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Ok, this is pretty much an idea I thought of for Eldar mech armies, but found it had already been posted. However, as that thread sort of withered, I'm going to start this. At the moment I am too tired and do not have enough playtesting to properly evaluate this type of army, it is merely an idea. However, I shall put in my post from another thread to hopefully explain the concept (as I cannot be bothered typing it out again).
Originally Posted by Varlen
I really want to get continued use from my large-ish vehicle base, and I dont know many Edar players fond of vehies=/. Also, how/why do you start in reserve??
Ok, starting in reserve, in 5th, anything can start in reserve as far as I know. So, pretty much, everything I have either Deep Strikes, Outflanks, or is in a Serpent.
Let me explain.
Ok, say (for the purposes of this example) I have:
Dire Avengers in a Serpent
Fire Dragons in a Serpent
Banshees in a Serpent
Unit of Scorpions
Unit of Warp Spiders
2 War Walkers with EMLs (each in one unit)
2 units of pathfinders
Now, the very first thing I do, is to try and get choice of turn. And have it so I get second. Why? Well, my whole army starts off the table. Meaning, I effectivley waste two turns of the game. Not fun for anyone, as I can come on from anywhere barring their board edge. If I get first turn then oh well, no great loss.
So, what happens, I bring on every unit I can, barring the 2 pathfinder units, on a 2+. So, what every unit will do (par example) is:
Autarchs: Stick with whatever squads (in my case usually fire dragons and warp spiders) and help.
Dire Avengers: Rush in and shoot up some infantry with Bladestorm, maybe take an objective.
Fire Dragons and Banshees: Use Star Engines to get right up in the enemy lines, then disembark and do what they do best.
Scorpions: Come on outflanking, and start massacring their way across the lines.
Spiders: Deep Strike, then go around being all apache and hit and run.
Falcon: Come on and lay down some firepower. generally just being a Falcon.
War Walkers: Come on from board edges and lay the law down with the side armour of vehicles. This is a brilliantly fun tactic.
Now the pathfinders I want on as late as possible. Because theyre my troops, I don't want them on until turn 3/4ish. This means that the enemy can't shoot them.
That's a general kind of unit summary, not too sure where it was going, but i hope it helped a little.
The main theme of this army is to completely encircle and control the game from the get go. There is nowhere the enemy can maneuvre that is safe. So, this means only outflanking units, or units that can move quickly enough from your table edge are viable. However, this has led me to thinking, are Pathfinders really worth it? Theyre only survivable. And in an army like this I want to be as killy as I can. So i'm just thinking 2 units of avengers and 3 bikes for cheap objective scoring.
This idea is still in the works, maybe bring the original thread back to life? I believe it was "reserves army" or something of the sort.
Hope I helped
That will hopefully explain the idea behind this army. All thoughts are welcome, as I want Swordwind to become viable again.
I'd love to have 3 units of striking scorpians in wave serpents on the flank, 2 of them with an autarch each. Think they would change that in the next eldar book? seems a bit too good.
At the moment I'm liking a troops choice of wraithguard, the warlock with conceal joined by a farseer doing the re-roll saves. Very tough unit.
Dont get too worked up about flanking scorpions, and I doubt they will get changed in a later ed.
1) you can't put autarchs or farseers in the squad [they can't infiltrate]
2) scorpions cost a bunch like this, and still get to get shot for one round after coming in
3) there is a 1/3 chance for each squad that it comes on on the wrong side of the board. Although this is much more of an issue for footslogging units, as serpents with star engines can come on anywhere and get anywhere.
4) Star Engines. You don't Need to outflank, its just a cool gimmick.
5) If you based an army around outflanking scorpions, the more units you have the more likely they get split up [coming from different sides], and they get Much more expensive than say banshees.
6) Scorpions are good, but they don't win games. My scorpions have typically done really well throughout 4th ed, infiltrating behind armies, cutting up heavy squads and what have you, but if I relied solely on scorpions to win my games, I would be a dead fish in the water.
Having said all that, the overall concept seems pretty devastating [turn 2 2+ army of serpent death], but a little bit tricky to fit into 1850 or even 2k. It will take some work and some practice. Things like not have a farseer would hurt, especially with so many DAs flying around - Doom, Guide and Fortune [for getting the objectives], are so valuable for them.
I just wouldn't get too excited about scorpions is all
food for thought
ow, and never EVER use it against daemon armies. Although it may seem attractive that flamers and the like cannot toast you when they come down, there are other ways to achieve that, and the one disadvantage that the daemon army has is that you can attack half of their army with your entire army on turn 1
Well I'm not really that excited about Scorpions sir. But regardless, I do believe you can assault when you come on from Outflanking?
The main units I see being useful:
War Walkers with 2 EMLs. Thats very nasty when it outflanks. I plan on having 3.
Star Engine Fire Dragons. WhizzzzBang!
Anything on a bike.
Those are going to be the main units this strategy works around in my opinion. Maybe hawks, but euch, hawks.
So, I'm trying to cook up a sample list, I shall return when it is done.
Sorry to post below myself. But I think this is a very very good tactic against Daemons, if we get second turn. About 75% of the Daemons will be down by then, meaning that the unfortunates will have to suffer trudging across to get us. And very few are the units that can catch an Eldar Mech army in a Daemon list.
If we get first turn however, then start with everything on the board, and gang up on their army turn one. An army like this has enough mobility to attack everything unless they come down on the other board edge.
Edit: Cooked up a list with the above strategy
haha Archonomad, its all good.
As for assaulting from outflanking, of course you can, but only if you dont have a serpent. If you have a transport, you have to be mounted in it, and are not able to assault the turn you arrive regardless. Yet if you forgo the serpent for the ability to charge, you risk being left on the wrong side of the battlefield. Run should help with this, but with Eldar's synergy being so important, it could be tricky. If that happens in a serpent you can use star engines to get in charge range anyway, but that raises the point that you don't even need outflank to do that, as with star engines you can come on from your own board edge and get in charge range of anything Anyway. So banshees, seer council, harlies...it all works. Who needs scorpions? :-p
Yes but remember transports are no longer dedicated. Meaning that I could quite happily let my Avengers trot up the battlefield while their serpent picks up the scorpions. I think I will paint both my serpents yellow.....
*whistles, extends arm and sticks out thumb*
thats a good point, I didn't think of that. The taxi-ness of transports does make that tactic much more viable, especially as the ability to get a turn 2 charge on anything in 12" of the board edge on a 2+ is very powerful. Good point. I like it a lot more now! Although for the sake of target saturation, speed and killyness, I am still going to 100% mount my army in serpents otherwise it wouldn't be the Serpent Storm!