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My friend is starting a Khorne Chaos army soon, and he's planning on getting his Lord on dragon. My own strategy to counter his Khorne army would be, 2 Treemans, and a Highborne on Dragon.
Khorne in my knowledge are a very straight forward army, if they are in range to charge then they must do so... correct me if I am wrong, I just started playiing Fantasy last month. My plan is to put a unit of Glade Riders (since Khorne has absolutely no shooting at all to worry about) in the center of board, where his entire army sees and in range to charge. I would flee the unit as soon as he declares the charge and lure his dragon into my charge range of my 2 treemans.
The problem now is, would the 2 Treemans hold out against his Khornate Lord and the Dragon? 12 Attacks at strengh 6 hitting on 3+?
How would you deal with this threat? Especially facing off against a Khorne army that takes everything on steed/chariot/fly? How would you go and tool up your dragon lord if you *have* to take one as a mandatory choice? (don't ask why :shifty: it's a friendly thingy)
I'm no expert but you are right about Khorne armies. With few exceptions, they are frenzied. Though I believe that some units like beast herds are not. One thing to really remember besides being able to bait charge like no other is that Khorne has really high magic defence. So, I would suggest not putting any points in offensive magic.
My suggestion on your Highborn is to nit it out for CC. Being on a dragon will make him very powerful and you want that bad boy in CC. Possible items that come to mind are Helm of the Hunt, Great Weapon, and a good ward save (SoCM maybe?). Hope this helps. Good luck with your dragon! I want to get one just because they look so freaking awesome!
My current choices for my dragon lord's load out are as follow:
1) Highborn w/ Sword of Might, Stone of Crystle Mere, Oaken Armour
4 atks @ Str5 consistantly, with 3+ ward and regeneration
2) Highborn w/ Sword of Might, Helm of the Hunt, Stone of Crystle Mere, Hail of Doom Arrow
5 atks @ Str5 on the charge, and the ability to unleash HoDA
3) Highborn w/ Dawnspear, Helm of the Hunt, Stone of Crystle Mere
5 atks that makes him/his units hits a little less...
The first choice is a bit on the defensive side, ensuring my lord would survive longer than usual.
Then again, how do you suppose to hold the khorne dragon in combat or better yet, killing it?
Well, for starters a Lord of Khorne on a dragon is 610 points minimum with no extra wargear or magic items. So that is a large chunk of his army.
Secondly, baiting the Dragon Lord is a good idea but remember that he will still get to move his full 20". You are better off placing a great eagle in front of him and angling it away from you lines. Then flee with it, if he catches it you have lost a few points and his Lord is out of commission for a turn.
How I would deal with it?
Shoot it. Large target is +1 to hit. A lot of shooting will drop it eventually.
spear of twilight will also potentially kill him, I would take an Alter Highborn with the Helm of the Hunt so you get 6 attacks on the charge. Chaos is light on with ward saves and if you roll a 6 to wound he dies.
but I wouldn't go for the treemen and dragon. Your better off getting in a lot more firepower.
There is always more than one way to skin a cat.
I thought about going towards the way of shooting spree against Khorne, but when it comes to a lord on dragon, you need 6's to wound and the randomise shot makes the lord/dragon survives even longer... not to mention the guy on the top has 2+ armour save and 4+ ward, the dragon itself is 3+.
If I pack 40 Glade Guards, assuming at close range, doing 40 shots at the Lord... 2+ to hit and randomise, statistically speaking, 33 shots in total will hit.. and out of that amount, 11 will hit the rider, 22 will hit the dragon. The 11 shots will need 5+ to wound on the rider, which would result in 4 wounds (rounding up), but the real number of wounds caused after the armour save and ward save is 0.33.. which is 0 or 1 wound. The other 22 shots will need 6's to wound on the dragon, resulting in 4 wounds (rounding up) and its thick hide will stop most of the damage, so realistically speaking.. only 1 or 2 wounds will be caused. Next turn, entire gun line crumbles as the Dragon goes in slaughtering every single fragile elves :cry:
You got a better way to deal with this?
Avoid the highborn w/ dragon.
Annoyance of Netlings
Whether you're going to take it on with a highborn or a treeman ancient make sure you have this spite.
You don't have to kill it through wounds just make sure you win combat and then run it down. Charge in with some wild riders and great eagle so that you win combat and have extra units to roll pursuit with.
As far as dealing with frenzy, lead his units into forests. You'll take them out of the game for a couple turns.
Nekchen, first off I would suggest to you a Great Weapon over a Sword of Might. On a dragon, you should get the charge and well you are going to want to deal with that high T. GW are much cheeper too. In addition you free up magic points that can be used to give him more stuff. (You can also always give him a shield/enchanted shield in addition and use it when it benifits you more) (Your third option seems the best so far)
Taking out a dragon: If you can charge the Dragon with a unit of wardancers using the Killing blow dance, you have a good chance. That will ignore AS. (Though sadly I believe they keep their ward save) Still that is 7 WD, 14 A, 7 hits (if 4's to hit), (in cc you can target the Rider) Not sure on Rider's T...5? if so you need 5's to wound BUT any 6 will auto kill him! YAY! Again I think he gets his ward save still. You may be throwing away a unit of wardancers but that is less than one 3rd of the points that he is spending! Hope this helps.
Thats good advice Trodi.
Wardancers, if they can get a charge on him will do the trick quite nicely.
On a 60mm base for the dragon you can get 5 wardancers in contact. Thats 10 attacks hitting on 4+ and any 6 to wound (that bypasses the wardsave) will kill him.
With the shooting its not as bad as you think. You actually want to take down the dragon, especially Strength 4 shooting. Still need 6+ to wound but its save goes down to a 4+.
Here's one thing you can do.
Highborn on Dragon
Helm of the Hunt, Greatweapon, Stone of Crystal Mere, and Annoyance of nettings.
Now, as you have a shooting army he has to come across the table to you to get VP. Shoot at his dragon. Hopefully you may have hurt him at some stage. Due to the points cost of his Lord/Dragon combo, he will be forced to move his dragon into a position where you can charge him with yours.
He cannot opt to flee so he's stuck. On the turn you charge, issue a challenge. This is important, even though they are the only one's involved you must issue a challenge. This does two things:
a) allows you to use the annoyance of nettings
b) means that even if another unit charges in they cannot target your character.
Now, on the turn you charge you will have 5 Strength 6 attacks and 5 strength 5 attacks.
The next part depends on what your shooting did. If you have taken a couple of wounds off the dragon, attack it. If you have taken a wound of the lord attack him. Don't split your attacks. Concentrate on one of them. Without his mount the Lord is going to be in trouble.
Just remember fire everything you can at the dragon lord. You will take wounds off it and force him to come to you. Get a Hail of Doom Arrows in the list as well and shoot that at him if you have to.
Another thing is the Alter Highborn with the same kit as above.
Do the same thing except this time you have 6 strength 6 attacks.
Hope some of this helps.
If you really want to cause a problem, dont even engage it in combat. I have tried this against a blood thirster, and it worked pretty well. It does involve sacrificing troops, but for the cost of troops that die, its easier to get his massive point sink to chase around stuff that isnt worth it. You do this by charging in with great eagles, alter nobles and other more expendable troops at the rear and sides...this may sound stupid, but if you can get a lord on a dragon to chase you off the board in the opposite direction, you have just bought yourself 2 turns at least where it is ineffective. This also works with regular khornagate units, i would send up reconnisance units to get close to charge range, and get them to follow you in obscure paths, because you have the advantage of speed. Khorne is a tough nut to crack in combat, so its up to massed trickery and charges to pull it off.
I would agree with everything that skarsgard has said...He is definatly on the right track for trying to kill the beastie. I would say that an annoyance of netlings is the key to this fight, as it will greatly hinder his ability to attack you back.
"This sure ain't no pansy Eldar Armor, Son"
185th Cadian Armored Div.
"One Shot, One Kill"
Western Border Patrol of Athel Loren