Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
I just got the New Codax, so i can start my first collection on the DE. I have never read the last edition of it, so going with what i have in my hand with limited idea of thing.
After looking at the codax, my mind started to wonder about the Raider. The gear i'm thinking for the Raider are: Shock, Sail and F-field.
The idea is when the Lance is destroy but the Vehicle somehow survive and not immobilize.
Can it be use to take out a SM LR?
Can the Raider be save with the F-field after Ramming that LR?
Last edited by Wolf-Hunter; November 10th, 2010 at 06:44.
To destroy a Land Raider in a single ramming attack you would need your Raider to be equipped with at least the Shock Prow, but doing so requires a lot of high rolls. The strongest Ram move you can make without the Aethersails is S10 which requires you to be going flat out and get a 3+ on your Shock Prow die.
On the other hand, if you're lucky on the Advanced Aethersail roll you can get your full S10 hit before even rolling the Shock Prow die.
Both scenarios require that you have a huge distance between your Raider and the Land Raider. To consistantly get the S10 hit you'd need to move at least 27".
From the BRB FAQ, a ramming vehicle's strength cannot go above 10, as armor values are the only characteristic ever allowed to exceed 10 for any reason. There are a couple of ways to get a raider up to an S10 hit, involving a shock prow (rolling 2 or 3 with a 24" move) or a shock prow with advanced aethersails. With both of them, if you're the right distance (27") away, you'll get an S10 hit unless you roll a 1 on all three dice (24" flat-out gives a strength 8 hit, plus at least 1 for the shock prow, plus anything except snake eyes on the aethersail 2D6 gives you S10 ). In any event, it would require careful positioning and upgrades. Note that a shock prow is *required* to ram in the first place, as normally only tanks can ram.
Now, if you hit an SM LR with that (AV 14), you've got a 1 in 6 chance of getting a glancing hit, a 1 in 3 chance of getting a penetrating hit, and a 1 in 2 chance of doing nothing. Meanwhile, there is a 100% chance of suffering a penetrating hit on your raider. Yes, the Flickerfield would give you a save against that hit.
There is something highly satisfying about wrecking a high cost vehicle with a much cheaper vehicle. I do this all the time with my Eldar Wave Serpents/ Fire Prisms when they lose their guns. I have a feeling it'll be even more amusing when a cheap Raider does the same. Even if you don't survive, it's worth it if your vehicle is almost wrecked and his is still in one piece.
Yea, tank shocking/ramming raiders can be fun at first, but I can't see it being a viable tactic. First of all, your Raider needs to be a great distance away from things. Also, if there are units inbetween your Raider and your target, I'm pretty sure you can't just fly over them (not sure about this one though so correct me if I'm wrong). Tank shocking can be risky with the Raider too since death or glory can usually kill the raider. Try to avoid models with melta weapons or grenades. So with that being said, your raiders usually get your army into battle, so in order to ram, you need to fly away, and then make the ramming attack. So assuming you fly in and disembark turn 1, then turn 2 means you have to position your Raider and turn 3 is the ramming attack. Also, waiting until the Dark Lance is destroyed is a bit risky since a penetrating hit (most things penetrate our armour) will immobilize the raider on a 3+ (2+ if it's AP1!). I think Chain snares are a much better investment in my opinion. Set up a gunline and pop open transports. Once you do that, drop your passengers and start thinning out units. It will work fine on most troops.
However, if you do make a ramming attack, since the damage against your Raider counts as an attack back, your Flickerfield can save you.
I know that a Raider is easy to immobilise but that Flickerfield can make all the difference. Plus I'm not sure if it's just the people at our GW store but a lot of them seem to enjoy a good tank shock/ ramming and I have gained a reputation for such insane tank antics. We're there to have a laugh and are seldom competitive so it's fun to have vehicles flailing about at breakneck speeds.
It certainly makes sense that even when tank shocking you can move over and hit the back unit. Why not move full speed over a building but not a little scout squad? However, you must be able to place the skimmer in front of the unit/vehicle you are tank shocking. So if there was an intervening unit so close to your target that you could not physically place the model there, then you can't do it.
I know a lot of people don't like the INAT FAQ, but it also give a [clarification] that states skimmers may move over intervening models when tank shocking.
At the beginning of turn 1, I spray my opponent's army with the bacon flavored spray. Then I unleash my Boston Terrier Squiggoth who then devours their entire bacon flavored army! There is no defense against her cuteness! All are doomed!
It may be of only passing interest but GW themselves in the past stated that Skimmers Tank Shocking was akin to dropping down low to the ground and shocking Troops out of cover.
And the Tank Shock rules mention 'contact along the way,' so unless FAQed I would not allow selective Tank Shocking.
Sure normal moves allow Skimmers to move over friendly and enemy models but the TS rules themselves state that it is 'instead of a normal move.'
In other words do not rely upon the normal rules for movement when Tank Shocking, use what is on page 68 instead.
In a controversy the instant we feel anger we have already ceased striving for the truth, and have begun striving for ourselves.