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With the release of the the new vampire counts army, my wood elves are having great difficulty in winning against them. I used to be able to massacre my oppenents but now... all is not well. Was just wondering if any people have any tactics against VC to share. The problem is my oppenent has 8 pd from his lord and pool dice this is then used to raise whole units that may have been down to a few models back to full strength. He uses 1 dice and gets +2 to cast on skellies and +1 to cast on zombies. So he uses 1 dice raises d6+4 or +1 on a roll of 3+ and then gets +2 to his score. Makes it very hard to win games as it usally ends up as a sluffest me killing loads and then him raising.
So I thought I would make this thread for people to share their tactics, plans, stories regarding the new Vampire Counts.
Well i played the new VC yesterday, he used manfred, a vampire, and a Battle Standard Bearer, all of which i killing blowed ^^ the magic wasnt really that great, if u have multiple combats going on then its hard for your opponent to overwhelm you even with that +9 zombie thing...
Its best if you just have your units as usual supporting each other in the front + flank + rear when possible, and just kill his main character, then you can easily whittle down the numbers in combat.
Really, I don't find the to be as difficult as people hype them up to be. I mean I think that WE are one of their worst matchups. I have not used my WE against the but my TK and Empire have ripped them to shreds. I think if played wrong the Wood Elves can be beat however the VC MUST outplay you. Armies the VC stand virtually no chance are Tz DL, nurgle DL, and TK with WE prolly the next best army to beat them. Tell me what you have tried doing and we might be able to help.
2009 Tourny records (W-L-D) (20-4-4):
9/56, 1/12, 2/14, 4/14, 32/82, 1/6, 16/72
I'll begin by telling you more about his army. He has 2 units of 5 black knights. 2 units of 3 wraiths. He puts both his lord and wight battle standard bearer in the same unit of skeletons. His battle standard has banner of regeneration so whole unit effectivly has 4+ ward save. he has 10 pd all together and 8 are used by his lors who has +2 to cast IoN on his skeleton units. Also he can raise above the starting number of skeletons so by the time i actually get into close combt he has a very big unit 40+ last game. He puts his wraiths infront of this unit to stop me from charging my wardancers in and trying to kiiling blow lord. also he protect his flanks with more skellies so as soon as I charge in he conters with a unit into flank ( if i charge unit next to lords his lords unit charges into my flank and if I try to charge lordss unit skellies charge my flank. Also as soon as i get into combat with any unit he justs start rasing like mad into that unit with his 8 dice +2 to cast IoN and my magic defense of 4 scrolls and 6 dispel dice is not enuogh. H e has trouble massacaring me but he always pulls off victories. All my shooting comes to nothing as he just raises. I try to pull off multiple charges but since has such big units i can almost never break through a unit completly and then usally getting counter charged.
Any help would be appreciated.
I've fought the new Vampires with my Wood Elves, and they're not at all unbeatable - you just have to play against it as any wood elf would against any opponent, charge the fights you want to fight, and flee the rest.
Don't even bother fighting any unit with that f****** regen banner in it, unless you're shooting flaming cannons or screaming skull catapults at it, it's just too tough to take down (imagine it in a Grave Guard unit that also has the Wight Banner like I had to face!). March block it and avoid it the entire game. Let him raise all the skeletons he wants to it, just never let it EVER see combat! Baiting him to charge you into some woods is a great move. You want to kill everything aside from that unit.
If you manage to just kill a couple of Corpse Carts and Zombie Hordes in six turns, you won't win by much, but it'll be a victory nonetheless. Eventually, opponents will all learn to avoid the cheeseball regen unit of death, which will in turn lead to Vampire players taking the big point sink that never sees combat out of their lists, then it'll be back to a game of strategy, instead of who has the biggest boner banner.
Also, the two best ways to counter Wraith units for Wood Elves is a) the Hail of Doom Arrow, and b) Glade Guard joined by a character who has A Reslendence of Luminescents.
When you fight skeletons (or any undead unit for that matter), you've got to understand and precalculate how long you should expect to kill everything -- because everyone is unbreakable, once you're in combat, you don't leave until they're all dead, or you flee.
Never charge headlong into a skeleton unit! That's exactly what he wants you to do, because that's the easiest way for him to have at least 1 skeleton left to hold you up and then counter charge with something nasty into your flank. You have got to negate his ranks and devestate him with attacks on the charge. Luckily, Wood Elves is one of the easier armies to pull this off with. 6 Wild Riders with full command and the War Banner into the flank with a lot of Eternal Guard with full command and BSB to the front is usually enough to completely wipe out 25 skeletons in one fell swoop.
And if your opponent gives you shit about how it takes two expensive units to kill ~250pts of his army, just smile and say that's how Wood Elves are to be played.
Then take his BSB model with the Regen Banner and wipe your butt with it.
hmm seems like your a big fan of the regen banner. lol.
As a VC player I find wood elves one of the tougher armies to beat.
You are more mobile than him so use it to your advantage, pick fights you will win in one go to prevent repairs. Each unit of zombies he raises are worth 50 VP's and are very easy to kill with glade gaurd.
Units of 3 wraiths are small expensive and can easily be take out by dryads or a hail of doom arrow so should be easy VP's for you. Units of 5 knights will go down to wardancers or wild riders on the charge.
The large lord unit with BSB will be very tough to destroy with regeneration so ignore it and kill the rest of his army including any other expensive characters he has. Remember each new zombie unit he creates will be another 50 VP for you to go and claim which will mean less of a reason to fight his skeleton unit.
Lots of good advice here. The knights can be taken out with a flank charge or the arcane bodkins. Wraiths are big targets for forest spirits or the hail of doom arrow. Don't charge skellies unless you can killing blow the general in there. You can beat them without taking out large units by picking off smaller units, grabbing banners from knights, taking quarters.
Or you do what someone else has said. Pile on so much combat resolution that his unit just won't last.
yu could also use an alt noble with those flaming swords to stop his regenaration working and try to kill his bsb
Hmm that unit. Well hopefully more people will do what I am beggining to do and use 2 units of scouts (amazing btw). Those 2 units can prolly keep that unit busy the entire game, I am sure I can do it, so you might be able to. Remember skirmishers are the best redirectors in the game and u have plenty. Just avoid the unit. Get TQs, the black knights can easily be shot down or dealt with dryads/ riders/ dancers. WE are prolly the 2nd best army equipped to deal with wraiths (demons obviously first) and 6 wounds T4 no as for a nice number of points will be very easy to obtain. I hope our advice helps. I've only lost once against the new VC and that was because my opponent argued he could raise into combat (please don't start an argument, you may have your interpretations but i feel the issue is clear).
2009 Tourny records (W-L-D) (20-4-4):
9/56, 1/12, 2/14, 4/14, 32/82, 1/6, 16/72