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  1. #1
    Senior Member Blackadder's Avatar
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    Want advice on what to take in a 500pt TOURNEY Doubles Tau Army.

    As title

    Basically next year (I think - this is according to a friend of mine) there might be some kind of 40k doubles tourney where two different armies of 500pts come together to fight an opposing army of the same size. Me and my friend were thinking of giving it a go, and it'll be our first tourney for both of us, since we've never participated in one before, but have quite a bit of experience in friendly games and the very occassional GW gaming.

    Anyway, there's 2 options we were thinking of - 1) An Imperial army - I'd be fielding the good ol' fashioned Imperial Guard, and he'd be fielding Black Templars/Space Marines - which is outside this discussion really, and then there's option 2) - Namely, me using Tau, and him using another Xenos army, most likely Eldar (as that's the only one we could think of which would ally with Tau...).

    So... what i want is advice from my fellow LO Tau players on what to take in a 500pt Tourney going Tau army - They were my first 40k army ever (although not my first GW army... I played Fantasy for a few years before starting 40k) so I've got a few bits and bobs, although more recently i've moved much more strongly onto marines and guard so I've got less tau than them (although I still really like Tau...). The stuff I've got (that i know of off the top of my head) is the following:-

    . 2 Battlesuits set up as Fireknives (that's plasma rifle, missile pod and multi-tracker)

    . 10-12 FWs with Pulse Rifles (it's the carbine model they're using but I just say they're pulse rifles as I just prefer the look of carbines over rifles) - speaking of which would I have any problems with that at tourneys...would anyone really care?

    . Devilfish with SMS or gun drones... they're not glued in so I can swap 'em out if I want.

    . A Railhead Hammerhead I converted out of another devilfish... I don't have the Burst Cannon side things, although I did convert some from drones...but they look crap and are pretty fragile... but I do have loads of Gun Drones.

    . about 12 Kroot Carnivores.

    So yeah - What would you suggest taking for a tourney worthy Tau army? Feel free to suggest other purchases too, as I don't mind getting one or two extras, just so long as it's not too much/a completely new army... I'm not expecting to win this tourney by any stretch at all, as there'll be far more experienced players than us two there, but I'd at least like to get somewhere

    Lastly, there's no concrete Eldar army built yet (as my friend is in the middle of his A-Level exam period...) but what he said to me in the text message when I asked him about a Tau-Eldar alliance was that it'd be an "autarch based army"...

    Cheers

    EDIT: After reading the tactica articles on LO I've thrown together a quick and easy 500pt Tau list - it might give us a better starting point of discussion _

    HQ

    'El - Fire-Knife set up (see the main body of text for description on what it is), HW Multi-tracker, Targeting Array - 97

    Troops

    6 FWs - Nothing - 60

    10 Kroot - nothing - 70

    4 Pathfinders - Nothing - 48

    Pathfinder Devilfish - Disruption Pod - 85 (this thing will be transporting the FWs not the PFers... they will just sit back in cover and Marker-light up key enemies)

    Hammerhead - Railgun, Burst cannons & Disruption pod - 155

    XV8 Battlesuit - Fire-knife combo, Multi-Tracker - 62

    Total = 577

    Obviously we're quite a bit over the target points value so something is going to have to go, but honestly I don't know what... I'm leaning more toward the kroot and or the XV8, and using the spare points to buy more FWs, as I think even at 500pts with a transport, 6 guys will be just too fragile. The same goes with Kroot too - even if (and this is the plan) I infiltrate them into woods to give them the 6+ cover save straight off the bat, they wont be that great in CC without the hounds, and the Kroot Rifles aren't going to do that much anyway...

    Pathfinders I dont think are a problem if there's only 4... as I say I plan to keep 'em in cover at the back and just Marker-light stuff, so 4 guys isn't much of a problem as they'll be out of range of most guns (bar stuff like Snipers and heavy bolters and that), it might also work to their advantage, if they enemy doesn't view 4 guys as big a threat as 6 (even if they do have MLs...)

    I'm also aware that the hammerhead is an absoloutely massive points sink at this level... but it does have great versatility in that it can take on the very best tanks the enemy can throw at me at any point level and also comes with that Submunition round which will also chew up enemy light infantry and possibly heavies too - AND it can have Markerlight support to reduce the scatter by 5' - trouble is it'll be the target of every single heavy and anti-tank weapon that has a hope of damaging it from turn one... the key to keeping it alive will be to get it to keep flying and hug cover... I'm toying with the idea of a broadside instead though...

    So yeah, thoughts? Suggestions? Changes? What should be dropped and how do you think this kind of thing would fare in a doubles 500pt tourney with an eldar army by my side?

    EDIT 2: Oh yeah, the original questions about purchase suggestions and so on are also still on, so if you want to help me out on those issues then feel free to do so

    Last edited by Blackadder; May 25th, 2012 at 00:18.

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    Senior Member SavageConvoy's Avatar
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    Depends on when next year. Rumors put a new codex at January 2013 as a possibility, so any advice given would be rendered pointless.

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    Senior Member Blackadder's Avatar
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    Ah OK thanks

    Tourney aside then, can I still get some suggestions on improvements for this list? Not for tourney use but general friendly and GW gaming? Also are there any purchase suggestions on what I should buy next?

    Thanks

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    With the current codex, I'd be very tempted to run this for 500pts...

    'El - MP, PR, HWMT, TA

    6 FWs
    11 Kroot

    3 x XV8, TL-MP, TA
    2 x XV8, TL-MP, TA

    you're not going to see many high av vehicles at 500 as they eat points so railguns aren't that much of a necessity - and you can let the eldar player worry about them if you want (dragons in serpent)

    Be aware however that the eldar codex is massively overcosted and you really don't get much bang for your buck with, especially in 500 pts, so be tempted by a cheap-ass squad of rangers for troops, a farseer and then as many dual scatter laser war walkers as you can squeeze in for mass S6 fire

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    Hi, were there any FOC restrictions- like you HAVE to field 1 hq and 1 troop slot?

  7. #6
    The deep down truth Rikimaru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackadder View Post
    As title

    Basically next year (I think - this is according to a friend of mine) there might be some kind of 40k doubles tourney where two different armies of 500pts come together to fight an opposing army of the same size. Me and my friend were thinking of giving it a go, and it'll be our first tourney for both of us, since we've never participated in one before, but have quite a bit of experience in friendly games and the very occassional GW gaming.

    Anyway, there's 2 options we were thinking of - 1) An Imperial army - I'd be fielding the good ol' fashioned Imperial Guard, and he'd be fielding Black Templars/Space Marines - which is outside this discussion really, and then there's option 2) - Namely, me using Tau, and him using another Xenos army, most likely Eldar (as that's the only one we could think of which would ally with Tau...).

    So... what i want is advice from my fellow LO Tau players on what to take in a 500pt Tourney going Tau army - They were my first 40k army ever (although not my first GW army... I played Fantasy for a few years before starting 40k) so I've got a few bits and bobs, although more recently i've moved much more strongly onto marines and guard so I've got less tau than them (although I still really like Tau...). The stuff I've got (that i know of off the top of my head) is the following:-

    . 2 Battlesuits set up as Fireknives (that's plasma rifle, missile pod and multi-tracker)

    . 10-12 FWs with Pulse Rifles (it's the carbine model they're using but I just say they're pulse rifles as I just prefer the look of carbines over rifles) - speaking of which would I have any problems with that at tourneys...would anyone really care?

    . Devilfish with SMS or gun drones... they're not glued in so I can swap 'em out if I want.

    . A Railhead Hammerhead I converted out of another devilfish... I don't have the Burst Cannon side things, although I did convert some from drones...but they look crap and are pretty fragile... but I do have loads of Gun Drones.

    . about 12 Kroot Carnivores.

    So yeah - What would you suggest taking for a tourney worthy Tau army? Feel free to suggest other purchases too, as I don't mind getting one or two extras, just so long as it's not too much/a completely new army... I'm not expecting to win this tourney by any stretch at all, as there'll be far more experienced players than us two there, but I'd at least like to get somewhere

    Lastly, there's no concrete Eldar army built yet (as my friend is in the middle of his A-Level exam period...) but what he said to me in the text message when I asked him about a Tau-Eldar alliance was that it'd be an "autarch based army"...

    Cheers

    EDIT: After reading the tactica articles on LO I've thrown together a quick and easy 500pt Tau list - it might give us a better starting point of discussion _

    HQ

    'El - Fire-Knife set up (see the main body of text for description on what it is), HW Multi-tracker, Targeting Array - 97

    Troops

    6 FWs - Nothing - 60

    10 Kroot - nothing - 70

    4 Pathfinders - Nothing - 48

    Pathfinder Devilfish - Disruption Pod - 85 (this thing will be transporting the FWs not the PFers... they will just sit back in cover and Marker-light up key enemies)

    Hammerhead - Railgun, Burst cannons & Disruption pod - 155

    XV8 Battlesuit - Fire-knife combo, Multi-Tracker - 62

    Total = 577

    Obviously we're quite a bit over the target points value so something is going to have to go, but honestly I don't know what... I'm leaning more toward the kroot and or the XV8, and using the spare points to buy more FWs, as I think even at 500pts with a transport, 6 guys will be just too fragile. The same goes with Kroot too - even if (and this is the plan) I infiltrate them into woods to give them the 6+ cover save straight off the bat, they wont be that great in CC without the hounds, and the Kroot Rifles aren't going to do that much anyway...

    Pathfinders I dont think are a problem if there's only 4... as I say I plan to keep 'em in cover at the back and just Marker-light stuff, so 4 guys isn't much of a problem as they'll be out of range of most guns (bar stuff like Snipers and heavy bolters and that), it might also work to their advantage, if they enemy doesn't view 4 guys as big a threat as 6 (even if they do have MLs...)

    I'm also aware that the hammerhead is an absoloutely massive points sink at this level... but it does have great versatility in that it can take on the very best tanks the enemy can throw at me at any point level and also comes with that Submunition round which will also chew up enemy light infantry and possibly heavies too - AND it can have Markerlight support to reduce the scatter by 5' - trouble is it'll be the target of every single heavy and anti-tank weapon that has a hope of damaging it from turn one... the key to keeping it alive will be to get it to keep flying and hug cover... I'm toying with the idea of a broadside instead though...

    So yeah, thoughts? Suggestions? Changes? What should be dropped and how do you think this kind of thing would fare in a doubles 500pt tourney with an eldar army by my side?

    EDIT 2: Oh yeah, the original questions about purchase suggestions and so on are also still on, so if you want to help me out on those issues then feel free to do so
    Well first things first, there is lots of fluff regarding Tau allying with imperial forces (including Marines), so a Tau/Marine team up is by no means out of the question.

    Secondly and I say this without any insult intended, you cannot build an effective list with what you have available. If you go the Marines/Tau route (which I would) then the way to build is to have the Marines as the move forward, take punishment and take the fight to the opponent component. The Tau are the fire support, staying back and taking down the armour, transports and tougher units part of the army.

    With that in mind this is what I would go for.

    XV8 Shas'El with twin linked missile pod, targeting array and HW BSF 81pts
    XV8 Shas'El with twin linked missile pod, targeting array and HW BSF 81pts

    XV8 with twin linked missile pod and targeting array 53pts
    XV8 with twin linked missile pod and targeting array 53pts

    6 Fire Warriors 60pts

    Hammerhead with railgun, burst cannons, multi, BSF and disruption pods 170pts

    498pts

    I know it does not look like much but stay with me. In this little army you have four highly accurate XV8's. You have two Shas'El's hitting on BS5 with a re-roll (essentially they won't miss and more importantly means you do not need expensive marker lights) and two XV8's with BS4 re-rolls. You have a Railgun to take down heavy stuff but more importantly it has the submunnition.

    You have 8 STR7 shots a turn, that will rarely miss and either a Railgun or subs as well, this may not seem much but remember the job of the Tau in the team up is to supply targeted support fire. This means their job is to surgically eliminate transports, tanks and other threats like bikes, Monstrous creatures etc and to do this you need highly accurate, high strength, long range firepower and that is exactly what this list does.

    While it seems that the list does not offer masses of firepower you have to remember that you have the Marines as well and the opponents army is not going to be that big. I personally would not want to be facing that Tau army allied with Marines with a 1000pt army.

    Keep all the XV8's as individual units, this allows them to exploit even the smallest amount of cover and makes it very very hard for the opponent to stop your shooting because he has to split fire between four units. Make sure that you keep the Hammerhead moving and at maximum range and use it a s long range sniper unit.
    The first two turns are what this Tau list is built to exploit, do not move the XV8's or HH forward (only as much as needed to get into range), keep them back and let the Marines do the dirty close up work.

    This army works because it has all thee phases of the battle covered, the Tau are the main shooting element and the Marines should be the assault element. The Marines should be moving forward if possible to put pressure on the opponents (obviously taking into account the opponents CC abilities). The good thing about Marines is they have decent shooting as well so even if you are facing a dangerous assault army they can still contribute decent shooting and pressure the opponents that way. The good thing about Marines is they are resilient and have decent mobility which means they can protect the Tau while they shoot (this is why you do not need Kroot).

    This Tau list is built to work with a close combat flavoured mobile Marines force, I would not use it with IG as they are mainly a shooting force themselves and would struggle to keep armies at bay, it would work OK with a CC themed Eldar force but I would not advise it over Marines.

    Finally the Fire Warriors should either be kept in reserve as long as possible or kept in heavy cover, do not use them as an offensive unit. I would stick them on an objective deep in your quarter and leave them there if not in reserve.

    This is a reasonably cheap army as well because you already have some XV's and the build of the Shas'El's can be built from the normal XV8 kit (a lot cheaper than the El/O kit) and you already have the Hammerhead and Fire Warriors.

    Hope that helps.

    EDIT: Oh I forgot and important small element of the list. You have three highly accurate units with black sun filters, very useful for night fight scenarios and against Necrons.
    Last edited by Rikimaru; May 26th, 2012 at 11:19.
    1984

  8. #7
    Senior Member Blackadder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DEfan View Post
    Hi, were there any FOC restrictions- like you HAVE to field 1 hq and 1 troop slot?
    Honestly, I don't know - all I'm going off is what my friend said, and he was pretty vague - 500pt doubles, so I'm assuming it's two fully legal 500pt armies which ally together against 2 enemy armies who do the same.

    Originally Posted by Blackadder

    As title

    Basically next year (I think - this is according to a friend of mine) there might be some kind of 40k doubles tourney where two different armies of 500pts come together to fight an opposing army of the same size. Me and my friend were thinking of giving it a go, and it'll be our first tourney for both of us, since we've never participated in one before, but have quite a bit of experience in friendly games and the very occassional GW gaming.

    Anyway, there's 2 options we were thinking of - 1) An Imperial army - I'd be fielding the good ol' fashioned Imperial Guard, and he'd be fielding Black Templars/Space Marines - which is outside this discussion really, and then there's option 2) - Namely, me using Tau, and him using another Xenos army, most likely Eldar (as that's the only one we could think of which would ally with Tau...).

    So... what i want is advice from my fellow LO Tau players on what to take in a 500pt Tourney going Tau army - They were my first 40k army ever (although not my first GW army... I played Fantasy for a few years before starting 40k) so I've got a few bits and bobs, although more recently i've moved much more strongly onto marines and guard so I've got less tau than them (although I still really like Tau...). The stuff I've got (that i know of off the top of my head) is the following:-

    . 2 Battlesuits set up as Fireknives (that's plasma rifle, missile pod and multi-tracker)

    . 10-12 FWs with Pulse Rifles (it's the carbine model they're using but I just say they're pulse rifles as I just prefer the look of carbines over rifles) - speaking of which would I have any problems with that at tourneys...would anyone really care?

    . Devilfish with SMS or gun drones... they're not glued in so I can swap 'em out if I want.

    . A Railhead Hammerhead I converted out of another devilfish... I don't have the Burst Cannon side things, although I did convert some from drones...but they look crap and are pretty fragile... but I do have loads of Gun Drones.

    . about 12 Kroot Carnivores.

    So yeah - What would you suggest taking for a tourney worthy Tau army? Feel free to suggest other purchases too, as I don't mind getting one or two extras, just so long as it's not too much/a completely new army... I'm not expecting to win this tourney by any stretch at all, as there'll be far more experienced players than us two there, but I'd at least like to get somewhere

    Lastly, there's no concrete Eldar army built yet (as my friend is in the middle of his A-Level exam period...) but what he said to me in the text message when I asked him about a Tau-Eldar alliance was that it'd be an "autarch based army"...

    Cheers

    EDIT: After reading the tactica articles on LO I've thrown together a quick and easy 500pt Tau list - it might give us a better starting point of discussion _

    HQ

    'El - Fire-Knife set up (see the main body of text for description on what it is), HW Multi-tracker, Targeting Array - 97

    Troops

    6 FWs - Nothing - 60

    10 Kroot - nothing - 70

    4 Pathfinders - Nothing - 48

    Pathfinder Devilfish - Disruption Pod - 85 (this thing will be transporting the FWs not the PFers... they will just sit back in cover and Marker-light up key enemies)

    Hammerhead - Railgun, Burst cannons & Disruption pod - 155

    XV8 Battlesuit - Fire-knife combo, Multi-Tracker - 62

    Total = 577

    Obviously we're quite a bit over the target points value so something is going to have to go, but honestly I don't know what... I'm leaning more toward the kroot and or the XV8, and using the spare points to buy more FWs, as I think even at 500pts with a transport, 6 guys will be just too fragile. The same goes with Kroot too - even if (and this is the plan) I infiltrate them into woods to give them the 6+ cover save straight off the bat, they wont be that great in CC without the hounds, and the Kroot Rifles aren't going to do that much anyway...

    Pathfinders I dont think are a problem if there's only 4... as I say I plan to keep 'em in cover at the back and just Marker-light stuff, so 4 guys isn't much of a problem as they'll be out of range of most guns (bar stuff like Snipers and heavy bolters and that), it might also work to their advantage, if they enemy doesn't view 4 guys as big a threat as 6 (even if they do have MLs...)

    I'm also aware that the hammerhead is an absoloutely massive points sink at this level... but it does have great versatility in that it can take on the very best tanks the enemy can throw at me at any point level and also comes with that Submunition round which will also chew up enemy light infantry and possibly heavies too - AND it can have Markerlight support to reduce the scatter by 5' - trouble is it'll be the target of every single heavy and anti-tank weapon that has a hope of damaging it from turn one... the key to keeping it alive will be to get it to keep flying and hug cover... I'm toying with the idea of a broadside instead though...

    So yeah, thoughts? Suggestions? Changes? What should be dropped and how do you think this kind of thing would fare in a doubles 500pt tourney with an eldar army by my side?

    EDIT 2: Oh yeah, the original questions about purchase suggestions and so on are also still on, so if you want to help me out on those issues then feel free to do so
    Well first things first, there is lots of fluff regarding Tau allying with imperial forces (including Marines), so a Tau/Marine team up is by no means out of the question.

    Secondly and I say this without any insult intended, you cannot build an effective list with what you have available. If you go the Marines/Tau route (which I would) then the way to build is to have the Marines as the move forward, take punishment and take the fight to the opponent component. The Tau are the fire support, staying back and taking down the armour, transports and tougher units part of the army.

    With that in mind this is what I would go for.

    XV8 Shas'El with twin linked missile pod, targeting array and HW BSF 81pts
    XV8 Shas'El with twin linked missile pod, targeting array and HW BSF 81pts

    XV8 with twin linked missile pod and targeting array 53pts
    XV8 with twin linked missile pod and targeting array 53pts

    6 Fire Warriors 60pts

    Hammerhead with railgun, burst cannons, multi, BSF and disruption pods 170pts

    498pts

    I know it does not look like much but stay with me. In this little army you have four highly accurate XV8's. You have two Shas'El's hitting on BS5 with a re-roll (essentially they won't miss and more importantly means you do not need expensive marker lights) and two XV8's with BS4 re-rolls. You have a Railgun to take down heavy stuff but more importantly it has the submunnition.

    You have 8 STR7 shots a turn, that will rarely miss and either a Railgun or subs as well, this may not seem much but remember the job of the Tau in the team up is to supply targeted support fire. This means their job is to surgically eliminate transports, tanks and other threats like bikes, Monstrous creatures etc and to do this you need highly accurate, high strength, long range firepower and that is exactly what this list does.

    While it seems that the list does not offer masses of firepower you have to remember that you have the Marines as well and the opponents army is not going to be that big. I personally would not want to be facing that Tau army allied with Marines with a 1000pt army.

    Keep all the XV8's as individual units, this allows them to exploit even the smallest amount of cover and makes it very very hard for the opponent to stop your shooting because he has to split fire between four units. Make sure that you keep the Hammerhead moving and at maximum range and use it a s long range sniper unit.
    The first two turns are what this Tau list is built to exploit, do not move the XV8's or HH forward (only as much as needed to get into range), keep them back and let the Marines do the dirty close up work.

    This army works because it has all thee phases of the battle covered, the Tau are the main shooting element and the Marines should be the assault element. The Marines should be moving forward if possible to put pressure on the opponents (obviously taking into account the opponents CC abilities). The good thing about Marines is they have decent shooting as well so even if you are facing a dangerous assault army they can still contribute decent shooting and pressure the opponents that way. The good thing about Marines is they are resilient and have decent mobility which means they can protect the Tau while they shoot (this is why you do not need Kroot).

    This Tau list is built to work with a close combat flavoured mobile Marines force, I would not use it with IG as they are mainly a shooting force themselves and would struggle to keep armies at bay, it would work OK with a CC themed Eldar force but I would not advise it over Marines.

    Finally the Fire Warriors should either be kept in reserve as long as possible or kept in heavy cover, do not use them as an offensive unit. I would stick them on an objective deep in your quarter and leave them there if not in reserve.

    This is a reasonably cheap army as well because you already have some XV's and the build of the Shas'El's can be built from the normal XV8 kit (a lot cheaper than the El/O kit) and you already have the Hammerhead and Fire Warriors.

    Hope that helps.

    EDIT: Oh I forgot and important small element of the list. You have three highly accurate units with black sun filters, very useful for night fight scenarios and against Necrons.
    Thank you very much for your advice there - if I remember correctly you yourself have written most of those tactica articles that I read too, so thats a bonus haha

    There's just a couple of things I can see up with that list:-

    1) 1 troops choice - as I said to the poster above, I don't know whether or not if I'm allowed 1 troops choice in this army but I'm going off the assumption that both armies are using the standard FOC - so that's an immediate problem.

    2) Deathrains... good configuration - they're effective no doubt, problem is I can't find any of the extra Missile Pods , even on the bits sites I've got favourited, so I dunno where I'm gonna get the extra weapons from, since the battlesuit box only comes with the one...

    Other than that, thanks for your advice - in a tourney setting that is probably a pretty decent plan (although for a solo army not really my cup of tea), and I'll let my friend know that he could use marines if he wanted and that it's justifiable fluff-wise.

    Can we move the army review onto the more general side of things please? - I'm gonna give Tourney Tau some thought really, as I say Guard are still an option (or hell...marines) so there are quite a few different armies to pick from, so what I want now while I'm chewing the various ideas over is see what you think of this list as a general Tau list for fighting on my own

    Thanks
    Last edited by Blackadder; May 26th, 2012 at 13:26.

  9. #8
    The deep down truth Rikimaru's Avatar
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    724 (x8)

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackadder View Post
    Honestly, I don't know - all I'm going off is what my friend said, and he was pretty vague - 500pt doubles, so I'm assuming it's two fully legal 500pt armies which ally together against 2 enemy armies who do the same.



    Thank you very much for your advice there - if I remember correctly you yourself have written most of those tactica articles that I read too, so thats a bonus haha

    There's just a couple of things I can see up with that list:-

    1) 1 troops choice - as I said to the poster above, I don't know whether or not if I'm allowed 1 troops choice in this army but I'm going off the assumption that both armies are using the standard FOC - so that's an immediate problem.

    2) Deathrains... good configuration - they're effective no doubt, problem is I can't find any of the extra Missile Pods , even on the bits sites I've got favourited, so I dunno where I'm gonna get the extra weapons from, since the battlesuit box only comes with the one...

    Other than that, thanks for your advice - in a tourney setting that is probably a pretty decent plan (although for a solo army not really my cup of tea), and I'll let my friend know that he could use marines if he wanted and that it's justifiable fluff-wise.

    Can we move the army review onto the more general side of things please? - I'm gonna give Tourney Tau some thought really, as I say Guard are still an option (or hell...marines) so there are quite a few different armies to pick from, so what I want now while I'm chewing the various ideas over is see what you think of this list as a general Tau list for fighting on my own

    Thanks
    My apologies for some reason I had it mind that it was one HQ and one troop choice, think I scanned Defans reply without reading properly.

    No problems simply lose one of the Shas'Els and take 10 Kroot

    The list would look like this:

    XV8 Shas'El with missile pod Plasma, targeting array and multi 97pts

    XV8 with twin linked missile pod and targeting array 53pts
    XV8 with twin linked missile pod and targeting array 53pts

    6 Fire Warriors 60pts
    10 Kroot 70pts

    Hammerhead with railgun, burst cannons, multi and disruption pods 165pts

    498pts

    The list needs a few changes but I think it is actually better for you. I have changed the Shas'El to a BS5 Fireknife which saves you some conversion work and gives you a bit of Plasma punch (I would still advise using this at range until mid game).
    You still have two highly accurate Deathrains and the El as I said is BS5. The Kroot are not ideal to be honest but better than another unit of Fire Warriors. You can use these to infiltrate and add some pressure with the Marines or keep them back as protection for the FW unit and XV's.

    Unfortunately the BSF's have had to go but if you are confident enough with BS3 Deathrains then you could give the Deathrains flamers and add a BSF to the Hammerhead and Shas'El.

    Like I said this list really fits what you have, the only thing would be finding two more missile pods or use some creative conversion because you do not have to use the bog standard MP's.

    This list would still play the same way as the previous one for the first few turns but you do have the Shas'El Plasma to add some punch later and the Kroot offer a bit more flexibility to deployment.

    Oh and this list would be pretty good as a stand alone list as well.
    1984

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    Senior Member Blackadder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rikimaru View Post
    My apologies for some reason I had it mind that it was one HQ and one troop choice, think I scanned Defans reply without reading properly.

    No problems simply lose one of the Shas'Els and take 10 Kroot

    The list would look like this:

    XV8 Shas'El with missile pod Plasma, targeting array and multi 97pts

    XV8 with twin linked missile pod and targeting array 53pts
    XV8 with twin linked missile pod and targeting array 53pts

    6 Fire Warriors 60pts
    10 Kroot 70pts

    Hammerhead with railgun, burst cannons, multi and disruption pods 165pts

    498pts

    The list needs a few changes but I think it is actually better for you. I have changed the Shas'El to a BS5 Fireknife which saves you some conversion work and gives you a bit of Plasma punch (I would still advise using this at range until mid game).
    You still have two highly accurate Deathrains and the El as I said is BS5. The Kroot are not ideal to be honest but better than another unit of Fire Warriors. You can use these to infiltrate and add some pressure with the Marines or keep them back as protection for the FW unit and XV's.

    Unfortunately the BSF's have had to go but if you are confident enough with BS3 Deathrains then you could give the Deathrains flamers and add a BSF to the Hammerhead and Shas'El.

    Like I said this list really fits what you have, the only thing would be finding two more missile pods or use some creative conversion because you do not have to use the bog standard MP's.

    This list would still play the same way as the previous one for the first few turns but you do have the Shas'El Plasma to add some punch later and the Kroot offer a bit more flexibility to deployment.

    Oh and this list would be pretty good as a stand alone list as well.
    Thanks - I've saved that army list as a word doc for later if/when I go to this tourney with my friend (assuming it is actually happening and Tau aren't updated by then).

    Is this also what you would recommend for a solo 500pt Tau army that's just for fun/friendlies/GW gaming but not tourney? Or are we looking at something different for that? I generally like to run my Tau as a mech force when it's on it's own to keep up the manouverability - tell you what, i'll throw together another 500pt list, this time without tourneys in mind and just my general play-style and so on, so we can get that reviewed also and make (if you want to of course) purchase suggestions too.

    EDIT:

    Here's what I have so far - gonna stop now as I have no idea how to finish it really...

    HQ

    El - TA, Fireknife, Hard Wired MT - 97

    Troops

    XV8 - Fireknife, MT - 62

    10 FWs - Pulse Rifles - 100

    10 Kroot - 70

    4 Pathfinders - 48

    Pathfinder fish (will accompany FWs) - SMS, D Pod, Multi Tracker - 115

    Total = 492

    Unsure of how to finish it - originally I was going to use the 30-40pts I spent on buffing the fish with an SMS and tracker on the kroot, buying them hounds and having a couple of points left over, however experience has taught me numerous times kroot get shot down far too easily and far before I get to use them anyway. Alternatively I had considered trying to get a broadside in there too - at the expense of the kroot, but then I remembered I need 2 troop choices, I have also considered dropping the PFinders, as due to the lack of a Railgun I think their MLs will not be that handy... but then I dunno what I'd spend the remaining 56pts on - finally, I was also considering ditching the kroot for another 6 FWs with Pulse rifles who would sit near the PFers... but then I don't think they'd do that much and it also doesn't mesh well with my mech theme if half of all the infantry are just sitting still...

    It's late and my minds hit a wall with this now - so I'll just let you make suggestions on what to do.

    EDIT 2: Another alternative I've thought of, dropping both the suits down to Deathrains (2 Missile Pods + Targeting Arrays) - if my calculations are correct, again it's late and I'm tired... would save me...28pts? Couple that with dropping the upgrades on the fish (SMS and Tracker, Pod is mandatory apparently), and that makes 58... couple that with the 8pts I have already, that makes 64... ALMOST enough for a broadside! Must admit that's the way I'm leaning at the minute, if my maths is right, what do you think?

    Thanks
    Last edited by Blackadder; May 27th, 2012 at 01:39.

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    The deep down truth Rikimaru's Avatar
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    500pts is an awful points level for Tau, basically because of the two troop requirement. Fire Warriors are just not that good as a core for an army. So with that in mind we have to deal with those limitations. The list you posted is not bad at all but I think it just needs some tweaking. At 500pts you are not going to run into much heavy armour but that is no guarantee that you won't, so having the means to take it down is always good.
    What you will run into however is mid AV value transports and infantry type units. Usually you will not see very expensive HQ and elites and army builds will often be very focussed/polarised on one element of the game (I/E close combat or shooting).

    Ok so lets have a look at a list. We have two compulsory elements, the HQ and two troop choices.

    The HQ is easy and I know many will argue the taking of the targeting array on the El, well I always answer with the same thing "When an army is restricted to one way of fighting the battle then it makes sense to make sure they do it as well as it can, within whatever limitations".

    Make no bones about it, Tau die if they get closed down and caught by even average CC armies, so it makes no sense to put points into CC but it makes eminent sense to put points into what they do well and that is shooting.

    So we are taking a Shas'El with Plasma, Missile pod, Targeting array and multi 97pts

    The Fire Warriors are compulsory so we take six (minimum).
    You mentioned Kroot and the idea of taking hounds and a tracker. Not sure what you mean by tracker, I think you might mean a shaper. To be honest neither the shaper or Hounds offer enough for them to be taken. I would just take a straight 10 man squad. Kroot offer decent shooting and this should be your preferred method of attack if possible.

    So that totals 227pts.

    Now we come to the XV8's. In my opinion the fireknife is just to expensive and inefficient to be taken in a 500pts list, also Plasma is not really needed at this points level because the things it is useful against such as termies, Monstrous creatures or tough HQ are quite rare due to their expense. The Plasma on the Shas'El should be sufficient to deal with most threats you will meet in a 500pts army.

    While I love the targeting array on the XV8 and I always take them on Deathrains on bigger points lists we need to remember that reference to "within limitations" I made earlier. In 500pts the points are often best spent elsewhere due to the points restrictions at 500pts. Given the fact that infantry is a big part of most 500pts lists I think the Deathrain flamer build is a solid build.

    XV8 twin linked missile pod, flamer 47pts

    They are still accurate enough with their missile pods but they can be sent forward later in the game to mop up higher armour save (5/6+) infantry with the Flamers, plus they are cheap enough to lose if needed. The flamer is also handy when dealing with cover and auto hits which is handy, just be very careful not to be tempted to use the Flamer if there are targets on the table that need the missile pods strength (target priority is everything with Tau).

    Now we come to the difficult part of the list. Do we take the Hammerhead or XV88's, well both have their merits.

    Hammerhead is tough and offers the anti infantry subs round and obviously has the railgun but not having the benefit of marker light help does mean it accuracy suffers,
    XV88's don't have the subs but they are more inherently accurate and you can take two of them for the same cost and they do have some limited anti infantry with their SMS. With this in mind I am going to cost out both and build two lists.

    Hammerhead with railgun, burst cannons, multi and DP's 165pts

    2 x XV88's advanced stabilisation system 160pts

    Hammerhead list:

    Shas'El with Plasma, Missile pod, Targeting array, BSF and multi,100pts

    XV8 twin linked missile pod, flamer 47pts
    XV8 twin linked missile pod, flamer 47pts

    Fire Warriors x 7 (Pulse rifles) 70pts
    Kroot x 10 70pts

    Hammerhead with railgun, burst cannons, multi and DP's 165pts

    499pts

    XV88 list

    Shas'El with Plasma, Missile pod, Targeting array and multi 97pts

    XV8 twin linked missile pod, flamer 47pts
    XV8 twin linked missile pod, flamer 47pts

    Fire Warriors x 7 (Pulse rifles) 70pts
    Kroot x 11 77pts

    XV88 with A'S'S 80pts
    XV88 with A'S'S 80pts

    498pts

    Both lists have their merits and I would be equally happy taking each. It all depends on your play style and finances.

    The Hammerhead list does have the benefit of that subs round and a big tough tank but the XV88 list has two separate railguns and the small benefit of Kroot unit a bit more resilient. The Hammerhead list has the benefit of superior mobility and the HH is less vulnerable to fast moving assault type units.
    The XV88 list has the benefit of the opponent needing to split fire between more units due to the separate XV88 units and also means that it is harder to stop the railgun element of the army.

    Hope that helps a bit.
    1984

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