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In thinking of what I've just said on the vypers discussion page.. we really need to talk about the heavy weapons choices for Eldar. Do we need to add any? Can we replace one? Do we make them rending or give them a lower AP? Add more blast templates? More flamers?Okay so the general structure of these threads is to address our BAD units first, then move on to the better ones. Please always read every post to avoid repetition. Please also try to discuss only the unit in question specificly. Referencing other units is OK, but should be limited to times when the other unit directly overlaps the target unit of this thread. Please do not adjust the units points cost. Let's bring our boys UP TO the points we're being charged, rather than lower them for the benefit of more units elsewhere. We're an elite army, right? Let's be expensive and ridiculously deadly, then.
These threads will work in two stages. First we brainstorm about the flaws as we perceive them, and provide a wide list of changes as we feel is appropriate. Phase two is taking the most supported ideas, compiling them together and finally arguing over any critical additions to the changelist.
Unfortunately lazy me cannot just grab a synopsis of the units from MWG.com but since we have so few heavy weapons anyway I hardly think it matters.
So, me first.
We definitely need a largeblast heavy weapon. It can be low strength for all I care (though if it is <5 I demand rending). Let's say... hmm..
Sunburst; S4, AP4, 48", Heavy 1, Largeblast, Rending, Blinding*.
"The sunburst is a new weapon seen employed by eldar forces. It fires a nimbus of energy at the target, which explodes in an intense flash of heat and light. Eyes are burnt out, optics damaged and tyres singe and burn under the projectiles energy release."
*Targets of the sunburst roll for a 3+ coversave. If they fail, they are considered blinded and move as if under the USR slow and purposeful and they fire with a -2 BS modifier for their next turn.
Eldritch zephyr; S7, AP5, template*, Heavy 2, pinning.
"In recent years, the increased militarisation of the Craftworlds has borne new weapons to their arsenal. In addition to new aspect warriors emerging or re-emerging after prolonged absence, bizarre and frightening equipment has surfaced on the ancients' vehicles and wraithconstructs. Of these, the bizarre psychic 'flamer' has also been recorded. Soldiers who have come under this weapons furious grip sometimes emerge alive, though very rarely. Video records show soldiers burnt to cinders or falling down, spasming and frothing from the nose and mouth, lightning dancing over them as they thrash and wretch. Others still are seen stiffening in place, typically from the arcing energy off an already dead comrade."
*The eldritch zephyr fires out from the firing model with a range of up to 6", place the template so that the narrow end is within 6” of the weapon and the large end is no closer to the weapon than the narrow end.
So that's two new weapons. I'll let others talk about the infinitely more graspable weapons we already possess.
I'm fine with all the blast we get, TBH. I'd much rather have this thread be about Wraithguard/Wraithlords.
Between the S6 AP4 Fire Prism, S6 Barrage/Pinning/Rending/Terrain effect Night Spinner, and even Swooping Hawk grenade packs, I think Eldar are covered.
Not to mention all the small blasts we can put out (six S4 AP4 blasts form a Guided War Walker squad is just evil).
Right, let's go through each in turn.
Brightlance: This ought to be good, however the 36" range lets it down a little, and the fact that it only gets one shot a turn means it is not very likely to do anything worthwhile even against Land Raiders or Leman Russes. I think they should either be range 48" or Heavy 2, and then make pulse lasers better accordingly.
Scatter Laser: I really have no complaints about this. What's not to love? Results in lots of satisfying dice-rolling.
Eldar Missile Launcher: Again, there's not much to be said. They have an excellent range, are versatile enough to be used on all the Wave Serpents in an army, and in all the situations they're usually used, they are twin-linked. The only thing is the one shot only again, so the only thing I can think of to improve them is to make them Heavy 2.
Starcannon: Let's face it, starcannons are a joke. I can see why people might think they're good against Terminators or other MEQs, but they need to be more like the Imperium plasma weapons. A plasma cannon that doesn't get hot? That would work. S7, AP2, small blast. Maybe even Heavy 2. One way or another, they need a major overhaul in order to be useful.
Shuriken cannon: They're cheap for a reason. They're there so you can use them if you have very few points to spare, and for no other reason. If you want better, use a Scatter Laser.
In other related news, the Eldar race as a whole needs some ballistics training. If all our tanks had BS4, these heavy weapons would be even more useful.
At the risk of combining better weapons with better BS..
The IG codex has demonstrated that a large variety of heavy weapons is achievable (though not always fair or economic).
i dont think we need more heavy weapons . i think we have an over populated heavy support catergory. if war walkers were fast attack and falcons were dedicated transport we could have alot more vaible lists
So you're suggesting that War Walkers be made fast attack? Slightly mobile weapons platforms that can't actually move faster than an Eldar? That wouldn't work very well. Maybe if Falcons were Fast Attack and Dark Reapers Elites, that might work a bit better. But you can't just start categorising things which are clearly not what you're suggesting. Why not make Space Marine Bikes HQ while we're at it? Or Tau Ethereals Heavy Support? Yeah, that's about how ridiculous suggesting Warwalkers for Fast Attack is.
Now now lets keep it above the belt here. Warwalkers will get discussed when their time comes.They're up next definitely, but I'm prepared to argue the point that eldar heavy weapons need help more. To quote from one of my links..I'd much rather have this thread be about Wraithguard/Wraithlords.Currently my biggest pet peeve has to be the cost/rules for most eldar heavy weps and the fact that its on a bs3 delivery most of the time.
I have not used a brightlance in fifth , they were overpriced in fourth but since the damage chart changes they are now shorter ranged, less accurate and weaker on the majority of targets and nearly twice the price of lascannon, so much for eldar technological superiority. if given the choice of a plasma cannon (imperial) or starcannon I would take the imperial weapon every time , in-fact except from the scatter laser all of the eldar weps are either worse than the imperial equivalent or where they are roughly comparable hugely overpriced.
Also the eldar heavy weaps being overpriced could be attributed to the assumption that they will somehow always be guided at a doomed target .....never mind the fact that you have to buy a farseer for a not inconsiderable amount of points to potentially be able to do it.
My opinion, not much more heavy weapons are actually needed to boost our weapons list. The only one that I say should become available for all tanks/weapon platforms/Etc... is the pulse laser like the hornet gets.
Star Cannons and Bright Lances are over Priced for what they are. If a Bright lance was 48" S8 AP1 then Id think they were worth the points they are. Star Cannons...love them but too expensive and ineffective against tanks to take more than one or two even in a 3000pt list unless you knew youd be needing to take a lot of AP2 shots.
All the other weapons are reasonably priced. The EML is reasonable points wise, but not beyond maybe a 5 point drop in cost but because of it functunality its not a big deal if it doesnt get that drop.
Often disappointed with my Bright Lances' performance, but rarely with my EMLs.
Never used the Starcannons.
Like the Scatterlasers for War Walkers.
Facing Space Marines all the time with their 4-5x Missile Launchers in a Dev squad in cover makes me long for at least one Cover save-ignoring, non-drifting, heavy weapons choice.