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Normally I don't say much on these boards. I just sit there and read what you have to say, absorb what i need, make note of the rest, and adapt it all to suit my style as best i can.
Now there is one itsy bitsy thing that you can help me with, as I am coming close to my wits end.
That's right... you heard it here first... he has a necron army that makes me tremble with fear... an army so frightful, that it makes me curl up into the foetal position and soil myself... I shudder to think of our next batte.
I'll post his list for now, just so you know what i'm going against.
Destroyer lord with res orb
Lord with Veil of darkness, and res orb
Obviously the Destroyer Lord stays with the destroyers. The VoD Lord teleports the immortals around the board Getting the out of CC and proceding to Rapid fire the living Patoowey out of me.
Please Please Please... I Beg of you (now that is something EVERY Dark Eldar Archon loves the sound of), help me beat the metal men down and regain my honor.
ps. My army list can follow on here if you want, but i left it out on purpose to see what you suggest.
I could give you my own ideas, but I think there is a link that can give a simpler explanation as to what I'm thinking.....
http://www.librarium-online.com/foru...ad.php?t=90806 (List i used to win the SA regionals)
Other than that, I'd have to say
"Webway portals will help you catch the Destroyer Group",
"Lay the smackdown on those Warriors",
"Disintegrator template the non-life out of those Immortals- if all down in one turn, they can't attempt to do WBB, reguardless of Res Orb";Y, (or you can ignore that hugely shooty and expensive unit and go for Phase Out by smashing them Warriors and Destroyers.....:party
and finally, "Wakka wakka Me wants Cake" :ballon:
Necrons do have fun against the light armoured and stat-weaker Dark Eldar, but you just need to learn how to outmanouver them in one fell Swoop. Other than that, make sure you know how WBB works, and the Necrons special rules
LO RULESOriginally Posted by Jaffar_Hasad
Use your BS to your advantage. Try taking some dark lances so you can blow the hell out of the destroyers and then just take a ton of warriors. The splinter rifle has a good(ish) range, and will be able to shoot at the necs even when they are out of their own range. Also, Fast moving things are very very useful. Use maybe a ravager or two with their destructive powers against the buggers. Also, like jonesie said, the disintegrator template is your friend.
I would personally go all shooty and try my best to get phase out.
He only has 42 troops, which means if you kill 31, you make him phase out. Necrons are like SM only they come back, so they do die from shooting easy enough. Also, killing an entire unit of immortals will make them unable to WBB, and you break a large chunk out of them. I say, Blow up either the Immortals or destroyers turn one, and then get the opposite turn two. Using mandrakes you could lock up one of his units in combat (like maybe the warriors) and since you get first strike, could possibly do enough damage that they wouldn't be able to kill outright your unit, which would be what you wanted. By the time your unit ran, ot they killed it, they would be in the middle of a firing line.
Only my two cents, been away from the darkness awhile.
I look at 20 warriors @ 1500 points, and I think phase out. Try using 3x Ravagers with disentagraters and night shields. Use warriors to kill the destroyers first, then the ravagers can pretty safely dismantle his army piecemeal. You can use wytches in raiders to nail his immortals wherever they show up. That also works with characters on jetbikes or skyboards.
I like all of these suggestions - I also want to chime in how important some of the units can be.
First, Ravagers with disintegrators is a must. These won me the game once when he didn't have any long range weapons to shoot them down. The blast templates are absolutely brutal on necrons so be sure to take as many ravagers as possible.
I do like the talos as well but I think its safer to shoot than try to get this monster into CC. However, when I did use the Talos he killed 2 tomb spiders and swept 10 warriors in cc - that was fun.
Now to preserve your ravagers you will have to deal with those destroyers - to me they are priority #1. They suck in CC and even a warpbeast squad can cause them problems. I used my beasts against Heavy Destroyers and its no contest - the agoniser and the strength 4 attacks help. Once I engaged the beasts to tangle the h-destroyers I used infiltrating kroot to tackle the destroyers. If you got to use the ravagers then by all means shoot them down.
Wyches are ok against necrons. I wouldnt rely on only one squad of wyches to do to much. Just about every necron player I played against kept his troops together and just mob the wyches. The wyches will soon be over come unless they have support - especially if the necron lord is in the group as he will deny your inv. save.
I think a squad of grotesques may help. Grotesques will scare away the crons if they lose in cc and if you can sweep them they are gone for good (no we be back rolls). Not sure if you got those or care to use them but that auto-fallback rule they have is perfect against the 'crons.
Incubi work wonderfully as well. In my last game with incubi his lord veiled a little too close and I was able to assault him. I put my archon and 2 incubi on the warriors while I assigned 3 incubi on the lord. The result was a complete massacre as the 2 remaining warriors failed their morale and initiative so they got "swept" before veiling or being teleported out by the monolith. Trick as always is if you can get them into cc.
So looking at HQ, consider the Archon to go solo and just get into combat and the 2nd HQ to take incubi. Kinda tough at 1500 but very easy at 2000.
Just some ideas, could you post your list?
After taking all the previous suggestions in mind, I will lay my two cents down.
First of all, the overall perspective this list is NOT very competative list to begin with. 40 models towards pahase out, so essentialy you need to kill 30 on the dot.
Second, in the list I only see two things that should be your primary targets. They are warriors and the unit of destroyers that the lord accompanies.
Third, I would completely leave out the wyches and grots as trying ot get into CC is too risky for a mobile army like this, wyches will very likely die in the crash while grots will be insta killed by destroyers. All you really need is one descent counter charge unit if he gets too close. The rest of the army shoot simply stand and shoot.
If I was to face a similar list, I would consider the following:
HQ - a lord with an incubi retinue, no more than 5. Just sit behind cover and wait for warriros to come closer within rapid fire range, when you can jump out and break the whole unit on the charge.
Elite - I wouldnt take anything, wyches are weak unless you magicaly get a 12" charge drug, grots will get insta killed by destroyers and have a very low chance of winning an assault even with a tooled up IC
Troop - at least 4 sniper squads to act as a firebase, his warriors will have a lot of trouble foot slogging through that kind of fire, and a smart player will try to keep his destroyers out of sight/range of our lances. I would also consider having 1 or 2 raider squads with a sybarite with agoniser, just to tie things up in CC, for instance have your lord engage one warrior unit, while these guys will tie up the other.
Fast - I wouldnt take anything, however jetbikes are an option as they can catch up to destroyers relatively quickly. If taken, the unit has to be at least 6 strong with a sybarite(agoniser) and 2 blasters. Expensive and a bit risky, but when your fire lances are controled by warriors you should have no problem forcing his destroyers to take certain routes.
Heavy - 3 ravagers, preferable with disies and nightshields, for obvious reasons.
So in the end, could have a rought outline like:
Dracon(Agoniser, Combat Drugs, Shadow Field, Splinter Pistol, Plasma Grenades)
4 x 10 Warriors (2 Dark Lances)
Raider squad with Sybarite (Agoniser), 9 Warriors(Splinter Cannon, Blaster), Raider(disie)
5 Reaver Jetbikes (2 Blasters), Succubi (Agoniser, Tormentor Helm)
3 x Ravager (disies and nightshields)
Puts you at about ~1505 if I added correctly.
I have to disagree about the wyches. I have found them to be marvelously effective against necrons (as long as the nightbringer isnt around *shudder*). They routinely count for 2-3 squads and do very well against lords. The biggest problem comes from when they teleport out of CC using the Veil of Darkness or the thrice damned Monolith.....
Do what you can to deny him his WWB rolls. I've short handed most of it here from memory but you should get a copy of the relevant pages and read it for yourself.
1) necrons killed by instant death do not get a WWB roll
2) models killed in CC by a power weapon do not get a WWB roll
3) units massacred (ala sweeping advance) do not get a WWB roll
4) he cannot WWB if the entire squad is killed
5) he cannot use the Res Orb on a destroyed unit if that unit is not within 6" of a similar unit (ie you kill warrior squad A entirely, if they are not within 6" of warrior squad B, C or D then they cannot benefit from the Orb)
6) units may only benefit from the Orb if they are within 6" at the time they are killed (which is very different wording than something like 'at the start of the necron player's turn')
note the Res Orb can modify some of the above conditions (like the intant death rule).
The Necron Lords are resilient only because they stand back up. I can usually kill them in CC before they get to go. As per 6) above this means that any necrons killed at lower initiatives do not benefit from the Orb because technically it is not in play. (the convention is to lay the model on it's side but I believe the wording is to remove it from the board). The Lord is dead and not able to power up the Orb. Going one step further at the start of the Ncron player's turn I would allow the Lord to get up but not use the Orb on anyone else. WWB is silmultaneous, the Lord is not yet up to use the Orb on the other necrons. They are all dead together and only the Lord is able to make use of the Orb.
Grotesques are always a good choice against necrons because they automatically force the unit to fall back. This works very well when they are combined with higher initiative units (like a detached Archon).
All that being said I agree with WraithGuardian that you should easily be able to out shoot him.
War Record Since Sept 2005
Old Codex 48-20-9 Dark Eldar
New Codex 1-0-0 Dark Eldar
Ok, I'll post my list, for reference... thanks for the ideas...
Keep in mind that this is a take all comers list with objectives in mind
Archon: Reaver Jet Bike, Combat Drugs, Shadow Field, Power Weapon, Tormentor Helm
6x Sniper Squads
(Alternatively i have been using 4x 15 man squads with 2 Dl's and 2 Blasters for a little more manuverability and wounds before they flee)
3 Reaver Jet Bikes: 2 have blasters (for captiring objectives or providing a distraction - also good for harassing falling back squads so they can't regroup - now that is dirty)
2x 8 Wytches (with wych weapons obviously) on raider Including succubus with agoniser and Spliter pistol
2x Ravager with 2 disintegrators, 1 Dark Lands and Night Shield
So there you go...
We did have some contetion about the WBB rolls... If i wiped out the squad, he still took them coz of the orb... and if i killed the lord too, the lord rolled first to get back up, and then the squad. This is obviously wrong, and part of the problem
The other part of the problem is that the dice gods hate me. Don't Laugh... i'm not kidding
I once charged one of those squads of wyches at a 6 man fire warrior team, failed combat, and proceded to run off the table over the next 4 turns /cry... i also shot every Dark Lance i had at a hive tyrant, only to have it stumble into my front lines on turn 3...
any advice on the list before i decide to charge valiantly into the fray (more like sulk into the darkness and try to catch him unawares...