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[1750] An Experiment

1K views 15 replies 5 participants last post by  GDMNW 
#1 ·
Well, I have found that the normal types of lists (Mech, Hybrid and static) don't work around in my area.

So after some pondering I came up with this list, there may be a few things you'll note...

1] The Fire Warriors: I made them small squads and gave them Carbines to enhance thier mobility. As they are now they have an effective range of 24", can hide behind smaller pieces of terrain and can still work together by concentrating fire on specific targets.

2] The Mounted Fire Warriors: I'm finding that everytime I leap out with my devilfishes I'm Either destroyed next turn or I don't do enough damage to the enemy, so I decided to mount up a SMS to let hide and shoot the enemy waiting for a good oppertunity to pull a move.

3] Vespids: Biggest problem I had with these guys is that they simply don't have the volume of fire needed to thin an enemy (unless your lucky) down enough so he doesn't hurt you just as much in his turn, So I plan on using them in sync with the Gun Drones to help as a semi-meat shield and to add thier accurate pinning shots to the mix of the Vespid's High AP shots.

4] Gun Drones: Will most Likely work with the Vespids but may also act as a wild card to be deep struck to surround an exposed unit or to provide support to an ally.

5] Crisis Suits: The Helios Suits will work with the commander to put the hurt on armor and MEQs while the suits cover the commander so hes never shot at as the closest target as long as then are alive, or course. The Fireknifes will be more oppertunists, deploying and attacking in support of other units rather than trying to attack a squad on thier own. The Missile Pod Suits (I forget the code name) will sit back and rain missiles on tagets like Wraithlords and transports or small squads of speciallist troops like Dark Reapers.

6] Hammerheads: Call it Cheesy, Call it beardy I don't care because I'm tired of my most of 2 Hammerheads blown up first turn time and time again!

I think that covers everything but the actual list...

HQ (87)

- Shas’el
---Fusion Blaster
---Plasma Rifle
---Multi Track
Total:87

Elites (344)

- Crisis Team 1
---2 Shas’ui
-----Plasma Rifle
-----Missile Pod
-----Multi Tracker
Total:124

- Crisis Team 2
---2 Shas’ui
-----Plasma Rifle
-----Fusion Blaster
-----Multi Tracker
Total:124

- Crisis Team 3
---2 Shas’ui
-----Twin-Linked Missile Pods
-----Target Lock
Total:124

Troops (455)

- Fire Warrior Team 1
---1 Shas’ui
---11 Shas’la
---Devilfish
-----Smart Missile System
-----Decoy Launchers
-----Multi-Tracker
Total:245

- Fire Warrior Team 2
---1 Shas’ui
---5 Shas’la
---Pulse Carbines
Total:70

- Fire Warrior Team 3
---1 Shas’ui
---5 Shas’la
---Pulse Carbines
Total:70

- Fire Warrior Team 4
---1 Shas’ui
---5 Shas’la
---Pulse Carbines
Total:70


Fast Attack (334)

- Vespid Stingwings
---1 Strain Leader
---9 Stingwings
Total:166

- Gun Drone Squadron 1
---7 Gun Drones
Total:84

- Gun Drone Squadron 1
---7 Gun Drones
Total:84


Heavy Support (530)

- Hammerhead
---Railgun
---Smart Missile System
---Target Lock
---Multi-Tracker
---Decoy Launchers
Total:180

- Hammerhead
---Railgun
---Smart Missile System
---Target Lock
---Multi-Tracker
---Decoy Launchers
Total:180


- Hammerhead
---Railgun
---Burst Cannons
---Target Lock
---Multi-Tracker
---Decoy Launchers
Total:170


Army Total:1750

Well?

PS: Please give reasons for your statements, I and many others would appreciate it.

Mike
 
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#2 ·
Hmmmm. Well let us see....

Your commander, and your suits, need shield drones. Your commander should have two, the other sqauds at least one. You don't want a lucky battle cannon or what not to take out the entire squad do you? What about lascannons, missile launchers, plasma and melta weapons? I have never fielded a commander without his trusty shield drones hovering nearby. Have you considered trading a hammerhead for two (I think that works for points) broadsides? They kill all tanks and are very nice for termi hunting.

Stealthsuits are a very hard hitting, fast unit. I would suggest trading out the firewarriors and devilfish for a full sqaud of these guys. SJS is a great tactic, giving them a 24 inch range and being able to get back in cover. The stealth field is also a life saver.

With any points left after that flesh out one pulse carbine squad to a full 12 man pulse rifle squad. Use them in conjunction with the carbines to pincer enemies. A space marine assault squad might not fear just one squad of firewarriors, but when two jump out from either side, and a 6 suit stealth team bursts throught he woods, The marines stand no chance.

I think your army is all about timing. Charge in too soon with suits and they will die. Allow your enemy to come to you, and maybe move forward slightly. After your suits have obliterated what he has sent at you, clean him up with suits and hammer heads. Just because Tau shoot well doesn't mean they have to start shooting right away. Use cover, set traps! Tau firewarriors in conjunction with fast hitting suits such as the suits with Flamers and Plasma Rifles are devestating againts heavy infantry. Loads of shots plus some good AP can tip the scales.

That is all I can think of. I love to build army lists, and seem to have an ability of making kick butt lists out of thin air. I am the tactician of my club so I would love to continue this conversation. Run some scenarios you been through in the past and I will see what I can do to help tweak the list to be able to deal with anything.

Jack
 
#3 ·
Your commander, and your suits, need shield drones. Your commander should have two, the other sqauds at least one. You don't want a lucky battle cannon or what not to take out the entire squad do you?
If all the models are under a Blast Template they all take a hit, so throwing in shield drones is like throwing good points away.
What about lascannons, missile launchers, plasma and melta weapons? I have never fielded a commander without his trusty shield drones hovering nearby.
No Offence, but if you let your commander be the target of such weapons, you either need to rethink your tactics or re-read Pg.51 of the BGB under "Shooting At Characters"
Have you considered trading a hammerhead for two (I think that works for points) broadsides? They kill all tanks and are very nice for termi hunting.
I tried Broadsides once, and yeah, when the enmy is dumb enough to get in LOS of Broadsides then yeah they work. I'd be lucky to get to shoot once with either of my Broadsides, back then they were in seperate squads, so technically I should have gotten lots of shots off, but there simply too immobile, droping a Hammerhead for 2 Broadsides in one squad would be like shooting myself in the foot.
Stealthsuits are a very hard hitting, fast unit. I would suggest trading out the firewarriors and devilfish for a full sqaud of these guys. SJS is a great tactic, giving them a 24 inch range and being able to get back in cover. The stealth field is also a life saver.
I've used them too, and the thing is, they can work, they have worked for me, but the Suits I have fielded have worked so much harder for less points, I had 2 TL MP Suits take out 2 Wraithlords, an Avatar and several Dark Reapers out in one game, I will admit that a Railgun accounts for 2 Wraithlord wounds but the other 4 were all by those suits.
With any points left after that flesh out one pulse carbine squad to a full 12 man pulse rifle squad.
Going along with a basic army set up kinda goes against the whole Experiment thing, I want these squads small because in a sense it makes them so much more capable. They can hide in smaller pieces of terrain, they can move between cover more effeciently and because there are more targets it takes more squads to wipe them out, I admit they are flimsy, but used in a Guerilla(sp?) tactics, they can be a moving and pinning thorn in my opponent's side.
The marines stand no chance.
Not something I'd live by, Just because our weapons are stronger than bolters doesn't mean the'll fall. I once blasted a Rhino with over 50 Pulse weapon HITS and didn't do more than shake it. Thats anougher reason I want 3 Hammerheads, they can concentrate on wasting the enemy armor while my Suits (my 3 Helios in particular) whittle the emey down.
I think your army is all about timing. Charge in too soon with suits and they will die. Allow your enemy to come to you, and maybe move forward slightly. After your suits have obliterated what he has sent at you, clean him up with suits and hammer heads. Just because Tau shoot well doesn't mean they have to start shooting right away. Use cover, set traps! Tau firewarriors in conjunction with fast hitting suits such as the suits with Flamers and Plasma Rifles are devestating againts heavy infantry. Loads of shots plus some good AP can tip the scales.
Not timing, I personnaly feel that in a game that only strenches 6 turns, you can't plan around timing, especially not with such small armies, in Epic sized games, sure timing can have an effect, because you have much more to wrk with in units and time to begin with.

I feel this is more planned around mobility. Even the Carbine Warriors are mobile due to thier smaller size and assault weapons. One of the problems I had with my Mech List was that, yeah I was fast, but when I got to where I was going, I didn't have enough to do the kind of damage I needed to do. So with this list, I over came some of the shortcomings of my old list, like the Hammerheads. (at 1750 points, 1 isn't enough even if you DO have a Skyraytoo! :S) and my lack of high AP weapons, which my new Helios suits should help out with.

Sorry if this post came out in a negative way, I've been told I'm not good at communicationg my ideas and that May be true, but sometimes, the people listening can't keep up with me!

Also, I'm just suprised you didn't even mention the Vespids or Gun Drones even in passing, I'd just like ot know why.

Mike
 
#4 ·
As to the Gun Drones and Vespids

I did not mention gun drones becuase they hit on 5's right? They can be useful for certain things, but for the most part I have not dealt with them that much and never seen them used effectively.

Shield Drones: Guess I haven't played tau seriously in three years? Oh well, as to the blast template part you are right, but having an invulnerable on such character is a must have due to the one lucky krak missile that could kill him outright, toughness 4 right?
As to the re-thinking tactics, a Tau commander can't truly traverse an entire board unseen and unshot at. He just can't. He can deepstrike, but then he is in the line of fire for one turn, and that is all it takes. In one guard army I fielded 6 Missile Launchers, 6 Lascannons, and 3 Battle Cannons. There is a good chance he would have gone down. I know the ordanance no longer kills outright, but the lascannons and missile launchers do.

Really the rest of it is play style. I agree with your comment on timing, guess I didn't communicate right. I meant more of timing in the sense of tactics and hitting your oppenent at the right time, with the right weapon(s) and crippling their army. It sounds like those Helios are working out for you.

I am really into this 3 Hammerhead thing you have going. They don't have quite the pie template death dealing strength as the good 'ol leman russ, but they can rip apart a tank like its nobodies buisness. I would love to play against this army with my Scouts. Seems like the list is almost refined.

Now it seems like you are all set in the anti tank category, have you considered giving Marker Lights to those pulse carbine squads? I don't know the new rules for em but I am thinking that would help guide in a few seeker missiles or hammerhead shots.

Now if used right, I can see how Stingwings can be a very key unit. They wouldn't be able to stand up to a turn or two of bolter fire, but maybe a devastator unit could use its wings clipped? I overlooked them in your list thinking it was a smaller squad. Sorry.

Now when I said the space marines have no chance I was talking pure volume of fire, plus the rapid firing plasma weaponry and flamers. Now it seems that may not be the road for you due to horrible luck. I once stopped a rhino mounted sisters of battle army in one turn, albeit some extremely good luck. At least 5 rhinos immobilized, sitting still waiting to get shot at next turn, or destroyed. All of that from pulse rifles. Maybe you could call that amazing luck.

I enjoy talking to you about this, even if I feel like an unsupervised game store kid when I say something wrong or get a rule mixed up. Keep me posted on list updates and what not

Jack
 
#5 · (Edited)
I did not mention gun drones becuase they hit on 5's right? They can be useful for certain things, but for the most part I have not dealt with them that much and never seen them used effectively.
I like Gun Drones becuase they are deadly throw-away units, they can't be ignored and can do almost anything you put them too with a little luck...

Shield Drones: Guess I haven't played tau seriously in three years? Oh well, as to the blast template part you are right, but having an invulnerable on such character is a must have due to the one lucky krak missile that could kill him outright, toughness 4 right?
I think your thinking that Shield Drones give the Suit an Inv. Save, which I can tell you they don't. Plus, why would I want to spend money on a 'throw-away' unit? I made him cheap for a purpose!
As to the re-thinking tactics, a Tau commander can't truly traverse an entire board unseen and unshot at. He just can't. He can deepstrike, but then he is in the line of fire for one turn, and that is all it takes. In one guard army I fielded 6 Missile Launchers, 6 Lascannons, and 3 Battle Cannons. There is a good chance he would have gone down. I know the ordanance no longer kills outright, but the lascannons and missile launchers do.
Based on the Shooting at IC rules and that I plan to have the Helios squad between the enemy and the Helios commander, he can technically never be targeted but a weaon, and seeing as Barrage, the Guess range weapons of the 4th edition, don't target per-se, I'm right. Throw that with J-S-J and unless the enemy deisdes to go out of thier way to completly waste the Helios suits, they could last the whole game.


Really the rest of it is play style. I agree with your comment on timing, guess I didn't communicate right. I meant more of timing in the sense of tactics and hitting your oppenent at the right time, with the right weapon(s) and crippling their army. It sounds like those Helios are working out for you.
What are you talking about, I came up wit this list while X-mas shopping today! NEver used Helios yet...
I am really into this 3 Hammerhead thing you have going. They don't have quite the pie template death dealing strength as the good 'ol leman russ, but they can rip apart a tank like its nobodies buisness.
Don't under estimate those Pie plates, even if they are weaker, the'll obliterate anything under them, even MEQs to an extent, thats the great thing about having 3 Hammerheads, the Missile Suits andthe Helios, once the Tanks are down, the Hammerheads can start having fun at the enemy troop's expence!
Now it seems like you are all set in the anti tank category, have you considered giving Marker Lights to those pulse carbine squads? I don't know the new rules for em but I am thinking that would help guide in a few seeker missiles or hammerhead shots.
Woun't do it, it ruins thier mobility, plus even with 3 of them and hte way my army is set up, they wouldn't be able to make any of the juicy targets and the closest thing I have to an infantry grinder is my Mounted FW squad which might not always for with the Markerlights. I feel that unless your list is centered around them, MArkerlights can end up reducing teh effectieness of the rest of your army.
Now if used right, I can see how Stingwings can be a very key unit. They wouldn't be able to stand up to a turn or two of bolter fire, but maybe a devastator unit could use its wings clipped? I overlooked them in your list thinking it was a smaller squad. Sorry.
Plus they work well with either the Helios or the Fireknifes (for going after MEQs) and still have the option as a counter charge unit or go Guerilla style and hide out ready to strike with thier speed and terrain-oriented special rule.
GuerillaI enjoy talking to you about this, even if I feel like an unsupervised game store kid when I say something wrong or get a rule mixed up. Keep me posted on list updates and what not.[/quote]
We've all been there, no worries! I myslef have come a long way in 2 years!

Mike
 
#6 · (Edited)
I would read it but....

Oh, that is nice with the targeting of IC. Thanks for bringing that to my attention!

I see what you mean about gun drones, and I will have to watch out for them now. Maybe when I pick up Tau again, who knows when that will be, I will look into them some more. What will your basic tactic style be? Does your force pivot around a certain center point of the army, or will they be pretty free roaming.

Well It looks like you have this all planned out. A guy in my local gaming store is working on a Tau Special Forces army, so when I get a chance to play him I will tell you what I see has worked, and what hasn't. He is making extensive use of pathfinders though. Have you considered mounting a unit of Pathfinders instead of the firewarriors, or at least giving part of that squad carbines? It seems like thier range would be limited after they get out of the devilfish for the first time, and that they would get ripped to shreds?

Oh well. gonna head out to my friends where the rulebook is and the old tau codex, maybe pick up some information so I am a little more informed. Good luck, Nice talking to you.

Jack
 
#7 ·
Oh, that is nice with the targeting of IC. Thanks for bringing that to my attention!
No Problem, you'd be surprised at how many players I've shown that rule to in the middle of tourney matches!

What will your basic tactic style be?
To put it simply oppertunist and individual. I'll jump at oppertunities, so long as any consquences are acceptable as in the past I've lost games to being just a bit too cautious. and individual becuase each unit is on it's own, the fact that they happen to fire at the smae target is coincidental mostly. ;D
Does your force pivot around a certain center point of the army, or will they be pretty free roaming.
I've seen way too many armies that relied on a single unit of tactic to win them the game fall apart as soon as that unit because weak or r the tactic is denied. This is Why I don't liek Markerlights, you can end up puuting so many points into them that your army isn't effective enough to do any serious damage if you don't get any/enough Markerlight hits.

Well It looks like you have this all planned out. A guy in my local gaming store is working on a Tau Special Forces army, so when I get a chance to play him I will tell you what I see has worked, and what hasn't.
That'd be great, Try to play him soon!

Mike
 
#8 ·
I know what you mean

I know what you mean about losing one unit and losing the game. I have avoided that with my scout list, keeping everything mobile, either by deployment or movement style, and then taking out key units the enemy would rahter not have taken out. They have served me well, and are up for their second full tourny after christmas
 
#12 · (Edited)
EDIT: Ok just read your reply, you did not make it clear about the barrage, but using XV8's to protect your commander is a definate no, no, no, they are to valuable, as for the list well heres my opinion, though you may not like it.

Well, I have found that the normal types of lists (Mech, Hybrid and static) don't work around in my area.

So after some pondering I came up with this list, there may be a few things you'll note...

1] The Fire Warriors: I made them small squads and gave them Carbines to enhance thier mobility. As they are now they have an effective range of 24", can hide behind smaller pieces of terrain and can still work together by concentrating fire on specific targets.
Hows that then, an effective range of 24" compared to 30+ inches for rifles plus rifles are rapid fire which gives them twice the shots at 12", sorry I am puzzled as to why exactly you think carbines offer more mobility or are indeed the better option

2] The Mounted Fire Warriors: I'm finding that everytime I leap out with my devilfishes I'm Either destroyed next turn or I don't do enough damage to the enemy, so I decided to mount up a SMS to let hide and shoot the enemy waiting for a good oppertunity to pull a move.
Well ths is more about tactical play than the FW, you need to think about how your using them, if your going to shoot a unit of 9 Marines well make sure your in rapid fire distance and have ML support, if not dont shoot em, try targeting units with saves 4+ or higher saves, I for instance do not go after termies with FW but I will target scouts, its all about tactical use

3] Vespids: Biggest problem I had with these guys is that they simply don't have the volume of fire needed to thin an enemy (unless your lucky) down enough so he doesn't hurt you just as much in his turn, So I plan on using them in sync with the Gun Drones to help as a semi-meat shield and to add their accurate pinning shots to the mix of the Vespid's High AP shots.
Vespids suck worse than pirahnas, there is simply no reason to take these, they do not perform and the points it costs to take such an ineffectual unit impact twice on your list because your losing something useful to afford them, forget them.

4] Gun Drones: Will most Likely work with the Vespids but may also act as a wild card to be deep struck to surround an exposed unit or to provide support to an ally.
Gun drones are Ok at DS but I use a squad to protect my Shas'El (using hs IC rules) and they offer substantial fire support to him, I pop transports and shoot the passangers with the drones (the Shas'El is not attached to the drones so they can fire at the passangers).
I would only take 1 unit if I were you and use the points saved on something more useful

5] Crisis Suits: The Helios Suits will work with the commander to put the hurt on armor and MEQs while the suits cover the commander so hes never shot at as the closest target as long as then are alive, or course. The Fireknifes will be more oppertunists, deploying and attacking in support of other units rather than trying to attack a squad on thier own. The Missile Pod Suits (I forget the code name) will sit back and rain missiles on tagets like Wraithlords and transports or small squads of speciallist troops like Dark Reapers.
Using XV8's to protect your commander is a stupid waste, use the drones (do a search for circular drone technique), the XV8's should be spread out over the field hitting seperate targets and diluting the opponents fire, placing all your suits in one area of the table is just tacticaly suicidal, the commander can use ANY unit to stop himself being targeted so use something cheap not your valuable XV8's, you really need to do some re-thinking of tactical play dude.

6] Hammerheads: Call it Cheesy, Call it beardy I don't care because I'm tired of my most of 2 Hammerheads blown up first turn time and time again!
3 Hammerheads with railguns, burst canons, multi and decoys is not cheesy, infact every list at 1500 and over should have 3, forget snipers and broadsides (OK maybe a team if your that way out) 3 HH is the way to go.

I think from reading into your posts that its not the list thats at fault, its your tactical play, I do not mean to be harsh when I say that, its just soe of the things you have listed and the reasons for them just dont seem to make much sense (protecting a commander with XV8's for instance and the carbines) and Vespids dude naaaaaah
 
#13 ·
I'm not sure the issue is as much MiketehFox's sense of tactical play as it is him being stuck between a list and a play style. Is this an experiment with the conventional play style and an unorthodox list, or is it completely unorthodox? A bit more information on how you actually plan on playing this list would help clear this up.

I would agree with his choice of carbines on his FW squads, as they offer a degree of mobility different from pulse rifles. Yes, their maximum effective range is only 24", which pales to the rifle's 30", but you can't hop around a corner and shoot 18" with a pulse rifle, among other things. With normal Tau lists, people expect you to sit and shoot or FoF, but have probably never seen a pulse carbine before.

However, I'm wondering what exactly you plan on doing with the mounted squad. Having them pop out and finish off squads sounds good, but isn't that what normal Mech FW squads do? Since you're experimenting, I say go all the way and drop the mounted squad for two more carbine squads. A larger number of footslogging squads will help with your limited movement range. In addition, if you play your cards right, you could have your opponent rolling a lot of pinning tests.

As for having the suits protect the commander, it may not be a problem unless you plan on standing out in the open, or are playing a very mobile, shooty army. I agree with Rikimaru that suits are too expensive to be used as meatshields, and seeing as your commander is a Helios, it wouldn't hurt to have the drones around him when/if your other suits pop.

While I disagree with Riki's statement that Piranah's suck, I have to wonder what exactly do you plan on doing with the Vespid? The only thing I can imagine is having them jumping between FW teams to finish off stragglers, but like Riki said, they're extremely expensive, and with a bunch of Helios suits, there should be no reason that any high save units should get that close to the FWs.

Simply put, I love gun drones. That being said, its obvious I'm a carbine kind of guy. If you're serious about the carbine warriors, keep the gun drones, maybe dropping them down to squads of 6, but don't deep strike them unless you're feeling lucky or particularily daring. Just keep them in front of your FW teams or near the suits/commander.

And finally, there's the three hammerheads. No, its definately nowhere near cheesy or beardy if you ask me. A hammerhead doesn't JSJ, needs LoS, and is not too hard to destroy with the right tools.
 
#14 ·
I'm not sure the issue is as much MiketehFox's sense of tactical play as it is him being stuck between a list and a play style. Is this an experiment with the conventional play style and an unorthodox list, or is it completely unorthodox? A bit more information on how you actually plan on playing this list would help clear this up.
Like so? Taken from teh first Post.
Well, I have found that the normal types of lists (Mech, Hybrid and static) don't work around in my area.

So after some pondering I came up with this list, there may be a few things you'll note...

1] The Fire Warriors: I made them small squads and gave them Carbines to enhance thier mobility. As they are now they have an effective range of 24", can hide behind smaller pieces of terrain and can still work together by concentrating fire on specific targets.

2] The Mounted Fire Warriors: I'm finding that everytime I leap out with my devilfishes I'm Either destroyed next turn or I don't do enough damage to the enemy, so I decided to mount up a SMS to let hide and shoot the enemy waiting for a good oppertunity to pull a move.

3] Vespids: Biggest problem I had with these guys is that they simply don't have the volume of fire needed to thin an enemy (unless your lucky) down enough so he doesn't hurt you just as much in his turn, So I plan on using them in sync with the Gun Drones to help as a semi-meat shield and to add thier accurate pinning shots to the mix of the Vespid's High AP shots.

4] Gun Drones: Will most Likely work with the Vespids but may also act as a wild card to be deep struck to surround an exposed unit or to provide support to an ally.

5] Crisis Suits: The Helios Suits will work with the commander to put the hurt on armor and MEQs while the suits cover the commander so hes never shot at as the closest target as long as then are alive, or course. The Fireknifes will be more oppertunists, deploying and attacking in support of other units rather than trying to attack a squad on thier own. The Missile Pod Suits (I forget the code name) will sit back and rain missiles on tagets like Wraithlords and transports or small squads of speciallist troops like Dark Reapers.

6] Hammerheads: Call it Cheesy, Call it beardy I don't care because I'm tired of my most of 2 Hammerheads blown up first turn time and time again!
I don't want to say anything more specific as you never know who or what your facing.

I would agree with his choice of carbines on his FW squads, as they offer a degree of mobility different from pulse rifles. Yes, their maximum effective range is only 24", which pales to the rifle's 30", but you can't hop around a corner and shoot 18" with a pulse rifle, among other things. With normal Tau lists, people expect you to sit and shoot or FoF, but have probably never seen a pulse carbine before.
Exactly, yes Rifles have a longer range, but in orger to use that from around a building, you have to be out in the open first for a turn, and if you can see them, they can see you.
However, I'm wondering what exactly you plan on doing with the mounted squad. Having them pop out and finish off squads sounds good, but isn't that what normal Mech FW squads do? Since you're experimenting, I say go all the way and drop the mounted squad for two more carbine squads. A larger number of footslogging squads will help with your limited movement range. In addition, if you play your cards right, you could have your opponent rolling a lot of pinning tests.
I do want to add more carbine squads, but until play testing proves overwise I'll keep my Warfish Squad as I do still need something Hard Hitting, and 31 Str5 shots can do that for me.
As for having the suits protect the commander, it may not be a problem unless you plan on standing out in the open, or are playing a very mobile, shooty army. I agree with Rikimaru that suits are too expensive to be used as meatshields, and seeing as your commander is a Helios, it wouldn't hurt to have the drones around him when/if your other suits pop.
At teh time of making this list I had actually forgotten about the Drone Ring, I ready when people were argueing about it so I simply forgot. But I also plan to use my Helios together as much as mossible to provide maximum inpact against the enemy.
While I disagree with Riki's statement that Piranah's suck, I have to wonder what exactly do you plan on doing with the Vespid? The only thing I can imagine is having them jumping between FW teams to finish off stragglers, but like Riki said, they're extremely expensive, and with a bunch of Helios suits, there should be no reason that any high save units should get that close to the FWs.
In my last couple of games I found that people seemed to almost go out of their way to target my 10 Vespids, with a Chaos Player trying to lay down several DDefiler Pie plates and hitting the unit with a Daemonette charge, which I killed in CC. So I'll try a few games with them first, but I think I may reduce the number of Vespid down to 5 or 6 to again give a higher degree of 'terrain' mobility, but we'll just have to wait and see.
Simply put, I love gun drones. That being said, its obvious I'm a carbine kind of guy. If you're serious about the carbine warriors, keep the gun drones, maybe dropping them down to squads of 6, but don't deep strike them unless you're feeling lucky or particularily daring. Just keep them in front of your FW teams or near the suits/commander.
Well 7 is a nice number as in order to have below 50% you have to lose 4 drones or more and such. but I'd like to max them out just to add survivability and firepower.

If I'm lucky I may get to try this army out as early as this weekend, but we'll see.

Mike
 
#15 ·
I think.....

I think you should try out the firewarrior sqaud in Devilfish, but I think it may be better for you if they are a carbine squad. They can jump out, fire, and possibly pin an enemy unit. And the Devilfish can start 24 inches away, move 6 inches, deploy the firewarriors and they fire 18 inches, giving you a 24 inch range. The pulse rifle squad on the other hand, requires you to be within 18 inches, a dangerous distance to end your turn at because now you could be hit with melta, rapid fire plasma, etc.

Now so far what I have gathered is that you are using the Firewarriors as a hard hitting, large amount of fire unit that is mobile. If you are planning on that then what I said seems to make sense, but if you are just using them as a back up force that can offer long range firepower, what you have works.


Jack
 
#16 ·
I'm not so sure...

I have to admit it. I like you list but I am not so sure I like the style. I have posted an alternative Tau list so you can see what I mean. Thanks for your thoughts on the Vespid, although it does seem a little heavy on the rules emphasis but hey, that's how you win right?
 
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