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what are your guy's thoughts on an DE army completely made up of skimmers. I know this has been done before, but does it hold any benefits from a normal kabal? Also what are its main weakness's? Is it smart to have no guys on the ground to start off a battle?Your thoughts on this will be gratly appreciated
having an all your squads on raiders is not very good. there are certain advantages like they can move very fast, and the distruption table would not affect them, but raiders are very fragile. personally i believe that there should be a balance, some cc squads and some shooty squads.
I wouldn't recommend it.
First of all you cant use sniper squads anmore because a sniper squad is a squad of 10 warriors and 2 of them have a DL. If you take a raider squad you are only allowed to take 1 heavy weapon.
Second of all skimmers do not block line of sight anymore so the ''iron shield'' around your hq raider doesnt work anymore like in the third edition rules.
Third When a raider gets shot down (and that happens very quick) then there entangled pinned watever in any case it means your screwed.
Like Warsmithnig says the key to victory lies between the balance of shooting and CC of your army. Unless its a wych cult army then CC will do better then shooting ^^.
Dont rely to much on your raiders dark lances or dissies. Sure they have a standard anti tank weapon but they will not hold out for long they will get shot down way faster then a sniper squad iin ruins do. Stick to balance not for only shooting or CC.
However with that statement out of the way, I would say listen to ArchonBjorn. He has a really good tendency to not say stupid things and give bad advice.Learn from yesterday.
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Originally posted by WarsmithNiG@Dec 26 2004, 14:14
having an all your squads on raiders is not very good. there are certain advantages like they can move very fast, and the distruption table would not affect them, but raiders are very fragile. personally i believe that there should be a balance, some cc squads and some shooty squads.[snapback]286484[/snapback]
Amen to that brother.
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how many raiders should you have roughly in a 1500-2000 pts army. Should you give at least some of your squads raiders? Say i have four Warrior squads (forget about how many in each) should i give 2 of them raiders and have the other 2 on foot? Or have 1 in a raider and 3 on foot, ect.?
Actually, an all-Skimmer army is probably the best way to make a 4th ed Raider Rush. Raiders, Ravagers and Reavers. Have a couple of powerful assault units in Raiders (Wyches, or a Lord + Incubi/Grotesques), a jetbike Archon, 5 - 6 shooty Raider Squads and then the rest made up of supporting Reavers and Ravagers. Or, make the Reavers your main assaulters by taking 6 shooty Raider Squads, 3 units of 6+ Reavers with Succubi, a Reaver Archon and then either a Reaver Dracon or 3 Reaver Haemonculi. Ravagers as back-up.
Trying to go 'half-and-half' (i.e, only a few Raider units, some shooty infantry) just means a good opponent can destroy you piecemeal. Your few Raiders will be destroyed first as priority targets, then with no decent assault ability the rest of your army can either be shot to pieces or assaulted without much bother to the enemy. With an all-Skimmer army you can use the principle of saturating the enemy defences, giving him more to deal with in one place than he is able to. The main assault units tear through two or three enemy squads at a time while the gunboat Raider Squads and Ravagers shoot at any nearby unengaged enemy units. The Reavers pitch in wherever useful.
However, if you use Webway Portals then a 'half-and-half' approach works. Footsloggers move the Portals close to the centre of the board, then assault units in the Webway emerge in Raiders to attack anything within 20".
I prefer this WWP approach to the Raider Rush. But if you want to use a Raider Rush then going all-skimmer is the way forwards.No, but a Raider squad packs a Dark Lance or Disintegrator on the actual Raider, so there's their second heavy weapon. The main bummer is the loss of a second special weapon for the squad - I'd love it if Raider Squads could carry 2 Blasters, but they'd be overpowered.First of all you cant use sniper squads anmore because a sniper squad is a squad of 10 warriors and 2 of them have a DL. If you take a raider squad you are only allowed to take 1 heavy weapon.
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These guys are ALL right, but the way I see it, Raiders aren't dangerous to take, nor are they not worth it at all. The trick is in the set-up. If your playing games where theres a 18" difference in your battle lines, such as we have here at local tournaments, then Raiders are a beaut. Move 12", jump out, FoF if needs be, and your within assault range. Score. However most conventional games your going to be at least 24" away.
This is why they move 24". Force your opponent to deal with the Raiders, but put small point squads in them, I use 5 man Wych teams, with 1 Blaster, and a Champ with an Agoniser. This way, even if they biff it, you won't have lost much, and if they do succeed, they will to a great degree.
By moving 24", the enemy can only get glancers, which means he can't get penetrators which would flush out your troops. In fact, he only has a 1/3 chance of blowing them up, and this makes him use his big guns on things he could have ignored/assaulted (which DE excel in). Perfect for protecting your Reavers! It's human nature to deal with whatever is closest to you. Use this to your advantage by fielding multiple Raiders with cheap squads (with hidden Agoniser of course).
Another thing you can do is just move with your Raider squad and then rapid fire. This will most of the time put you in range with Blasters (bing! dead Rhino) and Rifles/Cannon if you can't find a Blaster target. Never take a Lance on a Raider squad.
Having a lot of squads means a lot of Raiders, which means a lot of Sybarites with a lot of Agonisers, which is also a lot of Raiders with Lance/Horrorfex ( < to which i use a tremendous and fruitful extent). Often times the enemy doesn't have enough guns to bring them all down. And always remember ! You NEVER have to tell your opponent which Raider contains your Incubi (WOOT).
Hope that helped. Raiders are great, but keep some Sniper squads as well, they're invaluable, and only 100 points.
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A skimmer army can be deadly. I never enter a 2000 point game with less than 8. 3 Disintegrator Raiders, 3 DL Raiders and 2 Ravagers (1 of each type). My only units on foot are 1 DL squad, Warpbeast and a Talos. I'm contemplating taking one of the other Raiders that I hardly use, got 11 of em total, and turning it back into a Ravager by dropping the Talos and Warpbeast to free up the points.