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So, this is an issue that a friend and I had a little while ago and have been argueing about ever since. We decided to let the ruling go to you; the people of LO. I'm fairly certain I've read the codex well enough, but just to get further clarification to prove to my friend.
-We all know the specifics of WBB and what makes a model ineligible.
-We know that having a res orb within range negates those things that make a model ineligible for WBB
-We know that having a monolith within range allows you to re-roll WBB
The arguement is that I say having BOTH a res orb AND a monolith within range allows you to re-roll failed WBB rolls, even if the model was killed by means that make them ineligible for WBB. My arguement is that because having the orb negates the stipulation of ineligibility for WBB, and a monolith allows the re-roll for any model 'eligible' for WBB, that having both within range allows you to re-roll even if killed by weapons which would 'normally' negate WBB.
His arguement is that the orb allows a model WBB even if killed by weapons that make it ineligible, however the monolith only allows the re-roll to models that are eligible for WBB, meaning you can roll once because of the orb, but do not get the re-roll because they are otherwise technically 'ineligible' for WBB.
Anyway, I apologize for the extremely specific nature of the post, I just wanted to accurately portray the situation. Also my repetitive usage of certain words, I did this because these are the words used in the codex.
Any Helpful opinions would be greatly appreciated in settling this dispute.
Yes the Res Orb and monolith's portal stack, nowhere in the codex does it say they don't (ironically WBB has very few resrictions - especially when the other gear comes into play).
Since WBB is determined at the start of the next turn but res orb coverage is determined at the point when the wound is dealt, if they (being warriors in this example) were in Res orb range and hit by (say) a battlecannon, the res orb made the eligible for WBB.
Thus, since they are getting WBB the monolith portal re-roll stands.
Last edited by The_Outsider; March 31st, 2009 at 11:28.
"His arguement is that the orb allows a model WBB even if killed by weapons that make it ineligible, however the monolith only allows the re-roll to models that are eligible for WBB"
See the error in his argument? He says himself that the Orb makes all models in range eligible for WBB, so why can't they reroll with the 'lith? Yes, what you said is correct.
What people need to understand is that the res orb doesn’t give you an extra WWB roll, it only allows you to bypasses any rule that would normal prohibit you from taking it.
The fact of the matter remains that at the start of your next turn, your troops in question were eligible for a WWB roll. If you then failed your normal WWB roll that the res orb was so kindly able to allow you to take, then you use your monolith to bail you out.
This is an easy one.
First, elligibility for WBB is determined *AT THE TIME THE MODEL DIES*. The only exception to this is the 6" rule, which is determined at the time of when the rolls start. In other words, if the model dies and there's an orb in range, it gets WBB. If not, no WBB. This also means that if the Lord dies before the model that needs a Res Orb to get WBB does, the model will not get WBB, despite the "downed" Lord being within 6".
Now, as to the Monolith - the Monolith is simply a reroll of the previous WBB roll - all elligibility requirements have already been determined. How can I prove this? Simple: http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_...th_Edition.pdf
The answer is a combination of the fifth and sixth question on page one, and the sixth question on page three. The first two describe how a Res Orb determines when it takes effect - essentially as I described above. The last question regards the Monolith recycle ability; it doesn't stipulate Res Orb, but rather, the 6" rule, but the effect is the same, given when it's determined if a model gets WBB rolls.
So print out the official GW FAQ and slap him in the face with it.
Basically the guy is being a GIANT DOOSH! doing the old rules lawyer tactic of using 'technicalities' so you don't get to use your specials rules and so he can in effect make up his own. As it has been said get a copy of the FAQ and super glue it to his forehead.
Well now, we've had "slap him", "poke him" and "glue it to his face"! Remind me not to argue with you guys!
Heh heh! Just kidding. I would probably have just pulled the old "could you show me where that is in the Codex?" with an innocent look on my face (and then poked/slapped him).
"Tau Commandment #226: Participants who use Velocity Trackers in the Tau Clay Pigeon Tournament will be disqualified"
Okay.. seems as if I misunderstood something here.. But it sounds like all of you understand it like the monolith only needs to be close for the re-rolls to be allowed?!
I always thought it only worked for the one unit you jumped out of the lith that turn.. Just a fast clarification.. Hijacking the thread.. sorry..
Don't worry, we're still sane as far as I know. At least I was referring to the unit teleporting to the 'lith.