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Something I thought would be useful to add to the tactica would be ideas on the best ways to kit out a battlewagon in game. Battlewagons tend to reach a fair few points considering the fact that 90 points for essentially a heavy transport with no guns is quite expensive already.
What designs have people used? Have some gone all out on big shootas or rockitt launchas? Do people ever taken the Killkannon when a better one is on the Looted Wagon. Has anyone found a way of making the Deff Rolla a viable option? (coz personally I think the wagon is too slow to manage to run anyone down!)
Don't worry about who you transport. Generally its Burnas or Tankbustas and for me its likely to be no different. I'd love to try to get 2 battlewagons in a 1500 list (1 for 1000) as I don't like any of the other heavy support options.........besides Big Gunz, but its easy to say "I want 3 Kannons for 60 points if I can convert the models"
I have built a few lists with BWs, but yet to try them out. My loadouts include 4 Big Shootas, RPJ and a Deff Rolla carrying 20 Slugga Boyz or 15 Tankbustas. Though in 5th edition I will likely drop down to 2 Big Shootas since they will be becoming offensive weapons. Also, I will likely remove the Deff Rolla and RPJ from the Tankbusta BW.
The reason I haven't tried them yet is because they fall under the current 4th Ed Deathtrap rules when they get wrecked/penned. They will see a lot more play time for me come 5th Ed where the transport rules aren't as harsh.
I have Run a 2 BattleWaggon List at 1250 points last week end and played 3 games with those.
My first battlewaggon (1) was carrying 20 'ard boyz and was equipped with 2 Big Shootas and a Deff Rolla.
The other one (2) was carrying 12 Burna Boyz and was kitted with the kill Kannon upgrade and 1 Big Shoota.
I played against TAU twice and once against Space Marines.
Against Tau, My battlewaggons were pretty useless where trukks or looted waggons would have done a better job at a lower cost. Next time, I will field a Looted Waggon for my burna boys.
Against the Space Marines, the game went pretty well and my 2 BattleWaggons survived the battle nearly unscratched. I never had a chance to ram any one with my Deff Rolla, but I did some dammage with hte kill kannon.
The big shootas never fired... They are just there in order to prevent a weapon destroyed to immobilise the vehicle.
The main idea was to use the battlewaggons as hardened troop transport and it went well for number 1, but I was too eager to use the kill kannon so the other one kind of went off purpose. It's like using a Land Raider to kill tank while it carries terminators : it misses it's purpose.
After thinking about it, this might be a good idea to use the kill kannon version to shelter some lootas and having them shell out at anything while your opponent desperatly tries to break the battlewaggon.
So, my advice is : Find a purpose for your battlewaggons and stick to it, that's what i'll do next time.
CHAOS Undiv.: won 14/22 games EC: 4/7 WE: 6/9 DG: 10/15, TS: 3/7 Orks : 13/20 SM NL : 1/6 TAU: 14 of 24 IG: 3/7
5th edition is going to change battlewagon/looted wagon loadouts significantly, as 4 big shootas aren't going to be as much of an advantage, considering you you have to stay still in order to fire them all in one turn. On the other hand, with only 5 points for each additional big shoota, it's probably the cheapest way to get extra shootas into your army.
I prefer the looted wagon's ordnance gun over the battlewagon's killkannon. With a strength of only 7, the killkannon just isn't reliable enough when fighting armor. It can still be effective against troops, but a battlewagon is a tempting enough target for your enemy without the ordnance gun, assuming it's transporting troops. With a killkannon, it'll become their main target to destroy. The looted wagon's gun is more effective, and considering that the big meks won't be able to shoot through friendly troops in 5th edition, it might turn out to be a viable choice, since you can keep it behind your troops and still fire.
With the 5th edition rules, I think the dethrolla and wrecking balls are going to become more effective, since you can still use them even if you fire another weapon with the vehicle. Of course, from what I hear most vehicles will be able to ram other vehicles anyway, but a big shoota, wrecking ball and dethrolla, all on the same vehicle, is a deadly combination. That isn't even counting all the shots/assaults from the passengers, either.
Besides these combinations, I tend to run battlewagons and looted wagons cheap, and instead spend the points maximizing the units they're transporting. Here are my favorites:
Looted wagon w/big shoota (basic cheap transport)
Looted wagon w/ordnance gun and big shoota (I like 2 weapons, so a weapon destroyed result doesn't make it completely useless)
Battlewagon w/big shoota and riggers (and stikkbomb chukkas if they're transporting nobz)
Battlewagon w/4 big shootas, hard case (sit and shoot gunboat)
Battlewagon w/big shoota, deff rolla, wrecking ball, riggers, and armor plates (expensive, but dangerous, and Ghazghskull would settle for nothing less ^_^)
As a final note, I prefer to not field battlewagons as dedicated transports. I can remember at least one recent game I won, which I would have lost had I not been able to claim an objective with an empty battlewagon. Remember, dedicated transports can't claim objectives, but if you fielded it as a heavy choice, it can.
Last edited by mynameisgrax; March 29th, 2008 at 13:38. Reason: forgot one thing
Yikes not a good start for battlewagons then? Everyone seems to prefer the looted wagon. My only worry with the looted wagon is its weak armour. Its a lot of points to lose if you put the boomgun on it!
The deff rolla is too much fun to pass up though, my only concern is that the battlewagon at full pelt with RPJ will still only move 13 inches so I struggle to see how it will get a chance to reach a squad before someone blows it up! Not to mention how you model a Deff Rolla in the first place!
Last edited by farmergiles65; March 27th, 2008 at 14:37.
I actually like battlewagons a lot, but I usually run them cheaply, as sort of an 'executive transport' for nobz and special troops.
That being said, I often pass over the battlewagon in favor of trukks. For assault troops, the trukk is far superior, not only because it's cheaper, but because it's incredibly fast, and able to get your boyz into close combat very quickly. For units I want to keep alive, or I can't choose a trukk for, I use a battlewagon.
You're right in worrying about the looted wagon's armor. They die really easily. Of course, I often run a looted wagon just to distract my opponents. One way or the other, it careens up the center of the board, provides cover, and soaks up a lot of fire. I wouldn't put more than 75-90 points worth of troops in it though. Not when the risks are so high.
"It takes a vast amount of self control to be this dangerous."
---Ogvai Ogvai Helmshrot, Jarl of Tra, VI Legion Astartes
It SUCKS that battlewaggons can't take skorchas in this edition! Arrgh!