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I've got some Vypers from back in the day when starcannons still had their testicles and when Vypers could do a jump in and out thing rather like a Tau Crisis suit with an armor value.
Shortly after the new codex came out they were relegated to a rearguard action against encroaching dust bunnies.
But I'm starting to think they might be an option in the new edition, and was wondering if other people had some experience. Also you could confirm if I'm understanding things right.
First of all it would seem the vyper is particularily well designed to take advantage of the new cover rules. This is because most vehicles have their main weapon on a centrally mounted turret. On a vyper the turret is to the extreme rear, and depending on your mounting angle it may be notably elevated relative to the bulk of the hull. Allowing you to stick the things butt around corners, over hills, or "looking over the shoulder" of a serpent or somesuch.
Secondly if I read the squad rules right, if you have, say, two vypers and one of them has cover, the other does too. So even a small bit of cover like a lone tree might hide a bit over half a vyper, while the other can just be positioned completely out in the open.
And if shots are coming in one at a time it would seem like you could have a "whipping boy" type vyper. I.e. Maybe have one in the squad with holofields. Or just have one that can be generally beat up.
Also in Kill point missions they have to get all of them for the point. So you could potentially have a lone one fall back or retreat if it's fellows were taken out.
The rules for blast weapons would also seem to mitigate the BS3 when using an EML in some cases. And that could be useful if IG are now popular and dangerous, as opposed to always gearing the army for smurfs.
Still. There are plenty of reasons why they aren't such a great choice that still apply, so I'm not sure if the above makes up for it.
Last edited by sunnyside; April 9th, 2010 at 17:22.
They are useful, but not really point effective compared to other units. I'd definitely run them on the cheap though, I had some ideas about running a few with dual Shuricannons but it really bothered me only moving them 6" to be able to fire both weapons. Fritz uses them differently from me though, and seems to do well with his Vypers.
Interestingly I was going to correct you on the cover saves, but I might be at error there. Last edition you needed more than 50% of a unit in cover to be in cover, but I find no such wording in the 5th edition rulebook. I might even have been playing it wrong all time along, since I've been using the previous editions wording to determine if a unit gets cover. Now it seems the unit can be partially in cover, so wounds allocated on one model will get a cover save, and wounds allocated to others will not depending on which models are in cover or not. Can anyone confirm this? I'm still a bit groggy and tired, so I might be missing something obvious.
id run them in small point games that i had the points left over, fairly effective but are just flying cardboard.
There are three kinds of people in this world, those who can count and those who cannot.
I can't find the reference for it right now, but thats just the way it works.
page 22 BRB "Units Partially in Cover"
Yeah, page 22, units partially in cover, second paragraph (of the little black reach book).
Doh! Thanks, I guess that's what happens when you try to decipher rules while drunk. Although I am pleased to see the subtle difference from the last edition, last edition you wouldn't get cover saves if one Vyper was in cover and one wasn't, in 5th it's the opposite, good to know.