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    monolith penetration

    apologies for the simple questions but a few questions arose and I am unable to reseach them immediately regarding penetrating the monolith.
    Rending: adds +1d3 after a penetration roll has already rolled, is that +1d3 taken into account or disregarded?
    is there anything that receives 2d6 (or more) to penetrate?
    meltabombs were a specified query as they are listed as 8+2d6 (I immediately told him no as nothing receives teh additional penetration die however I would like to verify that)

    Last edited by DJinni; September 9th, 2008 at 21:41. Reason: typos
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    LO's Resident Time Lord Canew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJinni View Post
    apologies for the simple questions but a few questions arose and I am unable to reseach them immediately regarding penetrating the monolith.
    Rending: adds +1d3 after a pepetration roll has already rolled, is that +1d3 taken into account or disregarded?
    is there anything that receives 2d6 (or more) to penetrate?
    meltabombs were a specified query as they are listed as 8+2d6 (I immediately told him no as nothing receives teh additional penetration die however I would like to verify that)
    As to rending, I'm not sure, but I am pretty sure that NOTHING gets 2d6 to penetrate against a monolith. The only thing that comes close are power fists, which according to the FAQ, do get to use the augmented strength. I'm assuming the rationale is that the doubling the strength of the wearer is considered the "standard" strength of the thing, and is used whether the fist is hitting a vehicle, monstrous creature, guardsman, or whatever, as opposed to meltaguns (or meltabombs, for that matter) which only get the extra die when shooting at a tank. By this rationale, I'd say rending doesn't get a bonus, since that bonus cannot be applied to hits on non-tank units.

    While the rule doesn't interpret it like this, that's my guess based on how disputes over what can hurt a Monolith and what can't tend to get resolved along those lines.
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    That's the conclusion I had as well.
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    The ORIGINAL Sniper Puss eiglepulper's Avatar
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    The only thing I can think of which gets more than 2D6 and which DOES get the "extra" dice against the Monolith is the Vindicare Assassin's Turbo Penetrator round. It is not a bonus penetration (clarified by FAQ for 4th Ed, and nothing has changed with either weapon or Monolith rules); XD6 *is* the strength of the shot, just as a lascannon *is* Str X. The only difference is that the TP round's strength is variable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eiglepulper View Post
    The only thing I can think of which gets more than 2D6 and which DOES get the "extra" dice against the Monolith is the Vindicare Assassin's Turbo Penetrator round.
    I feel it's also worth mentioning that Ordanance weapons still get to roll 2 dice and choose the highest as usual, that's something that gets confused a lot in my area. I am curious to see how this rule might chance with a new codex though, especially with the new damage charts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Malagate View Post
    I feel it's also worth mentioning that Ordanance weapons still get to roll 2 dice and choose the highest as usual, that's something that gets confused a lot in my area. I am curious to see how this rule might chance with a new codex though, especially with the new damage charts.
    how do they get that confused? that is specifically spelled out.
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    Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the wording for living metal something like "Attacks against the monolith do not get any additional D6"?

    That would mean that rending has no effect just as the monstrous creature rule has no affect. But with that wording it would seem Melta-bombs do get their two D6 because it's not an additional die, that's simply what they use.

    But perhaps I'm remembering what my friend told me about this wrong. We had the Melta-bomb discussion and ruled, with his agreement after re-reading both of them, that it does indeed get 8+2D6 for penetration. Perhaps we just had the wrong idea though.
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    Rending doesn't work, neither do melta weapons, monstrous creature attacks or chainfists.
    Lance doesn't work.

    Ordanance, meltabombs and spore mines DO since they aren't modifying strength by adding d6s.

    This is stated rather clearly in the codex and AGAIN covered in the FAQ.

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    AP1 weaponry currently effects monoliths as normal since it does not add a d6 or modify the monoliths AV.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alzer View Post
    Rending doesn't work, neither do melta weapons, monstrous creature attacks or chainfists.
    Lance doesn't work.

    Ordanance, meltabombs and spore mines DO since they aren't modifying strength by adding d6s.

    This is stated rather clearly in the codex and AGAIN covered in the FAQ.
    Melta, Chainfists, and monstrous creatures are used as examples and are not the end all be all list. the sporemine clarification is in the tyranid faq (the codex states an alternate rule for penetration as it does not use the standard rules for penetration), meltabombs are not. I have not found the faq for the vindicare turbo penetrator rounds.
    meltabombs do not have a description, only a table. tables incorporate all available rules, descriptions notate what special rules are being used and whether or not it is a "melta" weapon which it is generally considered to be.
    so as it stands meltabombs are 8+1d6 as normal against monolith
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alzer View Post

    Ordanance, meltabombs and spore mines DO since they aren't modifying strength by adding d6s.

    This is stated rather clearly in the codex and AGAIN covered in the FAQ.
    Ordnance still roll two dice and pick the highest, as per the codex. The Vindicare's turbo-penetrator round also works, covered in the FAQ. Not much else does. I confess that I'm a bit unfamiliar with the rules for spore mines, but meltabombs will not work, since it's not just a matter of disallowing additional dice. The codex states under the rules for living metal (p.21) that: "In practice, any weapon attacking the Monolith will roll for armor penetration using it's unaugmented strength and a single D6 no matter what." If the meltabombs would have had a strength of X+2D6, that would have been another matter.
    Last edited by tolvmannen; September 9th, 2008 at 21:34. Reason: Beaten to it by DJinni.. I blame my slow connection :)
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