Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
I want to know how practical it is to run a jet bike army with 15+ jet bikes, lord on jet bike and two Haemonculi on jet bike, two to four raider squads, and two Ravager
It depends on who you are facing, but generally, being heavily outnumbered is a bad thing for dark eldar because they just aren't tough enough to pull it off. Reavers aren't much more effective in cc than warriors, and they can't take splinter cannons, so what would the role of that many bikes be against a non-mech army? You also have only 2 scoring units. Once they're gone, you'll be hard pressed to win in an objective game.
It would have style and look really cool (points for that!), but our jetbikes are no tougher or shootier than a Space Marine and cost significantly more points... it would be tough to win a lot of games.
"Is Archon Braigh-Dee going to have to choke a Wych?
Courtesy of Wicky: D.C.S.S.E.P.C.I.C.B.
In 4th edition it was practical and very cool. It did great against the T3 armies but didn’t fare so well against the marines. I only tried it at the 2,000 point level and used with a wwp I called it the “Angry Hornets” list because as soon as the bikes came out of the portal they were everywhere.
Starting in the Portal:
Archon on jetbike
Haemy on jetbike
6 Reaver jetbikes w/succ
6 Reaver jetbikes w/succ
3 Reaver w/2 blasters
Starting on the board:
Large warrior squad w/wwp
Last time I ran this list was back during the Fall of the Medusa V campaign but I doubt it would ever work now with just 2 scoring units – ahhh, those were the days!
Despite the changes with 2 handed weapons, the 3+ cover save and the extra 6” jump I still doubt if anything really changed in combat. The drawbacks are still the same:
Large bases make them hard to hide and move.
The 4+ save still isn’t very good.
The combat output is small with a base of 1 attack.
Squad mostly will strike last charging into cover.
High price for the small squad.
Squad of 6 bikes is the same cost of 8 wyches on a raider – I would rather have the wyches.
So yah, they are not very practical but hella cool.
"On a hunch, I melted them down and inhaled the fumes and read the dark eldar codex again, AND FOUND A BUNCH OF NEW RULES HIDDEN BEHIND THE OTHER WORDS..." [Gardeth on modelling & interpreting the DE Codex]
I'd say that the points the bikes cost aren't worth what you actually get.
Although a bike army would be SWEEEEET!!!
Also It Might Be worth Replacing one of the ravagers with a talos, or just adding a talos to your existing force.
I've only recently started with the DE, but one thing I've noticed right away is that more so than any other unit in the army (and possibly in the game), the DE jetbikes do not match their fluff at all. You might as well claim that grotts/gretchin are lords of close combat.
Despite the codex's claims, the jetbikes are TERRIBLE at close combat. If they get the assault, they only get 2 attacks each, and if they don't get the assault, they only get 1. The same number of points could be spent on 3 warriors, which would have 3 times the number of attacks on the charge, and 3 times the shots during shooting.
What jetbikes can do is deal with armor (give them 2 blasters and perhaps some haywire grenades for the succubus), and/or act as a viable alternative to a raider for transporting your Archon. The Archon is great in close combat no matter what unit he's attached to, and in most situations the jetbikes are a lot safer than raiders when moving him around. Attaching him to Wyches would be a lot more effective, but again, the raider you're transporting them all in is fragile.
Here are the only two ways I'd field bikes:
3 jetbikes w/2 blasters [95 points]
5 jetbikes w/2 blasters, succubus, agonizer, haywire grenades  (with or without an Archon attached)
Those units are cheap and effective, but overall, I wouldn't use them unless I'd already filled all the troop choices, added 1-2 Ravagers, and given my Archon a proper retinue (if he's not on a bike).
If you really want a list with a lot of bikes, I'd use 2 units of 3 jetbikes w/2 blasters, the above unit of 5 jetbikes with the succubus/agonizer/haywire, and an Archon on a jetbike with combat drugs, shadowfield, agonizer, trophy rack, haywire grenades, and either a pistol or xenospasm. Altogether, that's about 516-535 points, leaving you plenty of points for sniper squads, raider squads, and a ravager or two.
Last edited by mynameisgrax; February 6th, 2009 at 16:24. Reason: forgot one thing
"Any job worth doing, is worth doing with a powerklaw."
We have just as many 'Aspects' or specialists as the Eldar have and what the JB's excel at is being a delivery system for blasters and Succubi.
They are designed to take out that pesky indirect fire enemy unit or act as a rapid response unit to plug gaps or just simply to surprise the opponent.
To rely upon just bikes is a pipe dream, sort of like relying upon a pack of Hell's Angels to defeat the National Guard - you can picture a victory in your minds eye but in reality.......?
But by all means give it a go if you can afford all those models but as Kwi says many armies have the 'bugspray' to nuke 'Angry Hornets' rather too easily.
In a controversy the instant we feel anger we have already ceased striving for the truth, and have begun striving for ourselves.
If you're going for effectiveness this is the way to go.It's been a while that I have commented here but Reavers to me are meant to compliment your army - not replace it.
Reavers cost too much to take instead of wyches, warriors, raider squads, ravagers, talos and HQs
Once you have your full 6 troops, 3 heavy support and 3 elites and you have enough HQs you'll probably resort to reavers for cc and fire-power.
Taking reavers before any of the above is not more effective. Reavers did get some nice upgrades, but they still are fairly fragile and not super effective.
In most cases I'll use 1 or 2 squads. Each squad will have one of the following formations.
1 succubus, 2 reavers
3 reavers, 2 blasters
1 succubus, 4 reavers, 2 blasters (max 8 reavers in big battles)
1 succubus, 4 reavers, 2 shredders (max 8 reavers in big battles)
5 reavers, 2 shredders
I've never taken shredder reavers without having a blaster squad and I've never taken 2 shredder squads even though I could...
Very eceptionally I've taken 3 squads, 2 blasters squads (with or witohut succ) + 1 shredder squad (with or without succ)
Most times I take 2 blasters squads (with or without succ)
or just 1 blaster squad
or 1 blaster squad + 1 shredder squad
I've taken the insane 30 reavers option before as I can afford it (since I have 40 reaver jetbikes) but as cool as it may be I don't feel like doing it again as it's not super effective or cool to move . Moving them the first 2 turns is ok, but once you still have to move such a massive amount of bikes every turn you start getting bored, I'm almost glad their numbers go down each turn.
30 reaver jetbikes take A LOT of room on a battlefield...
They die pretty fast and they can't be hidden very easily, but their numbers are still enough to survive some time.
The only list I've played with 30 reaver was a bit like this:
2*8 wyches in raider (each with agoniser succ)
6 raider squads with all blaster, dark lance, full
3*10 reaver squads, 4 blasters, 2 shredders.
The main core wasn't the jetbikes, but the reavers gave enough time for the ravagers and raiders to rain their dark matter on the enemies.
The the time the reavers had lost half their forces the enemies were suffering.
About 8 reavers died during the final assaults and final cleaning of the battlefield.
3 ravagers, 6 disintegrators, 3 dark lances
I also remember doing some similar list but with less reavers (around 20)
but with 1 big wych squad in raider + 2 ravager lords (lords in raider + warrior retinues+ 2 dark lances+2 incubi with blasters)
But it was in the 4th edition. also around 2500 pts
This had less reavers and it was devastating
The reason why most people don't use this list is because it's very expensive and not everybody has 20 reaver jetbikes + tons of raiders.
I want to play a similar list like this in this edition, but I'm thinking of having mandrakes as cc squads, as they're less expensive and I can have more than 1 squad.
I also did this kind of list but apoc wise with full reaver sqauds (30) + 2 ravager lords + 3 small wych squads in raiders +6 raider squads + 3 ravagers
It was the same as above, it was cool watching it, but the battle was pretty boring, as I knew what the outcome was going to be.
I played this list shortly after the previous list as I wanted to have those 2 ravager lords + full reavers.