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    Please define first round of combat

    Hello all

    Can someone please define first round of combat?

    I've have problems with defend cover and banshee masks.

    This is usually what happened. I charged in with homagaunts the first round and then charged with genestealers the next round.

    I say my genestealers gets to go in normal initiative because the enemy unit have been in combat the previous round, thus second round of combat.

    My opponent said defend cover or banshee masks go first because it is the first round for the genestealers in combat.

    Also, Will the result change if he charges my unit first than I
    charge him on my turn?

    If possible please give page #, or link to GW sources.

    Thanks


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    Hive Fleet Níðhöggr sodcactus's Avatar
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    That discussion always sufarces when playing. Unfortunately GW didn't care to include how to resolve that situation in the rulebook... (not as far as I have found at least). The way we play at my club is that after the first round of combat all involved loses the cover save and even if assaulted by a second unit all still attack at Initiative. To even things out we also ruled that the chargers into a continues fight don't get the extra attack for charging.

    Please prove me wrong, I would love to see the ruling in the BRB, but so far I haven't been able to find anything.
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    Watcher In The Sky Beardy_Wierdy's Avatar
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    For my money its the first round in which the combat in question takes place. That is, anyone joining in gets their full attacks (including the extra attack for charging).

    Wargear works in the first round in which the unit with it gets in on the act.


    If they are already fighting for their lives however, they are not going to have the time to use it when something attacks THEM whilst engaged.
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    Senior Member TamCoan's Avatar
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    It may be the first round the stealers are in combat, but not the first round the defender is in combat. I don't have a rulebook in front of me, but I don't think it is worded that it works the first round the attacker is in combat...

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    The genestealers are assaulting into an ongoing combat. Their attacks for charging are not based on first round, but are based on the charge (which you cannot do once already engaged for subsequent rounds).

    Since it is already an ongoing combat, it does not reset, and it is not 2 separate combats for the banshees, one in its second round and one in its first. You simply are in the 2nd round of combat, and a new unit just joined it. No banshee mask bonus.

    The other way is a well-argued fantasy at best, IMO.
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    Member RudyPicardo's Avatar
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    Hive Commander Sandari:

    Several months ago, I passed a set of questions similar to this to my friend, John Spencer from GW (US site). These should help you out

    =========================
    I know that Howling Banshees get first turn in an assault. Here are 3 situations that I was unsure of:

    a) Suppose that banshees have just concluded combat with a unit of gaunts. In the Tyranid turn, a Hive Tyrant attacks the banshee unit. Do the banshees still strike first
    Quote Originally Posted by John Spencer from GW
    The Banshees would strike at initiative. This is a close one, but the wording points to this resolution.


    b) Suppose a banshee unit massacres a unit, gets a 6 on the massacre roll and consolidates to a new unit, do they attack first

    Quote Originally Posted by John Spencer from GW
    Yes.


    c) Supposedly there's a Dark Eldar unit that offers a similar special rule (using combat drugs, I think). We were unsure what would happen if these two units clashed. Sorry I don't have any 411 on this. I just overheard it in a conversation and was curious.

    Quote Originally Posted by John Spencer from GW
    Simultaneous fighting!


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    Dark Eldar Gerbil Splata's Avatar
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    C) is wrong, as banshee is I10 and DE are ASF. ASf always strikes first and hence strikes first.

    Interesting. So if the genestealers charged in with scid maw they would not get the bonus?
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    LO Zealot Lictor1989's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Splata View Post
    C) is wrong, as banshee is I10 and DE are ASF. ASf always strikes first and hence strikes first.

    Interesting. So if the genestealers charged in with scid maw they would not get the bonus?
    What does rerolling wounds have to do with striking at first or initiative? Unless of course your talking about flesh hooks...though even then they aren't charging into cover. So basically what I'm saying is..."what?" .
    Is it me or does any other necron player get annoyed when they see people saying "Necrons eat souls". How is that even possible as souls are part of the warp and necrons want nothing to do with it? Eh probaly me just me being picky.

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    Sparta! Exarch Thomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RudyPicardo View Post
    Hive Commander Sandari:

    Several months ago, I passed a set of questions similar to this to my friend, John Spencer from GW (US site). These should help you out

    =========================
    I know that Howling Banshees get first turn in an assault. Here are 3 situations that I was unsure of:

    a) Suppose that banshees have just concluded combat with a unit of gaunts. In the Tyranid turn, a Hive Tyrant attacks the banshee unit. Do the banshees still strike first


    If the combat with gaunts is over (i.e. banshees won and are no longer in combat) and they get charged in the Tyranid turn, then the banshees strike at I10 due to the special rules of their masks. You GW mate has it wrong on this one.



    Quote Originally Posted by RudyPicardo View Post
    b) Suppose a banshee unit massacres a unit, gets a 6 on the massacre roll and consolidates to a new unit, do they attack first


    They get I10 because it is a new combat, just as above.


    Quote Originally Posted by RudyPicardo View Post
    c) Supposedly there's a Dark Eldar unit that offers a similar special rule (using combat drugs, I think). We were unsure what would happen if these two units clashed. Sorry I don't have any 411 on this. I just overheard it in a conversation and was curious.
    It depends on the wording of ASF - if it's worded in relation to cover (as the mandrakes are) then the banshees strike at I10 because their masks ignore cover. If the rule is straight ASF then the DE unit would strike first. Please note that I10 is not ASF - apart from the DE there is no ASF in 40k anymore. Banshee masks confer I10 not ASF
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  11. #10
    Dark Eldar Gerbil Splata's Avatar
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    wychs have true ASF.
    So they strike first.

    In my previous msg i meant it to be split into two.

    restate:
    C) is wrong, as banshee is I10 and DE are ASF. ASf always strikes first and hence strikes first.
    ----------------------------
    Interesting. So if the genestealers charged in with acid maw they would not get the bonus?

    so i mean that the rule is acid maw more can reroll wounds in the first round of combat. And so if they charge a combat then do they not get to?

    does that solve the 'what'?
    Caps-Lock, its like cruise-control for AWESOMENESS!
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