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I just played my second battle against Space Wolves with my precious Speed freaks (1325p). I didn't stand a chance. Even if managed to charge two full trukk mobs into one of his 9 Grey hunter and a Wolf guard he won the fight. Even if my boyz managed to run away they where below half unit size and ran home crying. He tabled me in turn five.
The thing that kills me are that they get Counter attack and strikes first. And then he saves most of the wounds with his 3+ save. And he outshoots me with his Long fangs.
Now I turn to the wisdom and experience of the ork tribes to help me find a way to beat them or at least give me a chance. Is my only option to go all horde?
Here's my current list:
Warboss, claw, 'eavy armor,cybork
6 Nobs PC,BS,KS,Painboy, 'eavy armor,cybork (wound allocated) BW w DR
3 Trukks with slugga boyz
He ran something like:
Rune priest, Muredrous hurricane, Living lightning
3x9 Grey hunters + Wolf guard, 1-2 melta in Rhinos
9 Grey hunters + Wolf guard, 2 melta in Drop pod
7 Long fangs ML
Predator with Hvy bolter sponsons
Do your Trukk Boyz not have PK Nobz? Because that is your problem right there. Boyz are kind of a Nob delivery system, they do most of the CC heavy lifting.
Also if I understand your shorthand, you put Nobz in a Battlewagon? If so make sure it has Riggers and Armor Plates so it can keep on rolling. Not much in his army will be hurting it except the Meltas so try and get them on foot with your shooting, than get them in CC and run over everything else with the Wagon.
I got Claws on all my nobs and bosspoles in the boyz units. But They only got one swing. I lost too many boyz, failed moral and ran.
The meltas has no problm taking out the BW. As he advance he drives up 12" jump out and fires two meltas within 6". That is 21" reach. I'm happy I got one tankshock/ram before he blew it up with four meltas.
I'll be sure to add riggers and Armor Plates for added protection. Thanks!
That's why you focus down the Rhinos, so he can't Melta where and when he wants. If you let an army have all it's mobility, yeah you will lose every time. Anything with TL-Rokkits or Lootas will open or damage Rhinos easily, so make sure you have enough. You could castle up like this, making him come at you or lose his Rhinos while you hide your more vulnerable units.
If he comes at you, run the Rhinos over, hop out and assault the unit. Also, a Mek with a KFF is never a bad buy for any Ork list, see how good those meltas do when he has to hit, penetrate and go through a 4+ cover with 2 shots.
I used to play speed freaks and i know from experience that mob size is the biggest issue they face. The tactics for speed freaks are going to be pretty much the same every match (get into close combat as fast as you can) so i don't have very much strategy advice to lay on you. But I do think your list could do with some improvements.
First I would change your HQ. A warboss is mean but for speed freaks the Big Mek's Kustom Force Field will make your army twice as durable.
Second I would drop the loobas and put your nobz in a basic truck. Your putting your smallest unit in the one vehicle you have that can carry 20 boyz. If your scared that the nobz won't make it to close combat, then be a sneaky git and hide their truck behind the battlewagon. (Really the best thing to do is drop this mob altogether. The nob mob is too expensive for an under 1500 point list. I'd prefer to grab another mob of truck boyz and use the extra points elsewhere. But i'm assuming you don't want to spend too much money modifying your army.)
Third thing I would do is drop your shoota mob for a 19 man slugga mob (with a nob) and put them in the battlewagon with the big mek. This gives you a scary CC unit and allows the big mek's KFF to extend very far (you measure the distance of the KFF from the edges of the battle wagon, which happens to be the largest model in the codex).
Last thing to consider is dropping your lootas for some more rocket buggies and/or truck boy mobs. The more targets your opponent has rushing in his face the less he is going to be able to kill before you reach the safety of close combat. Rocket buggies are effective at taking out rhinos and preds in addition to being highly mobile and another good distraction for his meltaguns.
However you decide to change your list remember that ork list building only has one rule. Quantity is always better then Quality. Be as cheap as you can so you can field as much as you can.
What is dis signature nonsence?! dem stupid human zoggers are always trien to confuze us.
I agree with some of this, mainly dropping the Nobz. I wouldn't Trukk them with a single Battlewagon as anything moving can sneak the Trukk into LoS, or jsut deploy properly. And of course, Big Mek for life.
I would not drop the Lootas though as they're very strong in low points where armor is lighter and than you can mix in Rokkits and such at higher points to keep armor under control. Rokkit Buggies almost require a KFF as well because they're very fragile.
Also I would stay with Shoota Boyz because you do not always want to charge. You can stay inside a Wagon, drop a lot of shots onto an infantry target and have no reprisal. Also, 2 shots pretty much equal 1 attack the Sluggas give but let you play more defensively when you have too, Orks are not always about getting stuck in, but more about charging when it will do the most damage for acceptable loss. Being the same cost Slugga Boyz are a poor choice in most cases, some will disagree but that has been my experience.
Also note that he has to pass a Ld test to gain the benefit of Counter Assault. This should be a given, but it never ceases to surprise me how many people overlook this rule, so I thought it was worth mentioning.
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Da Moo Kowz is da drinkinest Orks of dem all!
I have to agree with one comment in particular Boss, people make assumptions with Leadership checks. Unless a unit is Fearless, they can and will fail Morale sometimes. Mechanized armies can use this to great advantage, especially with a bulk of vehicles.
If there's a solid chance your vehicle will survive, Tank Shocking is an under-used tactic, even against Ld10. Deff Rollas make it more attractive for Orks but I've Tank Shocked 12 Warriors off the table with a Chimera by not assuming they would just pass.
Thank's for all the tips.
I'll try to swap the Lootaz for rokket buggies.
Using Shootas instead of Sluggas is another thin I'll try out. If I can shoot a full volley before I charge I can take out 2 marines before CC. 4 If I charge with two units. That will be enough to win the CC.
I love my Nobz and they are my only unit that can stand up to the wolves. In my last game my 6 nobz and WB killed a whole 10 man unit without taking a single wound. The Wolves have to shoot them down with everything they got. Longfangs, melta, psychic attacks and all their bolters. That unit takes out at least two units of wolves. I'm not sure I dare to loose them. They would probably do better in a trukk.
Mek with KFF is also a great advice. I'm playing in a campaign right now with some limitations (Max 1 HQ, 2 EL, 1 FA, 6 TR and 1 HS). That's why I took the Bw with the nobs.
I guess SW is the paper to my rock, but I 'haven't given up yet.
SW really don't have anything over Orks that can't be got around. Sniping Nobz can be a pain but you simply out-number them usually. If you charge two units into one and weaken it with guns first, he won't be winning very often. It's just important to pick your targets wisely and keep your army together.
Orks really have very few "auto-losses" between equally skilled players and equal lists.