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Forgive me if this has already been said, but I have some gripes about the new wood elf armybook that I want to air, and not of the 'theyre broken' vein.
I played wood elves for about 1-2 years after the release of 6th ed. WHF, but lost interest in them after it became apparant that they were not getting an army book for several more years, and even with the revised temporary army book they still lacked that polished quality that could be found in the other armies that had army books.
In the meantime, I took up playing tomb kings, wihch was fun for a while, but again I despaired in them ever getting an army book of their own... but when it finally did come, there was an overall improvement in the quality of the army, so I was pleased.
Nonetheless, while balanced the tomb kings werent anything special, so I once again got bored with them, and stopped playing WHF altogether for a year or so, having plenty of other games such as WH40k and D&D minatures with which to amuse myself.
Finally, there approached a stage when it seemed wood elves would be the logical choice for the next army realeased... after all, there was only them and chaos dwarves that hadnt been published and I had heard rumours that chaos dwarves were being put on the back-burner for a while... but what came out next? &^%$ ogre kingdoms!!! Rather than release an army book for an established race that many players owned armies for, GW opted to &^$% their R&D time into building a new army! How frustrating to any loyal player who had been waiting so long for a much needed army book!
But now, after more than 4 years of waiting the wood elves finally get their promised army book, and a new line of minatures (which look spectacular BTW), and I finally buy the book yesterday, only to discover that it was not the holy grail I had been seeking all this time...
GW has nerfed the &^%@ out of the wood elves!
Almost every unit has been made more expensive with little to show for it! the only exception to this is the dryads, which I find to be quite reasonable, but that hardly makes up for an across-the-board increase in the cost of every other unit!!!
Almost every trick that made them worth taking has been taken away! High mages can no longer acess any lore of magic : I used to love taking a lvl 4 mage with lore of the heavens, and 2x lvl 2 mages so that I could actually hold my own against the predominantly magic-heavy armies I was facing such as chaos, empire and elves.... and actually get off some decent spells against khorne and dwarves! That magic weapon, the javelin with the stats of a bolt-thrower, my precious! they took my precious!!! they took away the one wardancer dance that made them worth taking; the one that made them unbreakable for a turn, so that I could use one unit of wardancers to hold a regiment in place for a turn while I flanked it with a few quick units! gone!
The new magic lore is weak as all *&^%!!! theres just no 'meat' to it at all!! its like they took beasts and life and smushed them into one lore... and those lores were barely worth taking to begin with!
The new magic items are almost without exception weak and overpriced compared to ANY OTHER ARMY! all the magic weapons are sad and pathetic!
Clearly GW hates wood elves for some reason? we all know theyve got a big soft-spot for *&^*& orcs these days...
If I had known this would be the fate of the wood elves, I would have stuck with the 'temporary' list they released ~3 years ago and kept playing that, because unrefined though it was, it still kicked arse over the *&^% theyve just released!
SO, am I a ranting lunatic with no grip on reality, or has GW actually (as I surmise), cut the balls off the wood elves?
I don't have the perspective of having played wood elves in any other incarnation, or of having played any other army period, so my opinion carrys what is certainly almost no weight. However, that being said, I don't think the wood elves have been too shafted. I'd be inclined to say that they're not amazingly good, lacking any decent armour or weight of numbers seems to remove their ability to actually be really good.
However, they do have some good (even by comparison) magical items. Similarly, their magical ability, at least in terms of defense, seems pretty reasonable. Sure they can't steal opponent's power dice for dispell dice, but given that a Dryad--a decently respectable combat character--can provide power dice and dispell dice for 25 points a pop (up to two dispell dice and a power die, by virtue of the cluster of radients and the wizard upgrade) it seems unreasonable to say that their magic is terrible.
Bleh...none of that is really relavent, though--my opinion carries little weight, as I said.
Rather, I would suggest you simply consider that almost the entire weight of opinion on this forum regards the wood-elves codex as a positive step. It's not amazing (not the best army in the game, as many players around here used to consider the wood elves, though i'm almost certain that they are wrong) but it seems pretty inline with other things, and most of the people who have expressed opinions here seem to think likewise.
No offence, but I vote ranting lunatic. I mean, the archers are the same price as the HE ones, and kick their asses. The Glade riders are argueably much better than HE reavers. WW are awsome, I think Treemen in some ways are a bit better, and I really like the lore of Athel Loren. Of course its good only in forests, but why would WE be somewhere else? Also, I don't think the other lores really fit the fluff of the WE, and thats why they were cut. As for the BT, its still there, but only Orion has it. Some things are better now- the spirit sword ownz a lot more than before, and now there's more magic arrows. Question- have you played the new WE yet? Just wondering, because any opinion you get about them being bad without playing them doesn't mean anything. But then again, I haven't had the chance to try them either (or even ever play WHFB- I only got the rule book 2 weeks ago and haven't had the chance to ut together the models that came with it yet....) so I guess my opinion doesn't mean anything... But still, try them before you dis them. People said new nids were nerfed, but they like them now...
40K armies: Tyranids (2001), Space Wolves (2008), Sisters of Battle (2011)
Current Rep: 1337
also the forest walking rule THE WHOLE ARMY WITHOUT MOVEMENT PENALTIES IN THE FOREST. that is a godsend for any general as foreests are one of the most interesting terrain pieces. tactically speaking anyway
Ok fellows we have a difficult task, so we have to be more deadly than everyday.
Make mistakes and confuse the enemy - The Doctor
Tactics are nice but it is violence that wins the day.
I would disagree with you Sleekfox. The ne wood elf armybook makes the army much more mobile, aggressive and elite unit based.
So you remember the worst spearmen in the game? ya we had them. Now, we get the eternal guard, a unit that suits much more the wood in terms of fighting style, but also fluffwise.
Wardancers are more expensive? well yes, they now have a nifty WS of 6, get that very nice +1 Strength on the charge, and all the dances are now worth using, not just the old killing blow and remove ranks.
Warhawk riders are more expensive? well again yes, they now have 2 wounds each, a S4 warhawk, bow AND spear, and the hit and run to boot.
We also finally got a magical item sections that isn't resumed by Sword of might, Enchanted sheild, dispell scroll, bow of loren and hail of doom arrow.
The number of units doubled, and we also have access to 3-4 diferent types on army now.
The lore of Athel Loren doesn't look good? well think again, it is a diceptively good lore, made to support units, and also hinder your opponent as much as possible.
You ever seen a monster or with a 5+ ward save? the combined skirmishing, T4 and forest spirit status makes dryads the perfect screeners, they'll make those empire handgunners cry.
Wanted all these cool caracter types you thought could be cool to field? well you got them now, with 7 kindreds to choose from, caracter variety isn't a problemÃ©
And to seal my never ending plea, this army plays in no way like any other, it's unique flavour makes it one of the most challenging armies to play right now, just give it a try.
i side with phalanx and say raving lunatic and would also like to add without repeating what already been said,
glade guard strength four bows within 15 inches
move and shoot without penalty,
lots of skirmishing units both ,
I think the wood elves have become a great army well worth the wait
WELL SAID, NO MORE SQUATS THEY ARE DEAD GET OVER ITOriginally Posted by artificer
The new wood elf army list is by far and away better than the PDF one that existed before. Rather than cutting the balls off the wood elves I think they have actually been given some guts in a fight. Their archers have got better with strength 4 at close range and the ability to move and fire without penalty. Treekin are big and unpleasant and beat stuff up. The army is certainly subtle in its power and players will take time to get used to it. I think they look great, and the models are outstanding ( I am even going to buy some of the models as they look sooooooo cool).
Helper monkey, bring me beer and donuts
My only beef with them is that the models are so good, and the rules more in line with the concept of the game whilst keeping their unique identity, that before long, everyone will be using them.
I'd love to start them myself, but they may have to wait until I get a few other things done first.
Wood Elves 2/0/1
Orcs & Goblins 0/1/0
Next Army - Tomb Kings
To add to the lists of arguments against your plea Sleekfox:
You want your mages to do damage? Play Tzeentch, play HE or DE, play Lizzies. They have real good offensive magic. WE magic is about support. Besides, WE don't need magic to do damage, they've got more than enough archers to their disposal.
Units too expensive? That's what I hear in every tactica. "This unit is too expensive for what it does." Well, if everybody says it, maybe standards for price should be lowered. If you pay too much and the opponent does the same, no problem.
As for the Wardancers, they were the holding unit with their Unbreakable dance. Now you can use stuff like Dryads for that and have the Wardancers flank. They're supposed to be the ones to eat the enemy, not the ones that serve them to your other units.
Oh, I so want you to be right. I couldn't find where WD get +1 str on the charge. Can you point me to the page?Originally Posted by Wolf_Pack
Ah okay, I found it on the special rules page. I've got to reread this book!