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1. Easily the coolest troop models if not coolest models altogether
2. long long range, pinning, decent chance for AP1, decent chance to wound anything, hard to shoot off in cover, infiltrates, stealth, ignores terrain, scouts..
How do you use them as a core, your only troops or most of your troops would be pathfinders. Do you keep them out of enemy range and in cover and aim to pin units? are they bad at capturing objectives?
I play SMALL games, like 1,000 points. Thinking of running 10 pathfinders and 10 Dire Avengers. + 3 lords. any strategies for the pathfinder fire base? what do you target and how do you keep them alive?
My first idea for you would be to break the 10 pathfinders into groups of 5, or maybe give them another man so they have 6. This allows you to shoot at different big things coming at you if needed.
Keeping them alive is harder now with lots of deep striking things and IG with their freaking shooting flamer attack, along with them being like tau in CC. I run two squads of 6 and I keep mine alive by either providing a counter charge unit, such as a lord, or harlequins near by or behind them (Harlequins are nice with a shadow seer because you can surround your pathfinders to give them a 2+ cover save in the open with no terrain ) or put a transport near them to allow an enemy unit to try to charge them, only to find them 24 inches away in a transport with a 4+ cover save.
For my targeting purposes, I aim for high value targets, command squads with FnP or MC (hive tyrants, Daemon Princes, etc) or anything that my other troops would have a hard time wounding, as snipers always wound on 4+.
whenver i use my pathfinders they ALWAYS get owned by a flamer or fast moving CC units
tl;dr Too many of them make your army very weak against a majority of threats, from IG, SM, Orks, Nids, etc. They're a specialized troop, that is incredibly effective at bringing down Monstrous creatures and things that benefit less from cover saves, especially when they are in smaller squads and can split their fire to where its needed (and scare the enemy into cover.)
My reasons for liking the small groups, regardless of them being more prone to run off the field are:
- Enemies will need to concentrate to get them, splitting the group makes this effort less worthwhile.
- You can use one group to cover another
- You can split their fire
- Markerlights and things like that become significantly less effective, the squad becomes a smaller target and might appear to not be worth wasting heavy cover-ignoring or special weaponry on.
- Unless your ForceOrg chart is full, an extra troops choice gives you some more map control in that sector.
Last edited by Arkanor; June 10th, 2009 at 01:10.
In earlier renditions of the eldar army the alaitoc lists were pretty mean and cheesy, but the abundance of cover saves and the increase in army model counts makes it pretty hard to get a list to function with pathfinders at its core. The pathfinders function best as auxillary support in my experience. A handy unit for thinning the scary stuff and running around in a pinch.
I agree with Arkanor regarding the small groups. In addition to what he said it minimizes your losses with the inevitable assault, makes it less painful when they fail their ld7 check, and gives more chances to pin. Something else i've noticed about the pathfinders is that 5 works about as well as 10, and cost half the price. On top of that, unless its up high, the objective is better served with a different baby sitter. The enemy will be moving to the objective and once they get there, the pathfinders will just say, "oh hey take it, wasn't really using it anyway." Whereas if you put them off the objective they get to shoot while the enemy sits on the objective, or contends with what ever was there, with the ability to run towards it if need be.
I see 3 basic ways to use Pathfinders as core troops :
1. Minimal troops.
Use two small squads (2 * 120pts) , that you will consider as totally expendable (so, no need to give them support). Use them in a disruptive way, to place your opponent in a dilemna (damned if he ignores them, damned if he doesn't...). The strength of your army must be built (in this case) on other units. The key advantages of the Pathfinders in this approach are :
Main drawbacks : they are damn expensive for expendable units (Jetbikes are probably much better), and they are not resilient against CC units, flamers, etc. Low Ld is a critical disadvantage.
- they can infiltrate
- they are fast
- they can claim objectives
- they can be a nuisance against high-value units (MCs, etc) if they have good field of fire
2. Fire base.
Establish a cross-fire base, and support it by other units (CC, ICs to provide high Ld, transport, Wraithlords...).
The low rate of fire of Pathfinders means that this would be effective only against very specific ennemies (low number of high T models, or such...)
This will mean a rather defensive strategy.
3. The true Pathfinders attack...
You could go for a Pathfinders + Scorpions combination, and infiltrate the whole lot... Using Karandras could have some sense. Harlequins could also play a role (deploy them forward, to link up quickly with the infiltrators). A mobile army is necessary in this case, I think (transports, jetbikes, fast attack / deep-striking units). This would mean a very aggressive strategy, going for a hard strike by turn two, probably oriented to close combat... The Pathfinders would be used mostly to take objectives, I think.
Very dicey. Reminiscent of the Market - Garden operation in Sept 1944, and... that did not end too well... But it shows guts !
There may be other approaches that I haven't seen, of course.
Children of Isha