Welcome to Librarium Online!
To start I do not use eldar, I have space marines, but I have a friend who is eldar and i find in my personal expert opinion that there are some balance issues.
(and before i begin ranting i do not have the codex so some stats are off the top of my head)
eldar are impossible to kill. whenever i fight him i get destroyed in 2 turns. this is because eldar are designed so that each squad is really good at a certain specialization whether it be CC or shooting. the problem i find is that the squads are way too good at their specialization and they dont have the points to balance it. A dark reaper for example has that gun that is strength 5 ap 3 48" heavy 2. in a squad of 4 thats 8 hits that are almost instant kills on a SM. so my squad that cost nearly 200 points is useless in one squads atack.
Vehicles also tick me off. it is impossible to hit an eldar vehicle unless you are standing like right next to it. they have those distotion things that mean you have to be within half the range of your gun or else it is at most a glancing hit and then once you do get close enough it just glances of the front anyway because of that rule with the shape. and since they are all skimmers they get all skimmer benefits
and wraithlords? a walker with a toughness? its like GW sat down and said, "hmm lets make it a walker, but thats too easy to kill so well just give it a toughness of 8 and 4 wounds.
avatars are ridiculous. in order to maintain the background they have them immune to melta weapons and flamers. but space marines in power armor with 3 lungs 2 hearts instant blood clotting and the will to fight with missing limbs get the benefit of a toughness of 4. Again GW employee brainstorming...
Employee 1: lets keep it tied into the background and make it immune to meltas and flamers
Employee 2: so she shouldnt space marines have maybe 2 wounds? or the ability to roll and see if the wound affects them, almost like built in bionics?
1: no thats dumb, and over balanced
1;fine then well make them cost 40 points
2: ok nevermind....
and the avatar is under 200 points? WHAT THE HELL?
also bright lances are the dumbest thing i have ever seen. the idea of a tank is so that it gets in fights and you damage it but its hard to kill. bright lances are just throwing that concept out the window.
and psykers? i know they are supposed to be super psykers and stuff but cmon. Librarians get one power a turn, and they are ok. Eldar get multiple psychic powers plus they totally own. And the runes of warding essentially nullify every other psyker on the field.
rules dont apply to eldar its like the shooting phase is as follows..... escept eldar they get their own rules. Assaultts? well those are handled like this..... unless its an eldar, then you get different rules.
I was just curious to see what other people think.
Umm... you might want to read up abit on the vehicle rules. There are no rules about being half range away from the vehicle and getting glancing hits (are you thinking of melta weapons!?) and there is no rule about the shape of the vehicle? that aside, Eldar are balanced.... well the Eldar falcon is the only thing I would actually call unbalanced.
The best way to counter a Eldar army is since each individual unit is so specialized is to use that against them. For example, your opponent has some dark reapers, some howling banshees, and then some fire dragons. Ok and you might have.... a tactical squad with a heavy weapon, a predator anni, and whilrwind.
Ok so your opponent has one unit that is good at taking out your tanks, then concentrate your fire on the Fire dragons. Eliminate them, so then your vehicles will become a huge problem for they're force.
The Eldar can not take things like , a las cannon in they're troop squads or power weapons in they're dark reaper squads. Although they're specialization makes them strong it makes them weak if this weakness is exploited. The morale is Eldar are flexible but not each individual squad, so if you can manage to break they're army apart they will fall quickly
Hoped I could help.
and PS. would you mind elaborating on how assaults and the shooting phase differ with Eldar?
Last edited by gauss_storm; June 4th, 2008 at 01:46.
ummm the assault and shooty thing was sarcasm out of frustration...
and as far as the vehicle rules i think i need to have a chat witha particular friend of mine.
as far as that goes yes you were very helpful. oh and im sorry if i bashed on eldar, i was just a taaaad frustrated.
ahh, ok. But I would suggest borrowing your friends codex and read it a couple times over to really learn about the army.
You'll beat him someday.
I would suggest reading the army abuse thread in the tactica thread. you said his units were specialized to do somthing. then dont let them do it. If the squad is amazing at shooting... assault it. If he spent 300 points so you cant kill it... dont try to
I know falcons are almost unkillable, so dont bother, devote only enough fire power to shake it, then kill the rest of his force. It takes a while to get used to fighting eldar.
"Thank him who puts me loath to this revenge on you who wrong me not for him who wrongd"
First off I would really reccomend getting a copy of the codex. You might be surprised.
Secondly - the Avatar really isn't that crash hot. They move 6" a turn making them in line with the slowest thing in the eldar list and realtively easy to avoid. It needed a boost from last edition and it has been handled quite well. Under 2nd ed, if I remember correctly, they were even immune to laser based weaponry as well so they aren't too bad. And while Space Marines are genetically modified humans, the Avatar is, well an avatar. He is basically a god (or a piece of a god technically).
Eldar are a race of specialists and each unit is usually designed with a single goal in mind. Throwing a spanner in the works can turn the battle with eldar. Blunt their attacks and force the units into a position where they can't do what they are good at, and remember that heavy bolters are your friend.
Worried about harlies? Throw a sacrificial squad at them (one that dies on the charge) and then rapid fire them to death.
Reapers annoying? Pin them or take them out. Alternatively get a fast unit into CC with them - they don't get many models for their points (a 5man squad with exarch, eml and fast shot is over 216 points for 5 toughness 3 models)
Wraithlords aren't a vehicle, so why should they have an armour value? And they have actually been toned down quite significantly so once again I wouldn't complain too much - it's like asking why isn't a carnifex treated as an AV10 walker because it's big, carries a gun and walks around.
Dovie'andi se tovya sagain (It's time to roll the dice)- Mattrim Cauthon
Him: "What do you mean your deep striking, this mission doesn't allow it"
Me: "Yes, but I think you'll find that this Grey Knight terminator unit is exempt from that rule."
Him: "O.K. I just killed off 8 of your 10 Grey Knights, with gunpower alone. You want to take a morale test now?"
Me: "I'm sorry, but everything on my side of the board is fearless. And most attack with Str 6, and half have power weapons, and if my boss rolls under 10 on two dice after causing 1 wound off his 4 Str 6 power weapon attacks then your guy will automatically die."
Yeah rules meant nothing to my Grey Knight army. But then they grew boring, so I changed to the significantly more interesting Eldar.
Last edited by Mike Rutch; June 4th, 2008 at 04:11.
Originally Posted by LegendxSval FoundationOriginally Posted by wakopanda
Tau have a distortion field not Eldar. One of you is confused.
That said you can't play to each of his units strengths or you will lose.
You might want to consider things like drop pods or bikes to get at/ignore the reapers. Wraithlords dont' do well with power firsts and avatars go down to ranged fire surprisingly well.
His force actually doesn't sound all that potent really.
thanks for the tips, everyone, i think my problem just comes in with me. Oh well, just venting some frustration. I'll get him eventually.
I play eldar and I do have 1 issue with eldar.
Try shooting at the reapers with autocannons or heavy bolters... they die really easy and cost ridiculous amounts of points (217 for a squad with a tempest and crackshot) once a few drop they lose massive amounts of effectivness... plus once 1 or 2 die it'll be morale test time.
The wraithlord is heavily toned down since 3rd, and I find it to be overall balanced, in fact I don't run one in favor of the other really nice HS choices.
Although most eldar units do excel at 1 thing or another AND I think its very hard to "strike at their weaknesses" as other suggest (because the eldar player will do his best not to let you). The eldar's biggest weakness, in my opinion, is every model lost in a unit weakens that units effectivness considerably... ex: 3 less dire avengers means 9 less shots on a bladestorm, 2 dead reapers means 4 less shots on the launchers, banshees suck if they don't get a bucketfull of dice... etc. Marines can hide weapons and powerfists in squads of power armor... this is a significant advantage.
Shaking the falcons is the best way to go ... but there is one thing that the eldar have that is IMHO overpowered. Harlies in a falcon.
Shaking no longer matters cuz they are about to deliver a unit that can literally take on anything, and everything. They are cheap for what they do (22pts to get rend for a ignore cover, can't get shot at, ignore diff terrain, inv save, furious charge, withdraw, fleetoffoot model that gets as many attacks as a striking scorpion) and almost impossible to stop from hitting CC.
Eldrad is also just a tad too much, but I may be alone on that one.
Anyways just my 2 cents.
P.S 5th should fix some of this, as now falcons will be a bit more vulnerable as you'll have a chance to Penetrate, but atm i find them kinda disgusting