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I'm brand new to this WH40k / Ork lark but having bought an army ready to fight i'd really appreciate some thoughts on what army list i've put together.
If its important, i'll be playing against some Imperial Fists and i know the guy has a Venerable Dreadnought and a Predator?, although i'm not too sure if he'll be able to have both for his 1000 pts.
Anyway, my list which i've given a lot of thought too, but please just say if its sucks.....
Warboss, cyborg, eavy armour, power claw, twin linked shoota. 105pts
20 Sluggas (inc. 1 nob with bosspole, powerclaw, eavy armour) 2 normal boyz have Big Shootas
20 Shootas (inc. 1 nob with bosspole, powerclaw, eavy armour) 2 normal boyz have Rokkit Launcha Total 360pts
2 Lobba artillery
2 Killa Kans (1 with Kustom Blasta, 1 with Rokkit) Total 155pts
10 Tankbustas (inc. 1 nob with bosspole, powerclaw, eavy armour) 2 boyz with Tankhammers, 2 bomb squigs.
10 Kommando's (inc. 1 nob with bosspole, powerclaw, eavy armour), 1 boyz with Burna Total 355
Overall Total 975pts.
So, there you have it.
My rough plan was to use the Killa Kans as a shield to get my Tankbustas somewhere near his Dread / Predator. Kill troops with Lobbas and use Warboss and normal Boyz for capturing etc. Kommandos - not sure I fully understand the rules on these guys, but look as though you place them last at the start - in which case I shall put them behind his troops. Would like to have told the GM where they were (in trees etc) and have them jump out/shoot when time is right, but can't see that that is allowed?
I'd be pleased to hear your thoughts / suggestions etc on my plan and the list.
If it helps, I have other stuff and was even toying with having Lootas instead of Kommandos. I also have Stormboyz, Dreads, Trukks, more Killa Kans, more Slugga / Shootas, several Nobz and Mega's, plus a tank? etc etc etc.
Thanks in advance.
P.S. Forgot to ask. Is there any point in having Cyborg Body AND Eavy Armour on Warboss? The reason I ask is, reading the rules it looks like you can only have the best armour save anyway, which would be the Eavy Armour? Have I missed something? Cheers.
Hey Stalkersam_9, welcome to the collective Ork Waaagh! Regarding invulnerable/armor saves...
pg. 20 in 5th Edition rulebook, right column, last paragraph you'll find the rules on invulnerable saves. Essential the cybork is a back-up for when you don't get a normal armor save because it allows you a save in situations that deny you an armor save (AP4 weapons for example). Meaning you'd use the +4 save when rolling for a wound, but sometimes you won't be allowed to do this, so instead you'd still get a +5 save, no matter what (except for instant death of course)!
Because you always get the cybork save, some people just choose to take a cybork body instead because there are a lot of weapons in 40k that simply deny a +4 save anyways.
Concerning the army...
I have a feeling you choose to take the tankbustas out of fear (or glory) of destroying your opponents venerable dreadnaught and predator. I feel that it's not the best use of points to purchase tankbustas for this task for a couple of reasons:
1.) They are on foot without transport options in your list. A crafty enemy will stay just out of range and do his best to deny you of any opportunity to just "walk right up" with those tankhammers. Basically you could easily be out manuevered.
2.) The tankbusta's best weapons appear to be assualt based (tankhammer and busta bombs). Otherwise they are just a unit of BS2 orks shooting rockets, in which case I believe you might have underestimated other options viability at scoring penetrating hits...
For example, you're taking Killa Kans as a screen for the tankbustas, but they are acutally a really nice anti-tank option themselves! They have BS3 allowing them a 50% chance instead of a 33% chance to score a hit. Now currently in your list you have 2 Kan's and 7 tankbusta's who have rokkit launchers. That means they are about statistically even with each scoring a single hit per shooting phase. The difference is that the unit of tankbustas are costing you a lot more points and they aren't as resilient as the Kan's.
Speaking of other options. Warbuggies and/or deffkoptas can be equipped with twin-linked rockets. Did you know that an Ork with BS2 and a twin-linked weapon has a 55% chance of scoring a hit compared to the 50% chance a Killa Kan with BS3 and a standard rocket has of hitting?! On top of this warbuggies and deffkoptas especially are some of the most manuverable units in the ork army for their point cost. You could just sneak around and the back of the predator and fire away at the soft backsides.
So, I got a bit wordy...but the point is that I'd trade in the tankbustas for some twin-linked rocket buggies and/or deffkoptas or you could get more killa kans. Either way I think you'd be saving yourself points that could be spent on more boyz to flesh out your troop choices.
Hope that helps!
Really appreciate the help and advice.
Annoyingly, i'd read the bit about the invunerable saves but still somehow got it in my head that it was just a type of armour save. Cyborg and eavy armour it is then.
On to the army.
I'm really pleased you've gone into the maths here regarding killing tanks as it seems a good way to approach it for a beginner like me. Its easy to just look at weapon strength and not take into account other factors like rate of fire etc.
You're also spot on - I am afraid that his heavy stuff will cull my troops in a flash and was intending to make killing these units a priority.
Having no buggies of koptas but having read another thread on how best to kill tanks, how about I swap the Tankbustas for some Nobz or even Mega nobz in Trukks. I have two Trukks and quite a few of each of the Boyz. This way I can give them / they'll have in the case of the Mega nobz, PK's to do the damage?
Other than that, I do have two other Killa Kans that I could fit in somewhere?
Thanks again for your advice.
Glad you found some good threads on Tank Killing. Nobz with powerklaws seem to be a mainstay of tanking killing, so that's a great choice if you can put them in a Trukk or on Bikes to get them up close and personal. Using numbers to analysis relative effectiveness is just a habit I have, but I find that it helps me better understands how a unit might work even when I don't have that much experience using them. Sometimes though it's hard to quantify a units abilities without a lot of play experience. For example...
Another unit a couple of other Ork Warbosses have suggested as a backup to tank hiting are lootas! With the volume of an entire unit of lootas with their long range and shooting str7 shots at the side of a predator the odds start to turn in your favor that you'll shake it or even score a penetrating hit! I guess I'd never thought to take them for tank hitting myself, but they are in my army so I could always use them if I don't have a more viable target.
Fitting in the extra Killa Kan is really your choice I believe. Kan's won't suffer from the leadership test in shooting phases so having a small unit of 2 or 3 is fine. They are just great because they have the best BS in the enitre Ork army so I plan on using mine for heavy shooting support with Kustom Mega Blasters.
Thanks again for your reply, and sorry for the delay in replying.
I'm glad you think the Trukk + Nobz with PK's is a good idea.
Now its just a case of deciding whether to go with that option or the Loota idea as I really like the fact that they can shoot from 48 inches away as the table we use is only 54 inches long so they should be pretty effective.
I'll let you know my final army choice and i'll try and report after the big day on 1st Feb.
P.S. This is a full pic of my Warboss. The whole army is pretty much painted to this standard which I think is quite nice. ; ) http://www.berkeleyjames.com/pdf/Document1.pdf