Welcome to Librarium Online!
I'm trying to get back into the hobby after being out of it for a few years. I played Eldar for a long time and this time around I wanted to try something new. Tyranids have caught my eye but I'm not familiar with hoard armies at all, having played with very few specialist models for so long. I'm not a huge fan of monstrous creatures but I understand the necessity of their roll. What really draws me to the nids is the mid quality and hoard creatures like the gaunts up through warriors/raveners (excluding genestealers). I'm wondering if these creatures can make a viable list alone and if not what will they need to supplement them and what pit falls will the army have...
I'm very new to nids so I'm not quite sure what to ask yet, I'm just feeling around to get a grasp of the army before buying a bunch of stuff I'll never use.
Thanks a bunch
You absolutely MUST have a number of MCs in your list. If you want a "horde", you're going to want a pair of Tervigons. These guys generate your horde as well as boost them up.
I also think the shooting that tyrants, carnifexes, and most importantly -- the Tyrannofex -- provide are absolutely vital to making a 'nids list that is even halfway decent. 'Nid shooting is otherwise completely limited to the Elites slot, and 3 units -- even if they're all hive guard all the time -- is still not enough. "Dakkafexes" (or Dakka Tyrants) -- with two sets of double devourers -- are incredibly potent anti-infantry machines, and can possibly suppress enemy transports as well. Giving those guys a heavy venom cannon is also useful and extends their ability to suppress enemy tanks.
Meanwhile, the Tfex is the one and only tyranid creature capable of hurting the enemy at long range. Being able to threaten enemy vehicles no matter what they are or where they are is a vital component to any 40K army, and the Tfex is the only unit the Tyranids have to fulfill this role. It takes a very specialized, all reserves all deep-striking army, to mitigate the need to carry around at least one Tfex.
You can lead your army with a Prime instead of a Tyrant, but if you're serious about a horde that is capable of playing the game, your Troops will be based around Tervigons, not Warriors. And because of the need to take hive guard (or possibly a unit of zoanthropes instead of one unit of hive guard), and anti-infantry and anti-armour shooting, most of the rest of your points will have to be spent on Tfexes and carnifexes. Rarely will you have the points to spare on raveners.
See the "army list builder" topic on the army lists subforum for the widest possible sampling of reasonably valid army builds. Sadly, you'll note that very few can make a go built around warriors and/or raveners. At most, you get a unit or two of these guys as a bonus.
Last edited by number6; December 6th, 2011 at 16:39.
ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
RIP Warhammer 40,000: 21 Sep 1998 - 24 May 2014
Thanks number6, I appreciate the help and the quick run down. I think I can be happy running most of the MCs listed above... I'm really just not a fan of the fex spam I see so often. I know warriors are a less powerful choice especially when pushed into troops and fast attack, perhaps I
ll run a squad or 2 from time to time. I thought I had remembered them being elite choices as well but that may have been a codex or 2 back. I guess the next stage is to make an army list to revise before buying things for the army.
Elites were last edition. It's not they they are bad units or aren't good in combat (or shooting even with an attached Prime). Synapse lost Eternal Warrior and that sucks. S8+ weapons (Missiles, Lascannons, Lances, meltaguns etc) don't care how many wounds a warriors has. A wound from S8+ causes instant death and punches through their armor very easily........and with mech being such a huge thing in this edition you can expect A LOT of S8+ weapons that can just maul warriors.I'll run a squad or 2 from time to time. I thought I had remembered them being elite choices as well but that may have been a codex or 2 back. I guess the next stage is to make an army list to revise before buying things for the army.
This is also why walking zoanthropes are bad. Most of the above easily outrange zoans an all you have to do is fail one 3++ and they go *poof*. Ask an marine player out there....T4 3+ isn't anything special against small-arms fire even in moderate numbers.
I do feel the vulnerability from the high powered shots but that's half the fun sometimes. I don't really want an army that JUST walks up the field and squishes things, but I do see your point.
Now's probably the best time to decide whether you want to go hardcore and winning is your main focus, or whether you want to have fun and winning is an added bonus (no rhyme intended).
I rarely fill lists with Tervigon spam. Sure, it is safe to say that I always include at least 3 monstrous creatures, but I didn't think 3 was spam. Also I usually win my games (65% win rate).
Now my list is built around the fact that I try to use up all 3 elite slots and all 6 troop slots - these are perhaps... in fact I don't even need to say perhaps, they ARE the most important slots in the Tyranid codex.
- Elites usually take the form of a unit of Lictors (they are so fun to play and just look so coo l), a unit of Hive Guard, and a podding unit of Zoanthropes, 3 in each squad when possible. If you wanna be a douchebag to your opponent, replace Lictors with a podding Doom of Malan'tai (for its *insert booming voice* 'Aura of Death', as it has been referred to many times), but again be careful about ID.
- Troops are more based on the swarm concept you had originally. I field two squads of 20 Termagants (rarely buffed, only if I have nothing else to spend the points on), two squads of 20 Hormagaunts with Toxin Sacs (and Adrenal Glands if I can afford it), a unit of around 16 Genestealers with a Broodlord (bye bye flanking Ork Bikerz) and a unit of five Warriors with dual Boneswords, Rending Claws and if I can afford it, adrenal glands. This has worked for me in most cases, just keep an eye on your Warriors, make sure the enemy is distracted from them by some sort of MC.
My HQ usually takes form of a melee Tyrant with wings, or a dakka tyrant with two Tyrant Guard. Or both, but only in 3000+ games. As a general rule, I purchase the Hive Commander ability cos outflanking Hormagaunts is quite thrilling and it means -1 to my reserve rolls (excellent for making sure those Lics appear right on time). I only use the Swarmlord on an occasional basis, as he is a massive points drain and he is painfully slow moving - so slow moving that half the time he is dead before he gets into combat. LEECH ESSENCE IS ESSENTIAL TO KEEPING THE SWARMLORD ALIVE!
Fast attack usually features a unit of Raveners if I can afford it. Sometimes I have a Harpy, fulfills a similar role to the T-Fex except much less... tough... and less dakka...
Heavy Support features a unit of Biovores and 1-2 Trygons (one being a prime). Just generally an excellent creature - awesome close combat, toughness, and good anti- infantry shooting. What more could you want?
So if you aren't too keen on spam, try out a build like mine. It's fun, it's easy, and it's great if you like variation in your army. Not the list for you if winning is the Number 1 top priority end-of-the-world-if-it-doesn't-happen kind of thing for you.
Think about it, make the decision, and stick with it.
Last edited by Warlord Vrrmik; December 10th, 2011 at 21:01.
This seems like what I'm looking for, thanks Warlord Vrrmik. Winning sometimes is really just an added bonus to rolling a bunch of dice for me. I do still want an army that can put up a good fight and give my opponent a good scare when looking across at the wave of little critters and few big nasties.
Tyranid Hive LO.doc
I hope this helps. If you need any specific advice with this kind of list or even just 'nids in general feel free to message me and I'll be happy to help.
Last edited by Warlord Vrrmik; December 12th, 2011 at 05:35.