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  1. #1
    Senior Member SILKiam's Avatar
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    Help with battle suits

    Hi,

    After reading Rikimarus tactica on battlesuits I am still scratching my head about what to do for the crisis teams in my army. Originally I wrote the list to include 1 unit of 3 suits with twin linked flamers and missile pods, a second unit with twin linked missile pods and flamer and then a large unit of stealth suits for mass fire killing. The thinking behind my reason was that my opponent was most likely going to be getting to my lines in a transport so I needed missile pods to take them out, harrass them for as long as possible and then use flamers for when the innevitable assault unit comes my way and the stealth team was to keep firing and drown whatever comes my way with pulse fire. Apparantly I've been really ignorant, and after reading a few articles I need to rethink my list.

    Would I be better off with taking something like:

    2 Suits: 2x Missile pods, targetting array
    2 Suits: Plasma rifle, missile pod, multi tracker
    2 Suits: Plasma rifle, missile pod, multi tracker

    The deathrain team is the dedicated transport hunters, hunting after which ever rhino is hurtling towards me and the Fireknife teams are there for some for of general purpose to the army, either to tackle more transports seperately to each other, or to combine fire and take apart tactical squads. 2 suit units instead of 3 to keep them alive with LOS abuse instead of taking expensive shield drones.

    My Current 1500 point list (minus suits) stands at:

    6 Firewarriors in a tea caddy
    10 Kroot with 10 hounds
    10 Kroot with 10 hounds
    2 pirahna with fusion blasters and disruption pods
    2 hammerhead with railguns, multi trackers and disruption pods
    and a Commander that I am not too sure about.

    Thanks for any and all help


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  3. #2
    Senior Member Astantia's Avatar
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    That's the standard setup.
    The textbook answer, if you will.

    Death rain are anti transport, fire knife are anti meq and teq. Those hounds are expensive, but a solid choice if you want your Kroot to act as more than just a buffer. Note that they are the only static component in your list.

    Stealth suits are fun, but horribly inefficient. Hopefully gw balances everything in the next codex, but we have had 10 years to find the most efficient way of killing space marines. Fire knife suit is it.
    Gareth is the person I try to impress when I convert and paint.

  4. #3
    I am a free man! number6's Avatar
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    Your list isn't too bad. Glad you rethought your suit loadouts!

    I think you're overspending on your kroot hounds, though. As awesome as they are, once you get past around 15 models in a unit, it's too unwieldy to use effectively. You can even afford to chop all of them out, if you like, for a full 120 bonus points! But otherwise, cutting down to no more than about 5 per unit is adequate, freeing up plenty of points for other purposes.

    I would recommend getting even a single broadside battlesuit. For 80 pts (with adv. stabilization system), it's a good bargain.

    As for your commander: 87 pts gets you a shas'el with plasma rifle, missile pod, and multi-tracker. Cheap and very effective.
    ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
    RIP Warhammer 40,000: 21 Sep 1998 - 24 May 2014

  5. #4
    Senior Member Astantia's Avatar
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    48 (x2)

    You could also cut a unit of Kroot and add a third hammerhead. Taking a single xv88 in an otherwise mobile list, even with an advanced stabilization system, is probably not a great idea. A third hammer head further dilutes fire taken by the other two, allows you to use submunitions, and gives you a 12" maneuvering distance to find new targets, as oppose to the d6" granted by the broadside. Also, smart missile system plus submunitions wrecks light infantry.

    I completely agree with the commander load out though, 6.

  6. #5
    Senior Member SILKiam's Avatar
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    That's the standard setup.
    The textbook answer, if you will.
    I must be getting close to a decent list then after all this time. I am more than happy to go against the grain with my Orks, and going against the Razorspam norm is what my space marines rely on. Don't really want to do it with a book that is as old and fragile as the Tau empire one

    Death rain are anti transport, fire knife are anti meq and teq
    Precisely what I thought. And, funnily enough, the armies that I face most are the various space marine variants in some form of transport. Handy that.
    Those hounds are expensive, but a solid choice if you want your Kroot to act as more than just a buffer. Note that they are the only static component in your list.
    Yeah, but I really couldn't resist getting some I5 attacks in an otherwise non-assaulting army. They will be the first things to be dropped when I need to get some more points out of the list, but for now I am happy to leave them as they are. And unweildly? I am used to manouvering 6 lots of 30 Orks around the table. 2 units of 2 outflanking birdmen is easy in comparison

    And you are right about them being the only static element in my army, but I am hoping that outflank or infiltration will counter that. When I orginally wrote the list I wanted to make sure that every unit in said list would be able to move at least 12" per turn and still be able to kick out a serious amount of fire power.
    Stealth suits are fun, but horribly inefficient.
    Thats what I thought. Good to have it backed up by a veteran.
    we have had 10 years to find the most efficient way of killing space marines. Fire knife suit is it.
    Heh, I was Orignally writing the list to have 3 lots of 3 suits with twin linked plasma guns and target arrays. Turned out to be rather expensive
    Your list isn't too bad
    No need to sugar coat, tell me what you really mean

    You can even afford to chop all of them out, if you like,
    Oh but I don't like. This game does seem to hinge around the assault phase, whether we like it or not, so having a little input there would be nice, rather that simply taking hits.

    I would recommend getting even a single broadside battlesuit. For 80 pts (with adv. stabilization system), it's a good bargain.
    If I was going to chop out the hounds, I'd be more tempted to get hold of another pirahna (or maybe even some tetras!) to keep up with the mobility of the rest of the army.


    As for your commander: 87 pts gets you a shas'el with plasma rifle, missile pod, and multi-tracker. Cheap and very effective.
    I was tempted to go for a helios pattern commander to help counter any deep striking drop pods or to help tackle any terminators that slip through the net.

  7. #6
    I am a free man! number6's Avatar
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    I think you misunderstand the purpose of Kroot! These are not "assault" units. Yes, they are the units you want your opponent to assault. They are the units you leave available to be assaulted. But no matter how big your Kroot unit, no matter how many hounds you include, you don't really want them to get caught up in assault. Their real purpose is to screen and protect the rest of your army. They are the buffer between your incredibly precious and incredibly fragile battlesuits and certain death at the hands of virtually any enemy unit.

    Way better to let your Kroot get killed than your battlesuits!

    So never, never, NEVER outflank your Kroot! I mean it. Never. You can't afford to be that reckless with them. You can't afford for them to not be around protecting your ass.
    Last edited by number6; April 6th, 2012 at 20:02.
    ninjabackhand: point and click, again, really? even after i give you an military term "shock tactic" you still call it point and click.
    RIP Warhammer 40,000: 21 Sep 1998 - 24 May 2014

  8. #7
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    I always do plas missle multi. It gives you the most shots per round, and that's what you want.
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    Senior Member exbar's Avatar
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    I dont have much to add to what the others are saying except this: I might stay away from the 2 suit unit. Having smaller units is great since it minimizes the number of suits that can be killed in CC or by taking fire, but at the same time it means that if one dies then the other is SOL. Having three gives a bit more of a buffer, and if you're using terrain effectively and staying away from charges the best you can, they're probably more resilient in a unit of 3 vs a unit of 2. So, I would either condense those 6 suits into 2 units of 3 and have one FK and one DR, or keep the current load outs and give the odd-man-out (the lone FK in the DR unit) a HW TL to shoot independently. I've just always used units of 3, so maybe this is bad advice, but its worked for me since Tau were released.

  10. #9
    Senior Member Astantia's Avatar
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    I've always found that if I lose one suit, I'm probably losing two. Having only two wounds and toughness 4 makes them pretty susceptible to anything, if they're out in the open. Remember, most armies are marine equivalent, which means that the meta game brings lots of meqs. If your suits are left in the open, they're equivalent to the most common enemy in the game. Monats are the most survivable because you can hide them in cover easier. But two suit teams have no chance of rallying if one of them drops. Bonding knives can help, but I don't find them useful, as even five points is better spent elsewhere. I usually run squads of three, only to maximize firepower. Keep your suits out of sight and they'll do great.

    If the enemy sees them, they don't have any natural defenses to help protect them.
    Gareth is the person I try to impress when I convert and paint.

  11. #10
    Senior Member starfire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Astantia View Post
    I've always found that if I lose one suit, I'm probably losing two. Having only two wounds and toughness 4 makes them pretty susceptible to anything, if they're out in the open. Remember, most armies are marine equivalent, which means that the meta game brings lots of meqs. If your suits are left in the open, they're equivalent to the most common enemy in the game. Monats are the most survivable because you can hide them in cover easier. But two suit teams have no chance of rallying if one of them drops. Bonding knives can help, but I don't find them useful, as even five points is better spent elsewhere. I usually run squads of three, only to maximize firepower. Keep your suits out of sight and they'll do great.

    If the enemy sees them, they don't have any natural defenses to help protect them.
    2 suit units are actually better than 3 for a very good reason, they never drop below 50% unit size, meaning you do not need a bonding knife to rally them. many people forget this little trick.

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