

    So that's just under 650 pts for characters (a little heavy but not too bad?)

    Units:
    Well, here is where it gets a little cheeky (technically legal, but a bit dodgy fluff-wise :ninja: ). Despite all the magic, my main two units are Khornites. I really think the frenzy on chosen warriors/knights makes them extremely hard! I realize it has it's downside, BUT... Taking them from 2 to 3 attacks is a significant improvement, and means that I can give the warriors weapon+shield, making for a 2+ save in cc while still having plenty of hitting power. Immunity to other psychology is great cos it means they don't have to worry about 25%-dead panic tests, or tests for the death of the warhound screens. As for the downside, having only 2 frenzy units and plenty of maneuverable ones to cover for them, I think it should be ok.

    It's getting quite long, sorry :wacko:

    So, this is what I'm planning to field:

    16 x Chosen Warriors of Khorne
    shields, std + musician

    5 x Chosen Knights of Khorne
    std + musician, Banner of Rage

    10 x Warhounds

    5 x Marauder Horsemen
    flails, throwing axes, musician

    5 x Marauder Horsemen
    flails, throwing axes, musician

    5 x Marauder Horsemen
    spears, shields, musician

    Beast Herd (12Gors/8Ungors as per reg. box)
    full command, Gors w. 2 weapons

    10 x Furies

    < 2000pts
    ------------

    So, there it is. A bit perculiar I know, but I don't think it'll be what people expect and I think it may overcome some of the drawbacks of "conventional" lists.

    Please tell me what you think, and dont hold back if you think its a bunch of -censored-!

    Thanks for listening to the LONG post
    J


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    I don't have time right now to write up lengthy advice, but I'll drop a few tips.

    Great bray shamans are a great way to get cheap lvl4 wizards, (55 points cheaper). However he has ld7, and no armor. Give him the mark of Slaanesh so he doesn't flee when your hounds run past him, and give him Chaos Armor, (only 10 pts), so that he's a bit resilient.
    The Hierarchy Chaotica: Kinky Sex > Change > Disease > Blood

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    Tabletop Terraformer Tzeentch Lord's Avatar
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    Naughty naughty...

    Unfortunately mate, lists like this are frowned upon. :hmm: If you've ever read the background on Chaos, you'd know that Khorne warriors will kill spellcasters as soon as look at them. They definately would never allow a bunch of limp-wristed wizards to lead them into battle!

    You're not the first to think up a Khorne army led by a load of Undivided sorcerers, I've seen this many times before. Technically it's legal, but morally it's so wrong. If you want magical superiority, take a Tzeentch army, you won't get much more magically superior than that. And just because Tzeentch warriors don't have frenzy or Immunity to Psychology, doesn't mean they're rubbish. Give them a shield and hand weapon and they'll be fine, upgrade them to chosen if you want to.

    Alternatively, you could just take an all Khorne army. Don't think that because Chaos has no ranged attacks that they're at a disadvantage. Far from it, by not diluting your army between combat units and ranged units, your army does one thing very, very well. It owns in close combat. And don't forget one of the key things about Warhammer, the game is won on maneuvering and close combat, not shooting.
    "Peace, through superior firepower."

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    True...

    Hey dude, thanks for the input! I definately get your point about diluting :yes:

    In terms of your other (perfectly valid) complaint, I do have a counter-argument (no disrespect though). I've been an enthusiastic gamer for some time (also collectable card games and RPGs) and I have always felt that rules technicalities are there to be utilized. Now I'm not saying I go for nasty tactics (like intentional unit-clipping or being overly strict on distances etc) but when it comes to army construction (or deck building or character creation) I figure if it aint illegal it's fair game :rolleyes:
    Plus if I put my mind to it I'm sure I can come up with some semi-justifiable fluff to explain this bizzare band of dudes. Maybe they are the few survivors from an enormous army of DOOM!

    Anyway, that aside... I think you may be right about the units being a bit dispursed (too many marauder horsemen?) but don't you think the sorcerer angle could work? Also I do quite like the lists the undevided dudes get, I mean no offence but personally I don't dig the Tzetch spells that much (slaanesh is pretty sweet).

    Thanks for listening
    J

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    This army isn't legal. Read the sidebar on pg 59, HoC. "Aspiring champions and sorcerers cannot be the general if any other type of character is present."

    Therefore one of the beast characters is the general (the GBS, I believe), and you need to make your core unit allocation from the Beasts section of BoC.

    You'll have to crowbar in an exalted champion if you want this to work.


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    Tabletop Terraformer Tzeentch Lord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jordan
    ...but when it comes to army construction (or deck building or character creation) I figure if it aint illegal it's fair game....
    Plus if I put my mind to it I'm sure I can come up with some semi-justifiable fluff to explain this bizzare band of dudes. Maybe they are the few survivors from an enormous army of DOOM!
    Perhaps, but the Khorne warriors would still try to kill the sorcerers regardless. Now if you had an Undivided Lord general, leading a force of Undivided (or unmarked) troops with a Khorne champion and a couple of Khorne units tagging along, you could probably get away with having one or two sorcerers. But just having Sorcerers leading a mixture of Undivided and Khorne troops is a bit dodge. :hmm:

    Still, it's up to you anyway, what you're doing isn't illegal by any means, so you can go ahead and do it whether anyone complains or not. Just don't be surprised if you get some funny looks and cries of cheese from other players.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jordan
    Also I do quite like the lists the undevided dudes get, I mean no offence but personally I don't dig the Tzetch spells that much (slaanesh is pretty sweet).
    Neither do I, which is why I usually use a Tzeentch champion, backed up by Fire Sorcerer with a spell familiar!
    "Peace, through superior firepower."

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    Yeah, I could see you getting away with 1 Khorne-marked unit in an army that had 1
    sorceror. You could even have fun with the fluff !
    But 2 marked units and 4 (!) sorcerors ...
    In a "friendly" setting, I'd play you, but I'd demand a re-match and then
    bring a SAD Skaven army.
    In a tournament setting, you'd get zeroes for army composition (and perhaps for sportsmanship as well).
    In fact, I wish GW would simply add the rule that including any Khorne-marked
    unit or Khorne demon should automatically prevent you from taking a sorceror.
    Harsh ... but fair
    Spon

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    Good points

    Hey folks, these are all good points you make, thank you.
    You are completely correct about the bray shaman having to be the general , so I would also have to take a hero, or leave the bray shamans and just go with sorcerers.
    Think I might try tone down the CHEESE a bit :shifty:, I guess there's no point antagonising all my opponents since I don't think I'll be playing many tournaments.
    SIGH... thought it was quite a cunning strategy, oh well.

    Cheers
    J

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