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This is probably one of those topics that keeps coming, being posted over and over, but I just can't seem to find one that answers all my questions. It concerns them Biker Nobz. I have a few questions about them that I'd like answered.
1. Just how viable are they? I mean, even a small group of, for instance, 6 of them can easily reach 500-600 points. To me that just sounds ridiculous, sinking that much points into one unit. At the moment I play Eldar, and I know that I would just point every big gun I have against that unit and blast it into orbit before they get a chance to earn back even 1/3 of their value. Anyone who could prove me wrong here? I know that they have all that funky stuff like inv. saves and Feel No Pain, but that's nothing some focused fire can't handle...am I wrong?
2. Despite all this scepticism, I am still interested in, perhaps, fielding them in my soon-to-be ork army, and I'd like your opinions on optimum numbers as well as what to kit them out with. This is because they are, by far, the most expensive unit in the ork list, and I'd like for them to be as cheap as possible while still maintaining maximum killiness.
3.And lastly, some tips on how to run them, tips, tactics even. This point is not nearly as important though, as I'm sure I've seen quite a great deal of tips and tacticas about orks in general and nob bikers in particular around the forum somewhere, and I intend to look them up. I figured though, if you managed to read through all my ranting without falling asleep, and decided that you'd write a few lines, you might maybe even take that extra minute to write some tips in this thread. it would sure save me some time at least!
I probably forgot something in there, but nevermind. I'm already looking forward to your thoughts on these expensive bad*** bikerz!
Nob Bikers are, simply, awesome.
Nob stats, T5, dakkaguns, 4+ save, cover, and turbo-boost for only 45 points. Add in the mandatory cybork and Painboy and you have a nasty unit.
I typically run 5-6 with all cybork bodies, 2 powerklaws, a Waagh! Banner, a bosspole, and a Painboy. The unit costs 400 points but they are incredibly effective, especially if I run a Warboss and make them Troops. I'd say they are well worth it.
They are incredibly resilient, great in assault, very fast, and even good at shooting.
Nob Bikers are dead 'ard.
Check out ==My== blog: www.bnhblog.blogspot.com
I ran a squad at 'ard Boyz, and they did jack. Seriously. Absolutely nothing. Maybe I just don't know how to use 'em, but yeah, they got swamped in flames and taken down! Only one game did they live, however, they did nothing remotely useful, so, I chalk it up as a loss.
Still, they are sweet to model!
I'm trying to catalog every song with a reference to yetis or Sasquatch. Please help.
a guy at my club fielded a unit and WAAAAAAAGH!! they tore apart everything they touched only problem was that they cost around 500 pts in the entire tourny they killed 10 termies and around 40 regular marines plus around 60 various units from other armies
Last edited by sir stompalot; September 23rd, 2008 at 04:36.
There is no other unit in all of 40k quite like Nob bikers. Nob bikers can decimate nearly anything in a raging torrent of dakka and choppa.
Fluff aside, here's the breakdown of their advantages:
1. They're jetbikes, and get the speed of such
2. They always have a 4+ cover save during shooting
3. They have powerful (if short range) shooting
4. They have base 3 attacks each
5. They have strength 5 on the charge, and toughness 5 at all times (with limitations)
6. They have a 4+ armor save
7. They can include a painboy
8. They can be made into a troop choice by including a warboss in the army
9. They can have combi-burnas
10. They have 2 wounds each
11. Weapon Skill 5
12. It's possible to make them all unique, allowing you to place wounds on multiple nobz before taking out whole models (although it raises the cost of the unit by 20-30 points, and if you suffer a wound that causes instant death, you have to remove an unwounded model, so this strategy has complications)
All these advantages are amazing, although there are disadvantages:
1. They cost around 50 points per nob, not counting extras
2. Stength 8 weapons cause instant death
3. In close combat, they only have an invulnerable save of 5+
4. They have relatively low initiative for a close combat based unit of their cost.
5. They don't benefit from fearlessness, and have a bad leadership score (although the bosspole helps)
At a glance, the advantages seem to outweight the disadvantages, but those three disadvantages are trouble, especially when you consider them all together.
For example, virtually every army in the game has something akin to a missle/rocket, with strength 8 and an AP of 3. These shots will tear biker nobz apart. Every missle shot that causes a wound will force you to make a single 4+ cover save. If you fail, then you lose a nob, costing you 50 points. Needless to say, that's a lot of points to lose to a single missle.
Units filled with power weapons (like Howling Banshees, or Terminators with Lightning Claws) or ones that re-roll hits and/or wounds are just as bad for nobz. Sure, they usually don't cause instant death, but they usually have a lot of attacks at a very high initiative, and even if they're only initiative 4, they strike first if they assault the nobz, and even in the worse case they strike at the same time.
Their leadership score is also a big problem if they happen to lose a close combat. For this reason, never have them join a fight with normal ork boyz. Why? Because the normal ork boy casualties counts against them, when determining who won and who lost. Always try and inflict as many casualties as possible, or your nobz might start running fairly quickly.
So why take the biker nobz? They're close combat GODS.
Here's my unit of choice: 7 nob bikers w/3 powerklaws, painboy, cybork bodies, wauugh banner, bosspole, combi-scorcha (on nob w/pk) [480 points]
I'm actually beginning to prefer this unit without a warboss. I still want a warboss, to make them a troop choice, but I'd rather put the warboss in a unit of boyz, to spread out the power and points.
Anyway, these nob bikers, on the charge, get 15 regular attacks at initiative 4, and 4 more painboy attacks that most likely get to re-roll wounds. Against normal marines that's 10 regular hits = 6-7 wounds = 2 dead marines. The painboy gets 2-3 hits = 1-2 wounds = 0.5 dead marines. The powerklaws go at init 1 and get 12 attacks = 8 hits = 6-7 dead marines.
That tactical squad is all but gone, and although they get to attack back, that's only 12 attacks back = 6 hits = 2 wounds = 1 failed armor save = 0-1 wound after feel no pain roll.
Biker nobz can wipe out most units without breaking a sweat, but they have weaknesses. They have units you don't want to throw them against (lot of powerklaws, lascannons, power weapons, etc), and the secret is knowing what to use them against.
I'm all for biker nobz. Just don't spend too much, or you'll be putting all your eggs in one basket. I wouldn't use more than one unit in the army either. That's because anything the biker nobz have trouble with, normal boyz don't have trouble with. They complement the normal ork boyz very well, so I'd use a healthy mix of both.
I've been hesitant to field them because of their points cost, but when I play larger games these things are pure monsters. I run a very simple squad that is fairly expensive per model (especially for ork standards) and I've used them as anti-vehicle troops.
I field 3 Nob bikers with 3 powerklaws. (210 points) Sure, I'll get 'em stuck in with troops or whatnot, but due to no painboy and therefore no cyborks, I need to be very careful and avoid the power weapons that my opponent fields. I used to use 'em as primary support troops, but lately I've been using them as shock troops to harrass my opponent, and with a normal bike squad on the other side of the board, you can quickly outflank anyone with how fast these guys are. They're just too expensive to use as a primary strike force, especially when a band of 30 boys can cause just as much, if not more, damage, and losses there don't really matter.
However, the easiest way to learn how these guys work is very simple - play some games with 'em, see what works and what doesn't. Worst case scenario, run a small squad of nob bikers, and if you don't like 'em, buy more bikes and throw the nobs in normal bike choices. Like I mentioned previously, I use them as anti-vehicle troops, and against more mechanized opponents, these guys are just unfair.
But hey, if they die, think like an ork. Some of the lads just saw a bike explode in a gigantic orgy of fire and carnage. How awesome is that?
3 Nob bikers with powerklaws and nothing else? That sounds like a bad idea any which way you look at it. At the very least they need a bosspole.
If they assault a tactical squad, they first shoot 9 twin linked shots, getting 6 hits = 4 wounds = 1 dead marine. In close combat the marine squad gets 11 attacks first, with 5 hits, 1-2 wounds and most likely 1 failed wound. That doesn't sound bad, but if there's a power weapon on the Sgt (very common in most marine armies), then one nob may die the first round. If all the nobz live, then the unit gets 12 powerklaw attacks for 6 hits and 5 dead marines. If one nob dies, then only 3-4 marines are killed. You won, but that tactical squad is still in the fight, and it'll take you at least one more turn to win, if you win at all.
Against anything stronger than a tactical squad, that entire nob squad is going to die, and against anything weaker, regular warbikers would have worked just as well.
For about 20 points cheaper, 6 warbikes with a nob, powerklaw and bosspole would have fired 18 shots = 12 hits = 8 wounds = 2-3 dead marines. The marines would hit first with 9 attacks = 4 hits = 1 wound = about a 60% chance of losing one biker. The bikes then hit back with 16-20 regular attacks = 8-10 hits = 4-5 wounds = 1-2 dead marines. The nob then gets 4 pk attacks = 2 hits = 1-2 kills.
The nobz killed 4-6 marines. The regular warbikes killed 4-7.
The regular warbikes did just as much damage or more, and they're much more resilient to shooting. The nobz have to take a panic check after only one casualty, whereas the regular warbikes have to take 2.
If you must use a small squad of nobz, then I'd use this: 5 biker nobz w/1 powerklaw, wauughh banner and a bosspole. That's only 275 points, and puts out 20 attacks at initiative 4, with weapon skill 5. Their shooting would first kill 2-3 marines, their close combat attacks would kill 3, and the powerklaw would kill 1-2 more.
That's 6-8 marines killed in one turn, which is far more effective than piling on powerklaws, and the unit is much more likely to survive the shooting phase before close combat. They'll still get eaten alive by power weapons, but it's a cheaper option than a full 400-500 point unit of nob bikers.
If you really want massed powerklaws, I'd use meganobz. Hold them in reserve, rush their trukk up to the nearest close combat and go wild. 3 meganobz with a scorcha, trukk and ram will do a lot of damage to just about anything, and at 165 points it's a much more reasonable option than 3 nob bikers.
Even for anti-armor, I'd still use 6 warbikers with one powerklaw and bosspole before the nob bikers. The nobz just lose too much when they take casualties from shooting.
Against a vehicle that has a 10 back armor, the regular warbikers inflict 1-2 glancing hits and the nob inflicts 2 glancing/penetrating hits (far more likely to be penetrating). The nob bikers would admittedly inflict 6 glancing/penetrating hits.
The nob bikers would be more effective, but it's not enough to warrant using them, when the warbikers are much less of a risk. Hell, even 3 regular warbikers with a powerklaw and bosspole would be a better choice. They still get the 2 penetrating hits from the nob, and it's only 115 points.
Last edited by mynameisgrax; September 23rd, 2008 at 20:34. Reason: forgot one thing
Thank you all for taking your time to explain all of this to me. I've decided to incorporate a unit of these bad boys in my upcoming ork army, and, being an Eldar player, I'm used to choosing the right targets for the right unit, AND how to keep my units alive/ out of the enemies heaviest fire. I think these big bad bikers will suit me just fine, despite the excessive cost .
I use these guys on a regular basis in a 1000 pt. league. My evaluation so far has been that they are amazing; however, from what I can tell, the larger the games get, i.e. 1500 pt over 1000 pt, the less effective they are. In my thousand point list, I run a warboss on a bike, in the squad of 3 nob bikers and a pain boy. As far as equipment, I run the warboss and two bikers with big choppa's and one with a power fist, and a waaaghh banner. I take the pain boy, but don't take the bionic body invulnerables. All the disadvantages are true, watch out for high str/ap and power weapons, but it isn't that bad in many cases. At the end of the day, in cc, they need high strength power weapons. Things like banshees will straight bounce off. Even on a charge they will have issues wounding. Also, the warboss can negate many power weapon characters like chaplains without power fists.