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I have been noticing alot of lists lately that have fire prisms. This doesn't suprise me much as I think it is one of the most flexible units in the eldar army and since we specialize so much it's nice to have a general unit we can use to fill the gaps so to speak. Now what is suprising me is how often fireprisms are being taken without holo fields. For me the holo field is a must on basicly any and all fire prisms I put in a list. I understand that they are not cheap but without them the fire prism becomes less protected than a wave serpent. When my friends hear me say that one of my prisms does not have the holofields I can count on them ripping into it and dropping it, often on the first turn they can see it. I don't find this happening with falcons they always seem to have the holo fields when they are put into a list.
So my question is simple, Why? Is the reduced cost worth the loss of protection? Am I just playing my fire prisms wrong and thus getting them shot and killed? (I generally keep them as far away as possible with keeping a clear lane of fire ) Why does the falcon get the royal treatment but the fire prism is left as the default model?
I don't mean this to be an inflamitory post, if I can be convinced that they are not worth it I could shave a good number of points in my current standard lists (perhaps enough for a cheap autarch ).
Any way please share with me your thoughts on fireprisms both with and without holo fields.
Well my opinion on this topic is that holofields aren't really worth the 35 points extra on top of the prism. The Fire prism as you know has a range of 60" with the prism cannon and so should be kept out of range of the enemy or behind cover. If you do this the prism's cannon should be able to wreak havoc over the battle field without being damaged seeing as no troops/vechiles except two that I know of have a range of 60". Holofields are only a must if you are going to buy your fire prism a shuriken cannon which has a range of 24" because you will be in range of enemy troop and tank fire. Also if versing Tau and you take a fire prism you should give it holofields seeing as your opponent will most likely take broadsides and hammerheads which have a range of 72" or 120"(not entirely sure which one). Other than these reasons I believe running a fire prism with holofields is a waste of points which you could spend getting more troops or better upgrades.
NEVER take a fire prism without a holo field.
especially in my list they are the main killing power and i dont want to increase the risk of losing them, yes its a pricey upgrade but by far one the best in whole game, them amount of times my opponent has glanced and rolled a 6 and a 1, it keeps them alive so much longer!
as for staying 60'' away, thats not always possible, most games now are on 4'x4' tables unless corner to corner you wont get that 60'' gap you want. the stay away strategy is not always reliable, holo fields are.
I'm not sure about you, but if I am playing a game on a 4x4 table. I'm not bringing prisms. I'm bringing stuff that will be able to hold up when things get personal. Because it WILL.
I personally don't like playing games on a table less that 4x6 (with most of our tables being around 5x7 or 6x If we are playing on a 4x4 table, we use the rules from the 4th ed for 400 pt games.
* "I'm Significant!" -screamed the dust speck
* "Call me old fashioned, but an evil ascension to power just isn't the same without someone chanting faux Latin in the background."
I agree with all of you (cos I'm agreeable like that)
If your playing close up on a small table then Holofields are more sensible, but also so is getting something a little more focused on the inevitable CC
If you're playing on a big table, not such a big deal unless you have the spare points kicking about.
I suppose you can always keep track in your games as to how many times do you actually make use of the upgrade in a game. If it's a lot then it was probably worth it for your style and situation. I've had games where the FP has never received a single shot as it was either too far away, too hard to kill or just not worth attacking as it was not a "troop" choice.
(Lovely pic of my FirePrism at this link BTW http://www.librarium-online.com/foru...fireprism.html )
Fair enough, so the big reason people don't take them is because they feel the fire prism isn't going to get targeted. My question then is how do you keep them from being targeted? when most people have 36" to 48" range on the anti tank weapons they bring, and tables only being 48" from side to side you have to have almost a completely cross table shot to keep your distance. Plus my opponents don't have all the AT on one flank. I rarely can bring my fire prisms into good shooting possitions without risking atleast some return fire.
IMHO - You can move faster and shoot further than your enemy in most cases. I tend to keep it behind cover if possible and then move and eliminate close range threats. It may be worth missing a turn of shooting to move into a more strategic firing position. So much depends on what else you have to distract your enemy and who your enemy is.
thats exactly my comment, if you want to shoot effectively with your prism you are going to have to expose it 9/10 that means taking fire in your opponents following turn.
ALSO you cannot guarantee the size of the table you play on, if you go to a tourny not all the tables are 6'x4' and not all 4'x4' it can vary. last time i went i got a tyranid army on a 4'x4' table then the next game orcs on 6'x4'
fire prisms have the 'potential' to kill more than any other eldar unit, disregarding scatter they have the equivalent of a lascannon with a template. thats going to be a juicy target, and i would rather pay the 35 pts to keep it alive rather than lose a 150pt killing machine.
look at the numbers.
1. the prism moves 12'' (can still fire the prism cannon)
2. meaning it can only be glanced
3. if you have vectored engines only double 6 will destroy the prism
4. making your odds of getting destroyed 1/36 (not counting the percentage you need to hit, say 66% or even 50%)
its very unlikely that you will take 36 'hits' in one battle, maybe they will stop you shooting but still you can move behind cover and wait till next turn, whereas without the holo fields you could have lost you prism all together.
im going to say that you should always make the points available to take holo fields.
I have a bit of an add-on question to this as I am thinking of getting some Prisms for my army.
Are they good by themselves, or is it absolutely essential to have two or more in a list so you can combine fire these days?
One fire prism works ok but they really shine with two ( or more ) as the linked shots open up alot of options when shooting.