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How does this weapon fire? It has two "weapons" but any reference in the codex makes me think it counts as just a single non-twin-linked weapon. Is this correct?
It's a single, non-twin-linked weapons system that just happens to come in two pices and occupies both of the drone mounting slots on a Tau vehicle. (Or, if you're a XV88, both of your arms.)
ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
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I disagree with this and here is why: All GD and Burst Cannon drones count as independent when shooting. The Burst Cannons only cost 10 pts and the GD 20pts, both are considered to fire independenly, and it is the same for the SMS drones. Because you have to have both of them. Also you have to measure the distance of the weapon firing, agvain you run into 2 seperate firing positions. My understanding is that it is a single, non-twin-linked weapons system PER firing point. Again this is my understanding.It's a single, non-twin-linked weapons system that just happens to come in two pices and occupies both of the drone mounting slots on a Tau vehicle. (Or, if you're a XV88, both of your arms.)
Additional logic to this, is that why would they offer BC drones @ 10 pts giving you 6y shots; and GD that fire twin-linked weapons and can be detached at 20 pts; and then offer a weapon system that only offers 4 shots while occupying to firing weapon point for 20 pts. It doesn't make sense, and no enemy that I have fought against have ever denied me 2 drones firing 4 missiles each, once explained this way.
Reference: P41,31 Tau empire codex.
Your responses welcome.
The Burst Cannons are two separate guns because the codex tells you that they are a pair of them.
The SMS option for the vehicles is described as a single Smart Missile System. Therefore you only get to count the weapon profile once for both SMS mounts. (This also means that you only need to measure range from one of the mounts.)
Also, the BCs and SMS are not drones, just weapon mounts.
You're "additional logic" fails there, and not to mention that your "logic" does not factor in the SMS not needing LoS in the price justification.
We either follow the rules as they are written, or change things with house rules. We do not get to use a sideways point analysis to get change what is available in the codex.
(Sorry if this sounds a little stern, but I'd really like to drive home the emphasis on playing by the actual wording of the rules.)
"It takes a vast amount of self control to be this dangerous."
---Ogvai Ogvai Helmshrot, Jarl of Tra, VI Legion Astartes
SMS is called a weapon system. Singular. Nowhere is it referred to as a twin-linked system, nor does it say in the codex that each SMS pod can fire separately. The system has a declared Rate of Fire.
The Gun Drones are separate, individual models which are housed in special recesses on the Devilfish hull until such times as they disembark and become a separate unit of two models. This is why each of the Drones may shoot when on the Devilfish chassis: they *are* individual independent models, and are handled effectively as passengers. However, they must fire at the same target when they shoot; they are not individual units of one model each.
The Burst Cannons upgrade specifically states that they may fire independently. However, they may only target different enemy units if a Target Lock is acquired for the Hammerhead.
The SMS have fewer shots, but a longer range than both of these options above. They also have other added attractions for shooting purposes
As to why the points have been costed the way they have, well....no one will be able to tell you that for certain unless they were involved with the playtesting of the codex itself and the models therein, or they get a direct answer from Andy Hoare! However, my personal take on it is this:
The pair of GDs on the Hammerhead cost the same as buying two GDs to take with a Drone Controller, so no oddness there.
The Burst Cannons are effectively a 6-shot weapon system whose guns can fire independently. They don't have any other special rules, so why would the points cost have to be big?
The SMS is a weapon system with a number of advantages; it is the extra in-game advantages which cause points costing to be elevated.
Edit: Grrr! Ninja'd by Psichotykwyrm. Must be the beer....
Last edited by eiglepulper; January 1st, 2009 at 22:03.
"Tau Commandment #226: Participants who use Velocity Trackers in the Tau Clay Pigeon Tournament will be disqualified"
(1) 6" greater range than a Burst cannon
(2) No line of sight required
(3) No target priority test required (I know this is no longer relevant to 5th but the points cost was worked out for 4th rules)
(4) Not affected by night fighting rules
(6) 4 decent strength shots (not bad for 20pts)
The Burst cannon needs LOS, has a shorter range and is affected by night fight rules. An important point that needs reiterating is the fact that the BC is not 'independent' from the vehicle. The BC is a vehicle weapon but each weapon is individual (I/E not twin linked), they do not fire independently from the vehicle. The same is true of Drones, they must fire at the same target as the vehicle because they fire 'as part' of the vehicle.
Another thing about Drones is they cannot benefit from a vehicles targeting array upgrade as they use their own BS.
On a side note even though the SMS do have a few benefits over and above the BC I would never advise taking them in any other scenario than city fight (I prefer the old name). Keep the Hammerhead cheap and avoid the temptation of using the more expensive SMS.
I would advise not trying your particular line of logic at tournies
Oh and by the way Eigle, there is only one Ninja on this forum (all the others are pale shadows of the almighty Ninja Monkey), if you get properly Ninja'd you will never hear it coming
Last edited by Rikimaru; January 2nd, 2009 at 02:26.
Good news about the two emplacements is that you can measure from either one to target opponents. That's about it, since they still count as one weapon
I fight for the Greater Good. Too bad for you it's MY Greater Good.
Snow Forces of T'olku W/L/D : 3-4-2... I like to think I'm learning, though.
Thanks for the feedback, though I was awar of all of that . I guess part of my thinking behind it was other non tau players automatically thought it was 2 drones firing and not just one. Live and learn.
I make the adjustments in my future play.