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in my opinion Tau are absolutely ballsed statistically, Gw have set up the tau so that their weapons are insane, for which we are extremely appreciative, however, for a slight strength advantage at extreme cost, the tau have suffered statistically, for example, whats the point of having a S5 weapon which hits 50% of the time, but only for a time, all those points are evicerated the second that unit enters combat.
if the tau had a WS increasing perk then i could accept it, but with an average WS 0f just 2 you have no hope of killing anything in combat, even if you land the hit you are left with a S3 to wound, average yes, balanced no.
now i understand that the tau revile combat and believe themselves to be past such barbaric forms of warfare, however, that would suggest that the tau BS would be higher in reponce, yet for 10pts you get a BS shared with most 4-6pts models.
we all know that this will never be rectified unless the Tau are supplemented with an xv system which ups their strength, this would at least gift the tau with some bite, even if they do fight like drunken worms.
I find that all races are balanced in some form, eldar are capable at range, short though it may be, whilst they are devastating in close combat, orks are talentless but mass to equate quantity over quality, but they still get the job done.
but tau are rediculously expensive, they have inferior abilities, with good equipment, they're just not balanced, if the firewarriors were cheaper, even just 2-3pts cheaper then they would be a viable option, at the moment i don't want to take any firewarriors if i can help it, i'd be happy to take Kroot, they maynot have an armour save, but they still have skill, and cheap enough to take the numbers to make up for the lack of armour.
i dunno what do you guys think, am i overreacting or am i justified?
The key to using Tau successfully is using units together to support and enhance the lists performance as a whole. Fire Warriros BS3, mmmm no problem use the Markerlights to up their BS to 4 or even 5. Hammerhead subs scatter a problem use the ML to up the BS to 5.
Enemy unit threatening your XV88's or HH then use the Kroot units to intercept/block the enemy unit.
Tau are the best army I know of who can use wargear to routinely increase or improve a units basic stat performance. BS a problem then take a Targeting array, name any other unit that can take STR7 weapons at B4S twin linked, move 6" shoot and then move another 6" for 41pts. Want to shoot two different targets in one turn take a Target lock
We have heavy SRT10 weapons that can move 12" and still fire or fire twin linked railguns while hiding behind 2+ Sv/4+ inv shield Drones.
We have a 7pt model that can infiltrate, have bolter equivalent weapons, good strength, decent CC abilities and has a nice pet doggy that eat Marines for breakfast.
We are blessed with good units and a balanced army. True it has its faults but these faults are nothing that cannot be overcome by good list building and a grasp of tactics.
Tau are not for the casual player, if you just throw a list together and expect it to perform and play it like a Marine list then you will lose and lose badly. Marines and other MEQ armies are forgiving, they are made this way by GW purposefully to attract and keep the 10 yr old's and power gamers into the GW fold. You can build a totally s**t MEQ list, play like a lobotomised log and still have a decent game. Take a sub par Tau list and play well and you may drag out a few wins or draws, take a good Tau list and play like a plank and you will do the same.
Take a good Tau list and play well and you will be able to take on any army and win, but it takes time and skill.
Last edited by Rikimaru; August 23rd, 2009 at 00:14.
thanks for that, you have a sobering point, i think i was in a bad mood when i wrote my original post, because i don't agree completely with many of those things i've said.
i honestly love tau, but sometimes they do aggrovate me, i've never won with them, but after a brief foray into eldar and marines, i've come home to tau, i've realised that i am a pescimist, in my mind all things come to cc, which is not true with a well gouverned tau force.
i have read your post and read through the codex, they are far better than they were in the 3rd edition codex, so maybe the few issues which niggle at me now will not in the event of a 5th or 6th ed codex.
i withdraw my statement, for the most part, but i do feel that tau should have a cc weapons list, even without high weapon skill, or at the very least reduce the negative effects of the ethereal to make them a pheasable option.
ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
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Although I agree that they are not a terrible army simply because they are challenging, I do think the Tau should be a more flexible army so that there are more viable options and strategies for the player. How exactly to do that is a complicated question, but I believe it should be the goal of every army to let the player make up his/her own unique strategies rather than to have mandatory units dictate how they have to play.
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if anything id want GW to make kroot at least cheaper than they are. they're about as useful as gaunts in my experience and almost double the points! also wats with the krootox being fkin T3?! they coiuld at the very least give them the toughness they deserve, and not make us envy the orks for the armor save they have! now im not saying they're completely useless, but ive never been able to see them anymore than expensive gaunts, heck even gaunts can lurk and get an improved cover save, but kroot dont even get a 6+. One last thing is that Tau arent hopeless in combat. Just today i was charged by some sister repentia, and i went first since they charged into difficult terrain. I killed 5 of them and he could only get back at me with half of wat its original strength was! i then fell back and was slaughtered, however i then rapid fired with 24 more fire warriors that were just waiting.
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There is no doubt in my mind Tau units are overpriced because of codex creep. However I bet we will be seeing a new codex roll around sometime in 2010.
On the other hand they are extremely powerful in a doubles tournament, where your partner can protect you from CC while you blast the bejeezus out of the enemy.
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While i agree that the tau have some MAJOR irritating factors, particularly to beginners like myself (i'm 0-9 win/loss right now), i still believe that they CAN be used well, all it takes is a little patience...and a lot of Practice.
Case in point- I recently played a friendly 3 way match. we made the objective to hold as many of the 5 pieces on the board as we could . I was playing tau, my brother kale played his Chaos marines, and his friend nathan played Ultramarines.
First turn was a disaster-my ethereal died first shot, my fire warriors nearly all fled off the board, and kale quickly captured a piece. from then on things only got worse, as my devilfish blew up, my hammerhead wrecked after failing to injure more than 2 CSM's, and i got assaulted by Defilers, Demons, and Possesed (I should probably mention that nathan wasnt really whole-heartedly into this game, for whatever reason.)
In the end, i lost, hardcore...yet i realize now that i did SEVERAL things wrong, and that there are ways to correct them. Kale wants the peices so bad? let him have them...then get close enough to blast away at Rapid Fire range with rifles and whatever else i can muster. Leave the ethereal somewhere SAFE, or forego him altogether. bring kroot...much more kroot. maybe some hounds too, and maybe some shapers, just to add some kick and a wee bit o' armour. Overall, a bit of rethinking really would have made my chances a lot better.
So basically, what im saying is, tau may frustrate the hell out of you, but don't give up on them. Re-think. Adapt. Learn. Really, in many ways they are the best army for learning the game like that, and discovering new strategies and unit combinations.
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well Rando one thing i should tell u is NEVER TAKE AN ETHEREAL! They are cannon fodder and when they die they pretty much screw ost of ur army. then the kroot. i wouldnt feild them, but if u must then make sure u have lots of them, but dont take shapers, they not worth the points for waat they can do, instead do take the hounds, they're almost as good but less wounds. Also if ur taking kroot always make sure u have enough to keep them alive long enough to block some big stuff.
There are three kinds of people in this world, those who can count and those who cannot.