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I have been using this list (a slightly modified version for 1850pt tournaments...add another Raider Squad and Ravager) heavily for the past couple of years, its fast; hits hard in H2H and has lots of heavy firepower and anti-tank weapons. The Ravagers are one of my favourite units, they chew through my opponents infantry units. The biggest drawback is the number of Killpoints in my army. This roster alone is 14 my 1850 is 17. I have done really well with this setup in tournaments.
HQ: Archon with Incubi Retinue ( 8 ) in Raider: 435
- Combat Drugs
- Animus Vitae
- Tormentor Helm
- Trophy Rack
- Hell Mask
- Shadow Field
- Scaling Nets
HQ: Dracon with Incubi Retinue ( 8 ) in Raider 335
- Tormentor Helm
- Scaling Nets
TRP: Raider Squad ( 10 ): 150 x 3
- 2x Darklance
- 2x Blaster
HS: Ravager: 140 x 2
- 3x Disintegrators
Last edited by vasjendas; March 5th, 2010 at 19:29.
Raider squads can only take 1 heavy and 1 special weapon, dont worry about additions just take 5 with a blaster in each(coz if youve got out of the raider either 1. your doing it wrong, 2. you have been shot out and are about to die
also take 3 dark lances on one ravager, if its a tourny you wil need AT
should have freed up 225pts, thats another ravager with night shields, and you can get 10 warriors with 2 dark lances to objctive camp
hope this helps
Last edited by Collins254; March 6th, 2010 at 09:18.
For me too many times having 10 warrior models in raiders has saved the game because they can survive their vehicle and they can still move to capture, you squeeze down to 5 to min/max points and I loose the ability to capture objectives. In an objective based game it only takes my oponent to make sure they destory my raiders (which isn't very hard with armor 10 ) and the unit becomes useless if it can survive the explosion (on average 3 warriors take wounds) with 2 models left taking a break test.
With the 5 raiders all with DL and the raider squads with DL and Blaster (8 DL and 3 Blasters in total) I have found I dont need to outfit and waste a ravager outfitted with DLs the Disintegarator is too versatile.
I have found Dark Eldar to be too fragile to min/max points to squeeze out more units and in exchnage make 3 scoring units vulnerable to a single shot it just doesn't make sense.
how do the 2x incubi retinues work for you? i haven't used them before, but 2??? i think i could see it work quite well. the rest of your list tho, is VERRY similar to what i have been running for my tournies lately! having 3 raider squads with blasters + lances has worked wonders for me, it's all the anti tank i need. and damn those twin ravagers can wreck havock! my current record is tabling an oponent in 3 turns while only suffering an immobalised ravager..... lol i love dark eldar!
Last edited by Alphatwitch; March 11th, 2010 at 09:03.
Dark Eldar: 9/1/2 Winning streak: 6
Tyranids: 16/3/4 Winning Streak: 8
inquisition:4/0/3 Winning streak:0
It makes me wonder too about that much of point sinks into incubi retinue. You have half or your army in HQ. You would lose any objective based game: they only need to shoot your three troops and they are sure about a draw...
Can you HQ withstand being swamped by opponents? Sure you have a 3+ save on the Incubi but with enough attacks they will die!
As I see it now you only have 7 DL in this build of which 2 won't be used first turn (on your HQ Raiders, which will flat out for 4+ cover) and 3 that can only be fired when stationnary (in the raider squads). I would think you can use some more AT because even our über-HQ can't pop open a Rhino effectively.
A last question I have: how do you use the scaling nets? I have never thought of them to be worth their points, except of course to screen your unit from counter charges. Especially the penalty of making you Raider more vulnarable to CC (4+ 2 hit instead of 6+) made me incline not to use the nets.
I would like to read your general strategy and tactics in using this list.
A little hint: your Dracon can switch its tormentor helm for a Splinter pistiol because an agoniser is a single handed weapon = 4 points less cost.
2 HQ w incubi have always been devastating, with most lists at this point value you generally only have to deal with 1 nasty H2H unit. And most opponents compensate for this by locating that unit and shooting the crud out of it. With 2 I have always had at least one hit H2H and walk through most of my opponents units. When both hit my opponents just lost 2 major units and I haven’t lost much in casualties. With regards to saves and being swamped Incubi 80% of the time are hitting first, with a 5 initiative not many units survive 24+ power weapon attacks at WS5 STR4 (Math is 16 hits wounding with 8 power weapon attacks against a T4 unit).
Troops in an objective based game...my opponents are worried about shooting at my HQ and Heavy Support; they are too devastating to leave alone, I never have an issue in objective based games, the only games which I fight tooth and nail for a win is Killpoint based because of the extremely high amount from all the vehicles and retinues.
The DL on the raiders are there to harass and take out hiding armour once the HQs have disembarked, the scaling nets are a staple it allows for more flexibility with disembarking/embarking, allows for my raider to screen if needed or block movement. If you’re moving raiders 24" and sitting them in front of a unit to be hit by H2H next turn unless it is on purpose your doing something wrong.
It is all about mobility, this army does not need to jump on an objective and hold it for 4/5 turns; with a 24” move to contest or take objectives it’s all about out manoeuvring opponents and forcing them to make a grab/mistake. On some missions the deployment is sometimes not a good situation, with everything able to make a 24” move I have been able to repost my entire army into better positioning and leave my opponent nothing to go after.
HQ: The Raiders can move 12” and still fire their DL so why move 24” in the first turn unless you need to make up 36” for turn 2 to hit H2H? It also projects your charge target to your opponent on your first turn allowing him at least 1 turn to manoeuvre or to counter. You are not hitting H2H first turn unless your opponent is starting only 18” away. 2 x 12” moves a 0-2” disembark and 6” charge makes it 30-32” overall to hit H2H which has always been more than enough. The HQs are all about hitting H2H I generally lead my Archon against my opponents key unit (their HQ or an elite unit mostly), the Dracon goes for scoring units or an infantry Heavy Squad or because of having the agonizer a high toughness model. The Raiders with scaling nets will go after armour hiding in the back behind cover or act as a screen from ranged weapons for my HQ which is generally out of H2H quickly and vulnerable.
Ravagers target infantry units first, and transports second and Armour as a last resort.
Raiders stay out of range/behind cover as much as possible while keeping LOS for armour, and staying within striking range of objectives (I love 24” movement) if my opponent drops infantry models anywhere close I move as many raiders into range as possible and use my open tops to shoot the crud out of them with everything that can fire (on avg. 2 Lances and 8 Splinter Rifles, if I don’t need to move its 3 Lances and 8 splinter rifles).
Thanks for the Tormentor helm reminder, I had him equipped at one point with a Punisher and just swapped weapons.
When I hit higher point games like 1850 I am running another Ravager and 2 x 3 model Reaver Squads (with 2 blasters) for tank hunting.
My most memorable game with this list was against necrons and I forced a 1st turn win (my oponent had tightly grouped warriors out in the open and those ravager shots were hitting 5-6 models a template for 15-18 warriors a Ravager, he lost 2 20 model units first turn (one broke and ran off the table, the other was down to 2 models). and my raiders all took out his Lord and destroyers.
I looks like a very potent list because of the disballance, which is represented in the number of killpoints. I can see this list going wrong if your opponent has some Plasma Cannons to fire your HQ after they have wiped an enemy in CC. Of course, that's why you have the scaling nets on the raiders: to block those LoS lanes.
But what do you do when you don't have first turn? You just keep everything in reserver and hope for the best on reserve rolls? Do you set up all skimmers which can hide behind cover? It can be very annoying to have your HQ raiders stunned every turn.
That's the problem I have with this list: it is so unbalanced that you can whipe any squat you opponent has in 1 turn: those 24 PW ST4 on the charge + 6 PW ST5(6): eats through anything in one turn. But one lousy stunned result on your raider stops all that killyness for 1 turn. If even worse: your Raider get popped before the HQ is delivered... They wont make it footslogging.