Welcome to Librarium Online!
Ok, first off I would like to clarify that by ‘new to Eldar’ I do not mean ‘new to 40k’. I am a seasoned veteran with years and multiple armies of experience. I began with Tau, experimented with IG, Deathguard, all Kroot (lol!) and even gave space marines a try (figured I might as well, everyone has got to play em some time.) And now I’ve settled down with Witch hunters. But after all this time there has been one army that peaked my interest, the Eldar. I was too absorbed into Tau and didn’t get around to experimenting with them until it was too late.
Right as soon as I decide to give one of my favorites for years (ok it was stupid of me not to play them first, I know.) the new Eldar codex comes out. So it’s a piece of shit for a number of reasons, mainly the pointless separation of unit profile sections, however the rules and stats seemed to improve. I love the Autarch option. But anyway, the real problem is, I love Banshees. I adore them more than any other 40k model… I’m sure you can see where I’m going with this. The new banshee models shattered my soul . The new dreadful models are what lead me to Witch hunters. You see, I wanted an all or mostly female army and with Eldar dead to me they seemed like a nice choice.
But as of recently I’ve been considering giving Eldar another chance. Luckily, the old Banshees are still available in the classic section, much to my relief… I should probably act quickly before they disappear. So that’s my rant for today. I decided to post my army list here, I’ve been a lurker for a while and finally signed up, figured I start posting, and I’ll begin with my conceptual army list.
The theme here was actually Iyanden. (not Ulthwe? Lol.) I’m sure you would have thought Biel-Tan after the banshee rant, which was my original intention. But I also love Wraithguard and whoever did the new Wraithlord model is a god. So I combined both elements. Also another theme was close combat and speed, as my army list shows. So without further enlightenment here it is. And of course, by all means comment and critique as you please.
Iyanden 2000/2000 (Take 3)
(Please read full explanations, you’ll see I’ve given the feedback my full consideration.)
Eldritch storm (It’s back due to her mobility now, and doom combo)
(Big change here. The +1T and 3+ armor was worth squeezing in, and the mobility would make her more useful on the battlefield. Modeling her on a Jetbike wouldn’t look as cool, but I’ll probably build a little jump pack for her and use the Jetbike rules. I was thinking doom + eldritch storm would make her a formidable force of her own.)
(A replace for Jain Zar. I love Jain but with the banshee count as harly change she didn’t fit. And this way, I have the Autarch bonus and some more quick strike support where he’s needed.)
Team of 9 Harlequins, one of them Shadowseer-238
Shadowseer (with fusion pistol and kiss)
All with kiss (modeled as banshees)
(So, I gave in. Rending, though only works on a 6… in a mass of 9 of them I’m sure I’ll get at least a few instant kills. And the Shadowseer I original just though looked cool and made the unit stealth suits… but I looked at the rule a little closer… 2D6x2…. So she’s in. Again you see another fusion pistol, I am very paranoid about tanks I know, but its also anti-heavy infantry. Cant argue with AP 1.)
2 teams of 4 Wraithguard, one warlock-334
Warlock is a spiritseer, has singing spear, and the enhance or conceal power
Mounted in a serpent with shuriken cannon and twin lance
(Same story here only I reduced squad size to 4 to make room for points. 8 total still sounds like a load of fun. Only problem is I can’t decide on a power. More assault goodness or a cover save, both of which are equally appealing. Destructor is a possibility as well, so I’ll probably have to use them all and then finally settle on the one I liked the best.)
2 teams of 5 Dire avengers, one of them Exarch-129
Power weapon and shimmer shield, both powers
(No change here, I considered beefing up squad size and I still might. The Autarch will maybe stick around these guys to help out if he doesn’t have anything better to do. I wanted to play assault style so with the bladestorm, charge up and fleet, shimmersheild+defend combo, assaulting the survivors could be fun. If they get into too much trouble the harlequins do have hit and run. Note, I tend to keep my force concentrated.)
1 team of 6 Swooping hawks, one of them Exarch-153
Lasblaster and power weapon, intercept
(So… they’re in with one more member. Now, wait. This is not a set in stone unit choice. I have given the warp spiders a lot of thought…. I put in one more hawk to up them up a little and hopefully ensure vehicle contact. However, if they perform as poorly as people say, then warp spiders will be the replacement. I will likely just simply call them hawk models spiders from then on, since I like the models better. Also, 3+ armor is more my style…)
1 with bright lance, 2 with shuriken cannons, all with sword.
(Ok, I didn’t change one to a falcon since the banshees were gone and I don’t think the harlequins need it. And I left the swords on so that I can see how they perform, but what will likely end up happening is me twin-linking their weapons or changing them to what my army would prove to need more of. If I change to spiders, more bright lances couldn’t hurt.)
Thank you all for your help. Keep the suggestions coming. Though I tend to argue a lot I do consider everything that is said (since after all advice is meant to be helpful and usually is.) and you have help my concept Eldar army grow alot. You’ll see that there are changes and potential changes based on your advice, thank you.
(Replace Hawks with Spiders)
5, one of them Exarch
Powerblades, spinneret rifle, withdraw
(Remove Wraithlord swords, with the extra points put in two more dire avengers.)
Last edited by Delpheus; October 26th, 2007 at 03:32.
Do the Banshees really look that different though? I was actually pulled in by the new Banshee models.
Okay, that's enough from me, I'll step aside for people that can actually help you. Using Banshees as a screen is kind of expensive for an elite unit to me, but what do I know.
The wraithlord is indeed amazing... and I thought the Tyranid Carnifex was mind boggling haha.
I like your list, you seem to an idea for everything, but I think Doom would be a good buy on your farseer. Make 'dem banshees (and everyone else) tear apart, well, everything!
The new helmets are much different, and personally, I think theyíre hideous. Especially the ExarchÖ ugh, the ExarchÖ anyway, The point at the top of the helmet I donít have too much of a problem with (except for they look too much like guardians), itís mainly the face plate and its horribly widened Ďmouthí. Plus I donít like their new abdomen armor. I could go on but Iíll stop now. (Iím very particular when it comes to appearance.)
And I should probably clarify, by screen I donít mean fodder, lol. It depends on the situation but Iíd probably keep em close to the Wraithguard to help em out but of course keep the banshees in assault whenever possible. I havenít played with em, but I like the idea of using the two working together. I think it would be fun to have the enemy try and decide which is the greater of the two evils, lol.I was actually looking over my list again after posting, and I was considering modifying my Farseer. I donít have the points for both fortune and doom, but I was thinking doom might be a better choice if I wanted to be more aggressive. Itís a more than likely change.like your list, you seem to an idea for everything, but I think Doom would be a good buy on your farseer. Make 'dem banshees (and everyone else) tear apart, well, everything!
A few things:
Where oh Where is your second troop choice, you have only one listed, the squad of avengers (which by the way is set up exactly like mine, and as for bladestorm, the cats are assault weapons, so blade storm then charge in the same round, the shimmershield and defend power will allow them to tie up tough opponents for a couple turns).
No Space Clowns in Pajamas.
Harlequins are a must in any Eldar force, even just one squad is devestating, and your opponents will go out of his way to illiminate them.
Warp spiders in my opinion and experience do a much better job than Swooping Hawkes, and people go out of their way to kill them as well.
……………………………………..Well, that kinda ruins everything I had planned. I set up this list using the army builder, since it’s MUCH easier to use than the incomprehensible new Eldar codex. And I go to troops and see Wraithguard listed, which sparked some hope for the thought of using Iyanden with lotsa banshees... for some reason I didn’t bother to check it over with the codex since I hate opening the damn thing. And there were no errors with the builder. But now that you mention it, and after looking at it, to field them as troops they must be 10 strong. That kinda sucks... =[
I guess I could merge the 3 teams into 1 and spread out the wave serpents… or do away with them but that’s no fun. I liked the idea of 3 small teams of 3… but its 40k and Eldar so I shoulda figured there was a restriction in there somewhere… damn….. just damn… -_-
Second: I hate harlequins. Not only do I just hate harlequins. I hate them. I’m ok with the shadowseer one or whatever, but the rest of them are just…. horrible looking. Their stats may be decent, but there’s no way Id pay money for a model that looks that gross. Ridiculous costumes aside, looking at their stats I don’t see how they can be that decisive of a unit, rending is awesome but only if you’re lucky. And id feel really awkward and stupid using space clowns. Again, I could go on lol but I’ll stop. I have considered the possibility of giving their stats a try, possibly counting my banshees as them… but the banshee ability’s are far more appealing.
Third: Swooping hawks have haywire grenades 0_o. Aren’t they like almost always auto glance and on a 6 pen? I think my army as is has considerable AA but having to change my list because of the Wraithguard issue would limit their flexibility and with that I would think swooping hawks are a must. Not to say that I didn’t consider warp spiders. I like the strength 6 on em… But I guess I’m a little too paranoid about tanks. I’ve seen an AA lacking army against an armored battalion and it wasn’t pretty. Lol. So I do my best to avoid the scenario at all costs.
But what’s glorious about the hawks is whatever type of army I’m fighting I’m already equipped to deal with. Horde or armor they can help out. 24” assault 2 guns, 12” assault, and haywire grenades? I admire their versatility. They just sound great to me.
Well I’m rethinking the list, and while looking over the codex…
Guardian jet bikes, minimum squad size 3. Saim-hann
Rangers, minimum squad size 5. Alaitoc.
Why do they get troops like that? Lol. I just think it’s kinda stupid that to play Iyanden as troops your squads must be max when Saim-hann and Alaitoc get to have all the fun. At least make it minimum 5 Wraithguard... But anyway, I’m working on revisions… my new list may play better actually. Same theme of course.
Last edited by Delpheus; October 25th, 2007 at 03:18.
And ditto on the harlequins. If I'm on the receiving end, I don't want to get trashed by a bunch of lame clowns. But then again I'd love to blast them to bits.
EDIT: I think new jetbikes are coming out, might want to wait for them. Rangers rock though
My new list has been edited into first post. Tell me what you think.
Thank you for brining the legal issues to my attention Deathboon.
I love Doom and it works extremely well in combination with your str 3 banshees. What do you plan to use Fortune on? With the short range and line of site need to use Mind War you may not have many opportunities to put it to use.Farseer-178 (Role: Support)
Runes of warding and witnessing
(Eldritch storm seemed cool because of the ord blast, but doom has a 24Ē rangeÖ)She won't share furious charge but she is still a very solid character. That said, you should seriously consider using Yriel (the special character autarch). Not only does he fit the background of your army, he is hard as nails. Most importantly, he provides +1 to reserve rolls which will really help your army in escalation missions.NEW: Jain Zar-190 (Role: Banshee Exarch, CC domination)
(Now that I had to squeeze the wraith guard into elites and I wanted to keep 2 squads of them, with the extra points I brought along a phoenix lord, who would be joined to my banshees making them fearless. And does she share the furious charge with her unit?)
How do you plan to get these to battle? I don't see much reason for your opponent to advance on you. This means that they will be running across the field and will most likely be shot to death the first round they are visible. Consider getting a serpent for this squad or, better yet, reducing their size and swapping a Wraithlord for a Falcon. 5 Banshees (including 1 exarch) + Yriel in a Falcon are quite nasty. I can understand if you don't want to do this based on your asthetic/background preferences.Modification: 1 team of 10 banshees-160 (Role: CC horde)
(Made it one unit lead by Jain. Sounds like a better idea actually.)
Not bad at all. Try to find the points to give each unit a Warlock with a Singing Spear and the Destructor power. These will make your units more reliable (no wraith sight), add another str9 anti-armor shot, and shore up your anti-horde power with a Str5 Ap4 template.Modification: 2 teams of 5 Wraithguard in serpents-369 (Role: anti-heavy infantry, anti-armor, or CC support)
(Got rid of a team, upped squad size by 2, and moved em to elites to make em legal.)
These are ok. They will get shot to death rather frequently but that could be ok. One problem with most Iyanden lists is that they mix t3, as4+ models with t6, as6" models. It really makes targetting decisions very easy for your opponent. Shoot the Anti-Tank stuff at the tanks and wraithguard, shoot the Anti-infantry stuff at the 4+ save aspect warriors.Modifications: 2 teams of 5 dire avengers, 1 of them Exarch-117 (Role: anti-horde, and more CC support)
(To account for 2 troops I took 2 minimum squads of avengers. If you couldnít tell, I like a lot of small teams whenever possible. Morale is an issue, but theyíre LD 9 which is cool and Iím sure the enemy will be much more distracted by the horde of fearless banshees and the 10 Wraithguard anyway, not to mention 3 Wraithlords. But Iím sure the avengers can hold their own in a small group. Well have to see.)
Since you have such small squads consider giving both an exarch with twin-shuriken catapults. With 4 shots at bs5 they really do add an appreciable amount of firepower for relatively few points.I have to agree with earlier posters. Hawks just aren't very good. They are extremely fragile, expensive, and their guns don't make much of an impression. Intercepting haywire grenades are ok but it is quite difficult to get an intact squad in a position to use them.swooping hawks (Unchanged.)These are decent choices and certainly beautiful models. I would recommend using them more as a long range fire base then as close combat monsters. They are slow and only have 2 attacks. Even with the re-roll from the wraithblades they just don't do that much damage in close combat and will often go down to squad level powerfists or rending attacks. If you can find the points I would strongly recommend equiping them with either the Brightlance/Missile Launcher combination for anti-tank or a ShurikenCannon/ScatterLaser combo for anti-troop.Wraithlords (Unchanged.)
I'll say this about Harlequins Vs. Banshees, so you can decide if you want to sub Harlie rules for your shee's
Rending is all about Quantity, not Quality, Harlequins on a six can wound things your banshees with strength 3 can only dream about hurting, and they get more attacks besides. The Banshee's "I Go First" ability rarely comes into play as Harlequins Initiative is already so high. I will say that Shee's may seem to have higher survivability, but its just not the case, the invulnerable save in conjunction with the movement modes means that a well placed Harlequins Squad can stay behind Area Terrain to avoid being shot up, and then run straight throug it and assault, where as the banshees diff terrain means that they are far more likely to fall short of the right charging distance, which then leaves them open to death by rapid fire.
In an Prime exampl of this I played a game where i ran a 10 man Harlequins squad, and a 10 woman Banshee squad side by side, the banshees fell to a well timed rapid fire as they did not make it through the terrain piece that the harlequins rushed right through.
They made it into assault with a 5 man Dark Angels Combat squad, annihilated it that turn, Consolidated into a Company master, killed him on my opponents turn, consolidated d6 inches shot and assaulted a ten man squad, killing all but 2, used the hit and run ability to fall back into cover, and on the following of my turns they moved fleated, and assaulted the squad that killed my banshees, killing it. In all of that i lost one model to a lucky attack by one of the 2 Dark Angels of the surviving squad. In three turns they mopped up 4 units, and suffered 1 casualty.