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I seem to be haveing a damn time beating empire. I was playing Tzeentch but im think of change to undivided with some khorne mixed in.
Any tataics out there for dealing with Empire
Very general question. Any chance you could give us some further idea as to what specifically has been giving you problems?
Its empire so im gona assmue its not "those rock hard troops" and more the shooting. If thats what is it I would say take undivided lhorne or slaness anything to stop your panic checks. Take mauraders or hounds as screens. You might also like something that flys like furies. I also have so good results with an exalted deamon, given there low leadership and need for shooting the deamon might help you out. What I regularly do is run him into something juicy taht you can out fight, cannon crews hand gunners. And kill them also rember to make your opponent make every terror check because empire can be very cowardly and if your in his artillery section even one cannon fleeing will hurt. Another hint is try to avoid "super units" of chosen something, because cannons hellblasters and handgunners will all take advantage and you realy dont need it empire are easy to out fight.
Well we usually run at 2250. He usually runs ...
Arch Lector on a War Alter <---Usually has a armour of metoric Iron and a doom fire ring
A battle priest <---Dont know usually dont last long enough to find out
a Mage lvl 2 <---- Two dispell scolls
and a captain as a standard bearer <---Takes the banner of arcane wardeing
usually has a block of 25 spearmen fc with a 9 man (3x3) Detachment of halberds and a 5 Man Detachment of hand guners
He also has a unit of 10 crossbow men he usually marches to a tower in the first turn
Also has a unit of Knights with a presepetor... Battle Priest usually joinst this unit
He aslo has a ten man group of archers as one time i ambushed him and ever since then he adds them in case i have a beast general
Special usually runs
A 20 man unit of great swords fc with a detach of halberds same formation as with the spears. The standard bearer usually goes here
5 man unit of out riders has a unit champ
Cannon & Mortor
I was running magic heavy Tzeentch but its about worthless So know that im going to switch to a different god his magic defence might come down freeing up some points for him to get another unit... He seems to like Flaggelents but i dont know what he would add.
Basicly he can sit on a hill with his war machines and out riders and lay down some fire
He also puts the archers in front of the hill so the only way to get them out of the way is charge them or fly over em... If i charge them with a unit he gets about four rounds of shooting form the out riders. If i fly over them the out riders shred the flyers.
He marches into that tower with his crossbow men and adds them to the hail of fire in 2nd trun.
The spearmen dont really move so the gunmen can fire as well.
Steam tank blasts and splats things or just makes everything run form terror #$%*'n pisses me off.
The units dont do a whole lot. The spearmen arent that hard to deal with if I have somethign that hits hard to wipe them out... but my standard drops just draw or loose even if i wipe out the front rank .
The greatswords are a bitch even if i have a good charge they wont run. And the second and will usually win the war of attrition with hard hitters or rank and file.
On top of the knights counter chageing things...
Great times Great times.
Ive thought about 2x5 Maruders with spears shields and throwing axes ... Run up to the out riders and throw some axes... even if i only kill a couple ... it would really help.
Also bring some screamers along for the ride so in his turn he has to pick what he wants to shoot at Shoot at screamers then you get axes trown at u. Shoot at the riders Get slashed by screamers.. Didnt know if that would work out or not?
Any suggestions would be great.. thanks in advance
Seems like a basic Empire style army. Try a Hell Cannon. I've never used one, but I've been on the recieving end and its not pretty.
Try some Gor Herds. They are harder to shoot at, they're fast, and can use terrain nicely. Minotaurs are nice for flanking ans smashing stuff. Give them two hand weapons and a mark of Khorne for 5x WS4 S4 attacks each.
It would be nice to see your list too.
From the sounds of that beastmen and flyers sound like the way to go. I would also recoment the hell connon. Killing anything you want out of his army is nice but making anything nearby run is nice too. Be sides that you just want to target his ranged stuff because if he run out of it his game is done.
Your friend is quite mean, running a war altar and a steam tank is really overpowered. I though I was a jerk for using a Helblaster!
I'd say, if you want to beat him, grab something big- like Troll big. The steam tank has ten wounds and a toughness 5. If you can beat it up enough, he'll eventually be too afraid to generate steam-points. Also, large, unbreakable units can stop the tank, since it doesn't flee and it doesn't have any way to disengage.
A good tactic that I'd try to use would be to fight the small units. Take cavalry and try to find some Magic Resistance or good anti-magic. The cavalry will be able to run down his archers, and those tiny detachments. His army is based entirely around two mediocre-sized units. A good charge home will tear the guts out of the force, and you can mop-up the characters.
The real sticking point is that tank, perhaps grabbing some DoW cannons (gonzo's gallopers, or some Leadbelchers) would be able to stop it, if they survive long enough to not get zapped.
Well part of the reason i dont take the hell cannon is ...and i could be wrong on this... Im on a really limited budget and the cannon is kinda addon is it not. I wouldnt be able to use it in a tourny.. so if I ran into a similar list I would be screwed. Kinda the same deal with Dow
Second I guess I didnt realize the tank was T5. And I do like me some trolls.. seems like a good fit.
Do you think my maurder idea would work? I think he will put a wizard in that unit next game as last time he was hang out by himself and i picked him off. So if i can make that unit run it could yeild a fair amount of points in case I cant kill his tank or general.Plus he will give him the shroud of magus to protect that unit for a few games till he fells safe i dont have much magic... then ill pop another magic heavy list on him to see how it would really do.
I was also thinking of two units of knights. One chosen MoU. and one Mok. I get two units with 10 attacks @ str 5 Should be hard for him to surround them.
Well, mainly because the Steam Tank is toughness 6 :cry: :blush:I guess I didnt realize the tank was T5.
But the Trolls (or Minotaurs/Ogres) are a valid idea anyways (they cause fear themselves, so in their case the Tank's terror is reduced to fear, but still beware of the Tank's US)
And not forget, the tank is automatically hit in CC (due to WS 0), so with three Ogres/Minotaurs equipped with great weapons in contact to him would mean 9 hits at strength 6 (10 if one of 'em is a unit champ, although I wouldn't spend the points for it)
For the magic: Banner of Arcane Warding and Shroud of Magnus? Well, at least he has come to fear the magic might of the Chaos Hordes :yes:
Well, a simple solution would be to aim at the units without characters (they can't benefit from the magic resistance) with the outriders and the detachments being especially vulnerable (always remember, once below US5, a detachment neither negate ranks, nor gets the bonus for flank/rear)
And if you still occasionally want to field tzeentch lists I suggest to spice it with the occasional undivided sorcerer (to get at least the possibility of a magic missile with a fixed strength, 4 is not bad against empire infantry )
It ain't easy bein' green... :-)
I think a cavalry-heavy list would do quite well in this situation actually. Screen the units with hounds to reduce losses from shooting, take a few furies to try and knock out one of his war machines, and as has been suggested take a hard-hitting unit to take care of that tank. Really, once the tank is out of the way, your cavalry will easily munch right through those Empire rank and file troops, and with your speed it'll be easy to get into his flanks.
So Sayeth Jimmy boy