i just started playing. advice please... - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
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    i need to know what to put in my army. advice please...

    i just started playing warhammer 40k. i have chosen to play necron. i have an idea of what i want my army to be comprised of. here is my ideal beginning army list:

    HQ- Necron Lord

    TROOPS1- Warriors (12)

    TROOPS2- Warriors (12)

    HEAVY SUPPORT- Tomb Spiders, eqipped with gauze cannons (3)

    it is not much. but that is what i want to start with. any advice? also. i am kind of confused about wargear for the necron lord. do you have to permanently attach it to your lord? or is it interchangable? what wargear should i use for him? and does the gear actualy come with the model or do i have to purchase it seperately?

    Last edited by filth_incarnate; March 27th, 2005 at 18:55.

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  3. #2
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    One thing I feel compelled to point out is that you're probably going to want to equip your Tomb Spyders with claws rather than claw + particle projectors, because Tomb Spyders have such a low ballistic skill. On average, they'll hit with one of their three shots, and while it's a nice shot, that means almost nothing in comparison to the rest of the shooting in your army. They may have a similarly low weapon skill as well, but they're monstrous creatures. You'll get a lot more out of their MC close combat bonuses than you ever will if you have them shooting. I did the same thing and regretted it. Fortunately, I have friends who don't care if I say, "oh, and by the way - that TS has two claws, not one claw and a gun."

    The other big thing to know is not to ignore your scarabs. You've got warriors, so you've got scarab swarms. Their statline doesn't look like much, but 10 bases of scarabs are not only cheap; they are a 30-wound jetbiking unit that can tie up most troops in close combat for the better part of a game before they go down. Or, equip them with disruption fields and they become every tank's worst nightmare.

    That said, your next investment should be more warriors. Warriors are badass, and they're the easiest way to increase your phaseout number. Odds are, whenever you are defeated, it will be by phaseout - not by having all your units wiped off the table. Check your codex to brush up on what units are necrons and what aren't. The Necron battleforce is a nice boxed set - it has 20 warriors, 5 scarab bases and 3 Destroyers. You'll want more Ds eventually (see below), but in the meantime it'll cost you less than buying those pieces seperately, and you'll probably (90%) end up with those models eventually.

    You'll eventually need some destroyers and/or heavy destroyers. The former make for nice fire support, but you're going to need a large number of them in order for them to be effective. Don't go with the minimum unit size on the basic destroyers - they'll get put down a bit too easily. On the other end of the spectrum, heavy destroyers are excellent against hard targets, but should be split up into as many small units as your force chart allows, since they're fire magnets. The big guideline there is to always take more than one, since you want them to get a WBB roll.

    Other guidelines to consider: A destroyer lord with a warscythe is a nice investment once you've got a solid core of troops (I use 40 warriors in a 1500 point game, but that's the extreme high end of the spectrum - most people use 30 or so), and although a monolith is tempting, save it for 2000+ games - the more points you put into non-necron units, the better your phaseout number inevitably is. Eventually, you'll want some elite troops, and you will find yourself chewing over the immortals vs. pariah question. I'd suggest that you check out the other threads here that have argued that one ad infinitum and make a choice that suits you once you've gotten the hang of the game. I'd also suggest to later posters that this not get turned into a copy of those threads. My 1500 point army has no elite choices and does acceptably well without them for the moment.

    Answering general questions: The only piece of wargear that you have to worry about with regard to purchasing and assembling in the real world is the destroyer body. They make a d-lord model exactly for that purpose, and you'll save yourself a lot of time and energy getting that. Unless, of course, you're one of those types to do nifty conversions using other models - but that usually comes later. Other wargear is generally just written on the list. Some wargear entries in other codices have specific rules about how they must be represented on the model somehow (master-crafted weapons having a spiffy paint job, for example), and a lot of players like to model wargear regardless, but to the best of my knowledge, this isn't required for Necrons beyond the destroyer body, so feel free to shift your wargear around and try different things out. That said, be aware that the foot lord does not come with a choice between the staff of light and the warscythe, while the D-Lord does. People will expect your D-Lord to be wielding the weapon he's using in the list.

    Wargear advice inevitably becomes a discussion of just a few pieces, so consider these suggestions: Many, many, MANY people like ressurection orbs and the veil of darkness. There are good reasons for this - check your codex. Two pieces of wargear that many people have their eyes drawn to initially are the phylactery and the lightning field, but there are a few things to bear in mind about those when you're making your selections. The phylactery, if it's ever called into play, has a 50% chance of being wasted points, a 16.6% percent chance of having no effect but allowing another shot at effectiveness, and a 33% chance of actually being useful. Those are not great odds. The lightning field looks nice in principle, but keep your eye on the strength value of those hits. Unless you're fighting Imperial Guard or other low-toughness armies, odds are that it will not earn its points cost back in kills.
    Last edited by Jabberwocky; March 27th, 2005 at 19:15.

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    res orb is a must(well not really but whats the point of necron armies if they cant pop back up??) now if you want your lord to cc oriented equip him with res orb/phase shifter/warscythe remember that warscythe doesnt go against the 100 point wargear.. tomb spyders are marine killers so i would take them against marines.

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    is this a better army plan?

    hq- necron lord (w/ res. orb and v.o.d.) 200 points

    troops- warriors (12) warriors (12) 360 points

    elites- immortals (10) 250 points

    fast attack- scarab swarms (w/ disruption fields) (10) 170 points

    that is a 1000 point army. the total is 980. i am thinking if i make a 1500 point army i will add the monolith +235, a destroyer lord (w/ phase shifter and warscythe) +170, wraiths (3) +123, and take out a scarab swarm (1) -12. the total would be 1496 i think.so yeah. tell me what you think of these plans. any changes you would make?

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    Ultimately, you'll want to try a few things out and see what works for you. That said, the monolith is a huge points sink for a non-necron unit in a small game. Your best guideline is to think about how your expenditures affect your phaseout number. 24 warriors in a 1500 game with a monolith means that your phaseout number is going to be rather low.

    In the list you've described, you start with 29 models with the necron special rule, and will automatically lose the game if you're reduced to 7 of them. In a 1500-point game, that could happen very quickly. Against most lists, the way to victory is to eliminate large point values of enemy models at a relatively low cost to your own troops. The way to defeat a necron army is to invoke phaseout by killing as many necron models (irrespective of points cost) as possible as fast as possible. My roommate has killed a Necron list to the man, but such stories are few and far between. I really wouldn't recommend spending the cash on a monolith until you can field at least a 2000-point list for that reason. Yes, it can kill lots of things and is very tough, but your opponent is, for the most part, under no obligation to fight it.

    If it were me (and don't take this as gospel - if you've got a friend that you can do a few quick games with to get a feel for the game, do it!), I'd skip the elite choice and only take one tomb spyder in favor of more warriors - 30, at least. The higher your phaseout number, the more tactical options you have. Any big block of non-necron points is going to be avoided at all costs by the enemy.
    Last edited by Jabberwocky; March 28th, 2005 at 00:18.

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    i just checked the necron codex and immortals count as necron. so wouldn;t it be better to keep them in. i had a little strategy idea to use the veil of darkness to teleport the immortal unit and lord in to the middle of the enemy army. that way i could possibly destroy a vehicle or somthing else turn one. i got the idea from someone else on this website. i think it could work pretty well...

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    That's a common tactic, and it works pretty well, since the immortals have excellent weapons. They're expensive models (both cash-wise and points-wise), though, and many people opt for faster units to complement the initial group of warriors. Try it out a bit and see if you find them to be worth the point cost in a smaller game.

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    There are only 6 good Necron units. And there is one crappy Necron unit that is unfortunately mandatory. All the other units are terrible or their use is limited to particular circumstance. I prefer a versatile list that can deal with a variety of threats, but also fields a large body of Warriors and Flayed Ones to prevent phase out.

    1) Lord with Veil of Darkness and compulsory Res Orb (don't give him a warscythe)

    2) Warriors and Flayed Ones (should comprise ~50% of your army's points)

    3) Immortals (awesome with Veil of Darkness, toughest Necron unit, low relative cost)

    4) Scarabs (amazing for tying units up and killing vehicles: 8-10 bases per squad is ideal)

    5) Monolith (teleportation will add flexibility to your army, the ability to reroll wbb rolls is invaluable, and the option to deepstrike can decimate some opponents)

    6) Tomb Spyders (best marine killing cc weapon in the Necron Army, dont underestimate tomb spyders, they will kill marines in close combat faster than anything else in the Necron arsenal)

    7) Heavy Destroyer (terrible unit, but the only AP2 weapon readily available-compulsory vs some armies)


    Destroyers cost way too much, for the same cost you can have 3 warriors or 2 immortals, which will put out a much higher volume of firepower. Destroyers also have low unit sizes which make them susceptible to being wiped out in one turn. Destroyers need AP3, and then they would be amazing, but at AP4 they are crap vs marines. Against 4+ armies, destroyers are decent, but I generally leave them out of my army if playing against space marines--and most people here play space marines.

    Wraiths are amazing against some armies like Tau, but for the most part Wraiths are expensive, overspecialized units with very low effectiveness for their cost. They need rending claws... and even then might not be good enough.

    Pariahs just suck... thats pretty obvious.


    one of my standard 2000 point lists looks like this:

    1 Lord (Veil of Darkness, Ressurection Orb)
    36 Warriors
    10 Flayed Ones
    10 Immortals
    9 Scarabs /w DFields
    1 Monolith
    2 Tomb Spyders
    3 Heavy Destroyers

    60 Necrons, phase out @ 15
    Last edited by Khobai; March 28th, 2005 at 06:44.

  10. #9
    Senior Member justinb67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by filth_incarnate
    is this a better army plan?

    hq- necron lord (w/ res. orb and v.o.d.) 200 points

    troops- warriors (12) warriors (12) 360 points

    elites- immortals (10) 250 points

    fast attack- scarab swarms (w/ disruption fields) (10) 170 points

    that is a 1000 point army. the total is 980. i am thinking if i make a 1500 point army i will add the monolith +235, a destroyer lord (w/ phase shifter and warscythe) +170, wraiths (3) +123, and take out a scarab swarm (1) -12. the total would be 1496 i think.so yeah. tell me what you think of these plans. any changes you would make?
    That is a good list! but immortals are 28 a piece, so you are at 1010 pts. Drop the d-fields on the scarabs, add in an immortal and ur set.

    Justin
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