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to everyone out there
im just getting back into 40k and remember having my ex-chaos butt handed too me numerous times by an eldar player and so have decided to collect eldar... having said that now i'm kinda interested in what people think in regards to melee troops
the question is not so much which is better as i understand they all are quite apt but more whats your personal experience with the eldar melee group and if you had to choose one which would it be
at the moment i'm leaning toward the harliquins as they look cool and have a kinda cool story line but im not sure how effective they would be against your run of the mill space marine
so insert your opinions here
I'd say Howling Banshees without a shadow of a doubt.
Banshees are VERY cheap for what they are, they are great for taking out Marines with their 3 power weapon attacks. Unfortunately, against Marines they kind of rely on annihilating them completely in the first round so that the Marines don't get a chance to strike back. But this usually happens so that's fine. They're also brilliant for taking out things like Termies with 2+ saves, unfortunately they are very vulnerable to heavy flamers as I have found out numerous times to my cost. But the advantages in my experience far outweigh the disadvantages and I always take at least one unit of them
Harlequins are good, but in comparison to Banshees are too expensive points-wise. Sure, they have Furious Charge and a load of other nice special rules, but the only real way to make Harlequins work REALLY well is to give them a Shadowseer so they can't be picked off before they get close. If you give them a Shadowseer they are worth it; otherwise I would steer clear of them.
Striking Scorpions are good against T4+ units because of the extra Strength they get from their weapons, and it's worth maybe having a unit of them. But Howling Banshees are wonderfully underpriced for what they are and I personally never go anywhere without them.
Hope that helps.
I always adhere to the Maxim "Banshees vs MEQ, Scorpions vs Hordes".
So in the long run, i want both, so i can kick specific ass.
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Yeah, i just had a huge debate with a buddy of mine regarding scorpions vs banshees vs harlies. He thinks that Harlies are teh sex. I strongly disagree with him. Banshees get the exact same job done that the harlies do BUT they can buy a waveserpent and cost 16 pts vs 24 pts a model (not including the requisite shadow seer.) He then proceeded to tell me that rending was just as good as power weapons with that many throws. At which point i knew he was full of it and totally wrong. He said that they will handle hordes much better than banshees. He's right there to a point, but the fact that they only sport a 5+ invuln means that they are extremely vulnerable after a charge, cause most things will die by their hand on the first turn in an assault, if its a horde army there is a really good chance that there is a another sqaud sitting fairly close ready to tear into em. When 280 points of harlies goes missing it hurts a lot more than 180 pts of banshees. So I still say banshees.
Scorps are nice, but they can't fleet which makes them considerably less useful to me, even though they are tough.
There was post on this very topic not too long ago if you want a more complete discussion.
I prefer banshees. If you buy the counter-assault power for them then they still get their initiative 10 and extra "charge" attack. 3 power weapon attacks each will take down any MEQ unit. However against hordes I would just send a wraithlord because chances are they can't hurt it.
Well if you're asking about the units with nothing other than what you can buy for them scorpions are the best in my opinion, better save high number of strong attacks, infiltrate.
If your talking about the units with other options for aid, I would say harlies are better if you give them a farseer with doom/fortune. The rerollable inv. save and failed wounds is just brutal on your opponet. I just take 10 with kisses the shadowseer upgrade and said farseer. Hop them in a wave serpant you can buy for dire avengers or any other unit if you really want to get them up there.
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Banshees, no contest, harlequins are and have always been useless, scorpions are good, but banshees are very good, low STR, but the power weapon makes up for that
I would suggest you go look back a page or two and you should find a long post about this. As for which is best it is ultimately play style choice.
Banshees kill heavy armor and that is it.
Harliquins can kill everything in the game except for AV 14s (which they could if you wanted to give them the melta pistols but that is a waste)
Scorpions are decent all around but mostly favor horde type targets.
IMO Harliquins are best as the codex is right now with 5th edition core rules if you are making a take all comers list but if you write a list vs every opponent you play then you can be more exact and pick one of the more specialized units.
Warning: If you have not already bought the models stay away from banshees as they are total waste in 5th as the mask does not negate the initiative penalty if they have to make a DT test so they will go at initiative 1. Plus they can not be used without a waveserpent so you have to add that to their cost making them no cheaper then harliquins. If you do already have them I suggest you leave them on a self till GW makes a useful errata or redoes the codex.Harliquins are 22 points per model with kiss not 24 and a squad of 10 with all kisses and shadowseer is 250 (dont need anything besides that) and 10 banshees with exarch (executioner) and the cheapest waveserpent is 282 points. (all which they must have to be effective.)Banshees get the exact same job done that the harlies do BUT they can buy a waveserpent and cost 16 pts vs 24 pts a model
Last edited by Lyzaru; April 23rd, 2009 at 23:38.
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I have never seen anyone give me a hard time for using the banshee mask as its intended. That includes Gamesworkshop personnel in league and tourney play and my opponents. That's a pretty narrow interpretation of the rule imo. The banshee mask ignores initiative bonuses conferred by grenades and cover, and the biggest initiative bonus there is is going first.
Last edited by FartsMcGee; April 23rd, 2009 at 23:58.
I agree that banshees should strike at initiative 10 on the first round of combat always.
However, I just wanted to inform him that under 5th they don't. Firstly it is not cover that causes the initiative penalty nor is it from grenades, it is from you having to make a difficult or dangerous terrain test reguardless of why. Second they don't gain a bonus like they did in 4th, you instead suffer a penalty. (bonuses and penalties are not the same)
This is just another one of GW many failures at erratas.
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