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  1. #1
    Member Kranberry's Avatar
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    Better Counter-charge/bodyguard?

    Ok, so a question that I hope just doesn't come down to harlies vs banshee vs scorpions.

    There is a firebase of 2 groups of 6-8 pathfinders in cover, which would work better and synchronize/compliment better:

    1. Wraithlord 2x flamers, starcannon and scatter laser with 6 harlies{5xkiss} (shadowseer and troupe master)

    2. Falcon (stones, holo, starcannon/eml/long range support), 6 banshees (executioner and acrobat)

    3. 2x- 8 scorpions (claw, stealth and shadowstrike if needed).


    I realize that the scorpions do not have a long range fire, but I put them in because they deal with hoards very well, which seems to be the bane of pathfinders.

    Any suggestions, comments?

    Last edited by Kranberry; February 24th, 2009 at 02:12.
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  3. #2
    Member Dekendo's Avatar
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    I would go for option 1 or 3, either would work fairly well to complement the pathfinders. The scorpions would work best in my opinion with the ability to infiltrate along side the pathfinders. On the other hand the lord and harlies have a huge bite in close combat. Whichever one of these you want would work wonders, it just depends on what flavor you like best. The banshees don't really fit well to augment pathfinders as they are both high armor hunters and don't deal well with hoards.
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  4. #3
    Member Kranberry's Avatar
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    Thanks! Now to decide...
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    Senior Member cheart's Avatar
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    I;m going to sort of go against Dekendo here and suggest you go for option 1 over option 3. I've found that whenever I take scorpions they often get half shot up before they make it to anything. The harlies at least will give your opponent some headaches as he tries to decide if taking them out is worth missing some shots that could be spent elsewhere. Also, what happens if you have your 2 squads of scorps there and they decide to send 2 rhinos full of marines your way? Or even worse, full of SOB with 2 flamers in each squad? I think the anti-tank presence combined with the superior long-ranged fire-power would make the wraithlord/harly combination superior.

    This may be a bit of a stretch, but if you ever wanted to move one/both of your pathfinder squads you could use your harlies as a moving 2+ save!

    If you don't like the lower armour and strength of the harlies you could always swap them for a squad of scorps and infiltrate those in with the pathfinders, then have the wraithlord as well.

  6. #5
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    Actually I'm going to suggest option 2 (or at least something in a falcon or waveserpent).

    The reason is that, on the ground, you just can't match an enemy that is strong there.

    Meaning what you hope will happen is that your pathfinders get rushed, and then the scorps or whatever swoop in and save the day.

    But the harsh reality is that the enemy will swoop in, flame or stab the pathfinders, and still have more than enough oomph on hand to deal with your other units. Especially if they're of the flaming variety. Wiping out the pathfinders while still being too far off for WL or scorps, or probably even harlies, to contact right away.

    The with the skimmer option you have the ability to put the pathfinders far off on the map. In an objective based game. the units that kill them may be "dead" in effect because of being too far from the main objectives. If they split up their forces to go after them you can focus your skimmer and assault troops on one. You'll lose the other pathfinders, but hopefully cave in one of your opponents flanks. If they go in force after one group, than just sit back and fire away with the other squad of pathfinders and the skimmers weapons.

    Another advantage is that if you're up against a shooty army, having your melee troops in a fast skimmer lets you take the fight to the enemy.

  7. #6
    It came from the warp... Fleeting Ęther's Avatar
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    Ah the look of disappointment when people try to shoot at Harlies from across the board only to find out they're nigh impossible to see. It never gets old. Anyways, I'm kind of biased since I run a firebase of two EML/BL Wraithlords and 8 Harlies (Troupe Master, Shadowseer with kiss, and 6 regulars with kisses) as a counter charge/anti-tank firebase unit alongside my Rangers and they've performed exceptionally well (once I figured out how to judge the unforgiving kill zone/rapid-fire zone of the Harlies that is.) If you start to dip below 8 though, I've found that those last couple stragglers tend to kill a few Harlies which really hurts the unit in subsequent combats. Also, if the Harlies don't get the charge, they're effectiveness will be MUCH less significant as you just lost 16% of your wounds due to not getting the strength increase.

    I will say however, that I like Scorpions too, but I feel that they are better as a spearhead assault unit with other mechanized units rather than a counter-charge unit. They can pour out wounds like no tomorrow, but without power-weapons or rending, they'll fail to be effective against high armor opponents like Terminators. Harlies dish out a fair number of attacks themselves, and can deal with better armored opponents a whole lot better than Scorpions.
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    My rather biased opinions of harlies aside... I really think of those options it will depend on how you want to play. If you are going to have your pathfinders far away, then a wave serpent/falcon idea is really a good thing to look at, otherwise, the sheer power and awesomeness of the wraithlord is always a boon on the battlefield. (I think I must be tired cause that sounds weird to me).

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    Member Kranberry's Avatar
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    Haha, na EldarNewb, the alliteration was fine!

    And thanks again for everyone's suggestions. It seems like I'll be loosing a little more sleep over what to field...

    Edit.

    I probably should also note (and probably should have sooner) that my ideal for my army is a flanking/pushing force consisting of my HQ (farseer+warlocks) and fire dragons in falcons running up the side and then my firebase of pathfinders and avengers hitting them as they move away from them.
    Last edited by Kranberry; February 24th, 2009 at 05:54.
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    I'd definitly go with the falcon mounted unit then. Since you can get them where you want them and you already have skimmers drawing anti vehicle weapons fire.

    Note that you may want to mount up on of the DA as well. In 2/3rds of the missions you'll need a troop (or ideally more than one) that can take a far objective.

    Keeping 2 pathfinder units and a squad of DA on the ground in the backfield seems fine. Though I wouldn't put them right on an objective. I'd put the objective out in the open, at least against a melee based opponent. So the enemy will get shot up if they sit on it, and will be far away from it if they go for the pathfinders.

    The second unit of DA can move onto it in the final turns. Again even if the opponent got on the objective this puts the opponent in the position where he either has to sit and get pounded by the DA if the game doesn't end fast or surrender the objective to go after them (at which point you might be able to swoop in with a mobile troop choice).

  11. #10
    Member Dekendo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kranberry View Post
    I probably should also note (and probably should have sooner) that my ideal for my army is a flanking/pushing force consisting of my HQ (farseer+warlocks) and fire dragons in falcons running up the side and then my firebase of pathfinders and avengers hitting them as they move away from them.
    Well with that I'd think the wraithlords and harlies would be a perfect fit for you. Hold the pathfinders at a nice location to hold objectives and do a slow march with the harlies just in front or behind the lord. Unless there are a lot of large blasts and those damned hell hounds you should be ok.
    Never apologise for asking questions young seers, through asking
    questions we find answers, and through those answers we gain
    knowledge of ourselves and the universe around us
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