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  1. #1
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    Help with marines.

    Hi,

    I have played a few games with some friends, we play doubles games of varying points depending on how much time we have. The problem I keep having is with my mates marine army. He will always drop an ironclad dred with twin flamer and a vanguard veteran squad on the first turn and then use his biker squad of death which consists of his captain, a command squad with apoth and a chaplain, lots of storm shields and power weapons and a relic blade on the captain.

    What advice do people have on dealing with this?

    Thanks,
    -Clidefride.


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  3. #2
    I am a free man! number6's Avatar
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    Team games are tough to give advice for. Do you have special rules for list build restrictions like Adepticon's, for example? Who are you teaming up with?

    The only advice generally applicable outside of knowing the specifics of your situation is to have plenty of screening units on hand to slow down fast/deadly enemies like biker command squads. The best screens Tyranids have are Tervigon-boosted termagants. Give the tervigon toxin sacs and they can at least put wounds on anything that comes your way, and they can shield your most valuable assets from being knocked around unfairly until you are prepared to gang up properly.

    And believe me, Tyranids are all about the unfair assaults. Don't just put one or two units into something you want to destroy. Put your whole army into it. Don't give anything a chance to survive. Also, do multi-charge when you get the chance. You can pour wounds into a limited number of units to help guarantee you win combat. The point is just to swarm and overwhelm all the time. Provided you have screens on hand, don't worry overmuch about exposing yourself after you annihilate enemies. If you've done this properly -- and you've pulled off a multi-charge -- entire swathes of an enemy army will disappear all at once.
    ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
    RIP Warhammer 40,000: 21 Sep 1998 - 24 May 2014

  4. #3
    Senior Member Fenix's Avatar
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    I had the same problems with my friends who liked dropping his ironclad or venerable on me,

    The way I solved this issue was to split up the bulk of my army into 2 piece "squadrons" and moved them seperately, each had a balance of my total army, but I kept them in enough proximity to themselves to be able to come to the other sides aid, and to force him to pick one or the other, and then lose it or get it stuck next turn due to it being swamped by the other half.

    the best thing to stop your friends super killer bikers? lots and lots of cheap gaunts and gants

    The tervigon will make you a wall of super fodder, and then spawn more for you, or for an equal amount of points you could stock up on hormagaunts which more or less have the same effect at lower point games. Toxin sacs are a must and with numbers flooding marines with wounds is just plain awesome (take that 3+ save)

    don't forget you can shoot back into his oncoming horde, hive guard, and a various forms of devourers can limit his charging sucess, and if hes coming to you why not try sticking some zoanthropes in your list and hide them behind something, those will deal with his dreads and marines alike if the gives them to you right away.

    Remember assaults count as hitting rear armor and dreds are still only 10, Rending is your friend

  5. #4
    ....coookies... GDMNW's Avatar
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    I enjoy being the bearer of bad news. Well, not really, but I was about to spout off some "I hate to say this" when I realised that I don't hate it at all.

    When you assault a vehicle with a WS then you strike against it's front armour unless it is immobilised. AV13 is not your friend or your mother's brother Robert.

    The general principle bears out though. Screen your valuable troops with a sparse layer of cheap ones. Done properly you will be counter charging rather than being charged and you will be able to bring your gribblies to bear against the coming nastiness. Most Tyranid MC's can have a decent whack at an Ironclad especially things like a Trygon which won't be striking last... On the other hand screen yourself and then surround the bad boy in your movement phase and leg it with the rest of your army. Ironclads sure ain't fast!



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    Junior Member potatolegs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clidefride View Post
    He will always drop an ironclad dred with twin flamer and a vanguard veteran squad on the first turn
    how is he using the vanguard? this seems dodgy, because a vanguard squad shouldn't be a threat to you at all, especially deep striking. they can only come down first turn if they're riding in a drop pod (so long as your opponent is using three drop pods), and in that case they can only deploy out of the pod and shoot or run. so you should be able to get the charge on to them and cut them up

    his biker squad of death which consists of his captain, a command squad with apoth and a chaplain, lots of storm shields and power weapons and a relic blade on the captain.
    this one is tricky. in fact command squads are just a damn good unit. i'm surprised more people don't run them. pimping them out with bikes and storm shields is costly, but as most people have suggest, throwing cheap hormagaunts at them with toxin sacs, is a great place to start. try whittling them away with fire power first. if you have hiveguard, i'd use them - there aren't many vehicles running around from the sounds of it, and those str 8 shots ignore the FNP on the unit. the storm shields makes no difference either due to the impaler cannon's weak AP. cut them down by one or two and that command squad really feels it. then swamp them with little fellas.

    be nice to hear what you run with though? what sort of points level are you guys rocking, and what does your partner have?

    edit: dealing with the ironclad should be easy with any MC, as mentioned above. he'll want to deploy close because of its weapons, and a carnifex or hive tyrant will happily chow down on it for lunch.

  7. #6
    WarmaHorde Pathofskulls's Avatar
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    When you assault a vehicle with a WS then you strike against it's front armour unless it is immobilised. AV13 is not your friend or your mother's brother Robert.
    It actually says on the GW site that when you assault a vehicle your hitting the rear armor regardless of where you actually hit it base to base.

    Why is close combat so deadly? Well, firstly all attacks are directed against the vehicle's rear armour in an assault, regardless of the angle of attack. This represents the warriors opening engine covers, jamming krak grenades into ventilation ports and so on. Rear armour is the weakest point on a tank, and in most cases drops the protection offered to measly armour value 10 - a charging Ork Boy, a Space Marine or a Tyranid Warrior can all glance that armour on the score of a 6
    Thats from the site and here's the link to that particular page: GW Tank Hunting Article
    Legion Of Everblight: Abyslonia
    Protectorate of Menoth: Grand Exemplar Kreoss

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pathofskulls View Post
    It actually says on the GW site that when you assault a vehicle your hitting the rear armor regardless of where you actually hit it base to base.
    Rulebook page 73 Walkers and Assaults

    "Models hitting a walker in close combat always roll for penetration against its front armour"

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    WarmaHorde Pathofskulls's Avatar
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    The above link is for tank hunting. But idk. Someone print it out and take it to their local GW and ask, the GW near me went out of business.

    You know what it is though, walkers are essentially mounted on turrents were tanks aren't so the walker just rotates to face whomever while the tank is immobile.

    But anyways, if your opponents field any tanks, you can pop them more easily, dreadnoughts should be avoided if possible, shooting them down always worked best for me back in the day.
    Last edited by Pathofskulls; July 19th, 2010 at 09:21.
    Legion Of Everblight: Abyslonia
    Protectorate of Menoth: Grand Exemplar Kreoss

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