Opinion on harlequins - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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    Opinion on harlequins

    So I now have a 2000 point Eldar army. But I've been thinking about adding harlequins to my force in exchange for something else in my army or to make my army bigger. I was looking at there stats though and I am bit cautious of there 5+ invulnerable save. So do any of you use them and if so do they die quickly and how do you use them. So will my harlequins be running along killing everything or will they be shot down by rapid fire boltguns 3 to hit 3 to wound.


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    Member camarodragon's Avatar
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    Unsupported they are a bit frail. Adding a shadowseer with are farseer with fortune and doom they are a force to be reconed with. Ive been running an all mech list with 1 unit of harlies with farseer that footslogs into combat that has been nigh unstopable thus far. (of course they are stoppable, just don't tell my opponents) Getting them into combat is the trick, as they have a tendancy to kill what they dance with, but making it too the dance is the problem.
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    the thing with harlies is always utilize a shadowseer...that model alone will make all the difference as it reduces your opponent's options on targeting them with any kind of shooting as they have to roll 2d6x2 for range. also your gonna wanna load them up with kisses and 2 fusion pistols, and yes i know the fusion pistols are only 6 inch range but you cant argue with a str 8 ap1 melta weapon shot before you charge something. but just make sure you have something to back them up with and always try to utilize hit and run on your opponent's turn so you can get off the furious charge.

    and dont let the 5++ save bother you, as i already said the shadowseer compensates for that. and even better is a farseer with fortune for more survivability as camarodragon stated

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    as above. veil of tears gets you close but if theres enough cover you can make it there unscathed, move through cover helps with this

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    Son of LO ericismyname's Avatar
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    4th edition =good
    5th edition= terrible
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    As most people have said the shadowseer is a big boost to the squads ability to survive while moving to combat. But I also have to agree with eric. With how combat works in 5th ( defenders react, wounds distributed to the whole squad, can't consolidate into a new assault ) and the needed nerfing of rending, harlies are ok but generally not worth the cost. More often than not a squad of banshees or scorpions can preform as well or better than harlies against enemy units. The only target they are best at is T7 or higher models because rending allows them to still hurt them. The other downside is that harlies can not take a waveserpent so most times they are limited to 6 models to fit into a falcon or footslogging. The first option makes them a bit small to get the job done in melee and the second generally doesn't mesh well with the mech lists alot of people run.

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    Sorry but if you think Harlequins need a transport then your obviously playing them wrong.
    In fact from the latest few comments it would just seem that the people who don't like them just don't know how to use them.

    There is always a gamble with using them simply because if you get unlucky you can be wiped out by massed small arms fire, that being said the entire idea is to use their many abilities to make sure this doesn't happen. (plus this can be said of almost any eldar unit)
    With a Farseer that allows them to (hopefully) reroll their invulnerable saves they aren't as bad or as fragile as you would expect. They also should be attacking at str 4 I7, YES THAT IS A 7. When they charge.
    Totally wiping out the target may not be in your favour, but they will be attacking first against pretty much anything barring special abilities, and shouldn't be put up against targets that they won't whittle down to low enough numbers to withstand counter attacks.

    Wait till you have someone roll two 1's for their spotting distance you'll really understand the fear this squad can create.

    The trick is really using this unit to its full potential, with a shadowseer and farseer. Note that the farseer does reduce your ability to move through cover however.
    Its going to be expensive, but used correctly it can be a game changer. Used badly you may as well have just bought about 50 guardians.

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    If my post made it sound like harlies need a transport to be used at all I am sorry that was not my intent. I did intend to point out that they don't fit well into the full mech style of armies alot of people run. If they are on foot they simply are not fluid enough for a mech army (this is my opinion yours may differ ). I have harleqiuns and use them in footslogging lists. I find them to be one of, if not the best, foot slogging melee unit we have ( outflanking scorpions are alot of fun also ) because the shadow seer gives them the chance of closing without taking alot of damage. I have had a large squad of noise marines fail to see and shoot harlies because of a double 1 sight test which is amazing, but I have also had them spotted at 20+ inches and blown off the table having never done a thing. Add in deepstrike and the very common 12" get out and rapid fire tactics alot of armies can use and it becomes alot more likely that the harlies will get shot up before they have a chance to assault anything. I find moving them through terrain to be one of the safer ways to get them into combat as deep striking by terrain has an element of risk and chance to help out but this is not as good of an option once an IC is added to the squad because they are now slowed by the terrain.

    If you look at the numbers between harlies and banshees/scorpions they really are very close. Scorpions throw as many attacks at str 4 (and they are always str 4) as they do and survive normal attacks back much better so they will do as well or better against massed hordes. Banshees match or beat them for kills against good save units ( meq, teq ) it is only against extreme toughness that the harlies are better simply because of the rending, if it is T6 banshees wound and ignore the save on a six just like a harlie does. Harlies are more adaptible than the two aspects ( better at hordes than banshees and better at elite units than scorpions ) but they cost alot more for this and are extremely fragile. For roughly the cost of the unit you want to use you can take a banshee squad in a transport with a farseer, which I find more atractive to a mech list. If you are building a footslogging list they become a better option but for the cost of that squad you come close to the cost of two scorpion units.

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    Son of LO ikbuh's Avatar
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    I just had a discussion about Harlies with a friend of mine and while we discussed many of the things talked about already, but the one thing we agreed on was that they should have a unique transport. Essentially, it would be a Raider with no weapons like a skiff used to travelling around the webway. 10/10/10 open topped fast skimmer with the ability to drop out ontop of other units and assault. While it's initially rather flimsy, it would have the protection of the shadowseer, essentially making it seem like it comes out of nowhere, which is always what I imagined them doing.
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    Give them infiltrate! Also, let us split the squad up at the start of the game. Then, once per game, if a harlequin unit is being shot at, have them pass a leadership test. If they succeed, they automatically teleport to the other squad they split from at the start of the game. They were "there" all along.

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