Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
Just looking at the stat line and everything he can have he can get more shots out but still be really good in CQC unlike the old fex's base 2 attacks is worse than the new ones base 4 so a shooty fex can hit with 4 attacks and still shoot well.
The only thing we really lost out on was that the hive tyrant costs a lot and the tyrant gaurd cost a lot more.
Erm.... no, not really. Lets get one thing straight the 4th ed fex WAS overpowerd. But the 5th ed fex got nerfed a bit too hard, especially with trygons competing with them.
In terms of a combat build, the fex got a lot better against vehicles, but a lot worse generally. For the price of a new fex, you could get an extra wound, point of toughness and a 2+ save, with the same number of attacks. You also didnt have to worry about feeding when not in synapse. Also you could get I2 very easily, rather than just on the charge. Doesnt look like a great deal to me. You also had the option of a 113 point fex as an elite choice, where as its 170 MINIMUM if you want one now.
As for shooting, do the maths. With the old fex, you hit 6 times and would amost certainly wound 6 times thanks to re-rolls to wound. With the new fex, you rack up 9 hits, and 7-8 wounds. So really you gain very little in terms of shooting. In combat, you got an extra two attacks, but lost all the other options. That and a basic 4th dakkafex compared to a basic 5th dakkafex has a 77 points difference. Pretty heavy in my opinion. That and the loss of elite choice fexs and the gaining of rage... not a great tradeoff.
Dont get me wrong, its the right decision and the fex has its place, but did it get better? No. Not by a long shot.
Your friendly neighbourhood gargantuan creature
The new Carnifex does have more attacks. However it now has instinctive behaviour and lower LD. This means you may give it loads of guns and intend to use it's attacks in assault as well only for the thing to refuse to sit still and shoot as it runs off under the effect of 'feed'. Also lower LD means it is more vunerable to the effects of rare but powerful attacks like Eldar mind war which target LD.
The new Carnifex is much more points too, seventy five points more to be exact, though it does now include the scything talons for free. The older Carnifex was probably a bit underpriced but I would say this one at times, not always seems it may be overpriced. The older one had the advantage of upgrading itself to the max which the new one cannot do.
What I think I don't like is that the Carnifex is meant to be super-tough, tougher than a Hive Tyrant when it comes to hitting the thing. Now it's gone back to it's older version where it's as easy to kill as a Hive Tyrant it's just stronger with awful WS, I etc. I think it should be like a big lobster when you try to eat one. The shell is incredibly tough on those things. This would make it stand out from the Hive Tyrant more and still prevent it from having as many wounds a Trygon or Mawloc which has a bigger model.
I see what you mean their. I started 4th ed nids a little late like a few months before the new one came out. Some things just looked better. Though with a lot of our new elites i dont think an elite fex would be as awesome of a choice. Though i do miss zoanthropes being able to dived from one selection and havign the 2 up armor save. That and synapse making us all eternal warriors.
Drop the base price by 20 points and I'd be happy. As said above, not as tough, way more expensive and lacks the flexibility the old fex has. Just look at most lists and see how many fexes are there. From a marketing point-of-view, gw was brilliant. Take the one unit that most nid players had a surplus of and make it the least attractive option.
It's been almost a year, and we're still going to compare with the previous codex? Guys, you can't compare old to new. Codexes exist as singular entities. They are designed to be internally consistent, internally balanced.
Is anybody here complaining about carnifex "nerfing" also going to claim that the old codex is actually stronger or better than the new codex?
I didn't think so.
How "good" the carnifex is (or isn't) can only be measured by what it competes with in the current codex. And in the current codex, the carnifex has a role to play. And while everybody is focused on how "expensive" the 'fex is, that's only because y'all were spoiled by 113 pt carnifexes of old. Well, we all know that was ridiculous and going to end. Stop thinking like a 4e player and get with the program! The current 'fex is a bargain at 160 pts, still the cheapest monstrous creature we have! And it's ultra-configurable on bargain points costs, too.
So why all the complaining? Burn your 4e codexes if you have to. Stop comparing. It's meaningless.
ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
RIP Warhammer 40,000: 21 Sep 1998 - 24 May 2014
One thing I think which annoys me is the whole SX weapons. That was a great tyranid feature for me. Now everything is set in stone. And a whole host of little upgrades are gone. Damn.
But you can have lotsa carnifexes in a brood and can now port them in with spores.
“When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a Communist.”