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Continuing on hourglass' thread, I think I speak for a lot of players that with this new codex we are currently working on how to maximize our 2 HQ choices. I didn't want to drag this discussion into his tactica article. With most games almost certain to be standard games, you're going to want to take 2 HQ choices as well. Also, our HQ's are the toughest nids we have that are resistant to fire. I think this is what the great source of debate has become.
IMO, we should consider a 1500 to 1850 point game here. Both are pretty similar in unit composition and are more ruled by troops than elites. 2000+ you start to see a lot more termis, Land Raiders, Monoliths, etc.
In essence, we have 4 HQ choices to consider:
1. Flying CC Tyrant (2 Scyths)
2. Swift Flying Tyrant (Devourer/Scyth)
3. Gun Tyrant (Venom/Devourer)
4. Broodlord with stealers
I'm not going to consider warriors here because I consider them to be elite choices since we have tons of elite choices to spare.
Some of my opinions:
I think the biggest debate is between flying cc Tyrant vs. Broodlord with Stealers. Both are similar in role and about the same in pts and tougness. One uses wings to get close and the other uses infiltrate. Both are great at hunting down marines and characters. Broodlord is almost as tough as tyrant in terms of stats and having some body bag stealers.
Gun Tyrant and Gun carnifex are very close as well. However, Gun tyrant offers some advantages being synapse, better stasts, and credible CC phase as a reserve unit. Is this enough to justify it as a choice over the other tyrants?
I'm very scared of taking Flying Tyrants and broodlord/stealers for some reason. I think that my main source of synapse is too fragile. Its possible to make up for it with zoanthropes and warriors, but I find both of these units tend to drastically underperform. Has anyone tried this succesfully?
By math, Swift tyrant (devourer/talon) is probably the best killer if he gets in 2 turns of shooting.
So what do you guys feel are the best 2 choices and why?
Last edited by Vindkall; August 3rd, 2005 at 22:35.
Definately not "swift" tyrant. If you have wings on your tyrant you don't want a gun you'll probably only get off one shot. Anyway i use a CC non flying tyrant with guard, which isn't included on your list
IMO, we should take the 2 CC hq's (BL + CC Tyt). The walking tyrant doesn't have enough firepower to knock out the stuff our hormies and stealers can't touch. Firepower should come from heavy support.
A walking tyrant isn't going to get there in time to make tat big of a difference.
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I really like walking tyrant's ability to help out against heavy tanks (dreads/preds) and also take out skimmers with ease (landspeeders w/assault cannons). Although zoanhtropes can help, they don't hit enough and don't prevent those dangerous weapons from firing. I love venom cannons for that reason. Although I won't kill the tank, having it not fire is just as good. This is another reason why i like swift tyrant. With those strength 5 attacks, those speeders/raiders will be my main targets.
Winged Hive Tyrant with Scything Talons, Rending Claws, Wings, Warp Field, Implant attack, Adren glands.
Broodlord with Extended carapice, Acid maw, Toxin sacs and 5 Stealers with Ext cara, Toxin sacs.
Thats my HQ fast Tyrant with 2+ save in combat by turn 2 latest and kills anything it touches.
Broodlord re rolls all failed wounds on 1st round of combat and ST6 with a 3+ SV. lethal.
Forget shooting on the tyrant HQ get them in CC where they do the most good not plodding over the field drawing fire like a magnet. Even the Tyrant guard are not much use with the majority toughness and mixed armour rules.
I disagree with parts of this. I am quite fond of the Winged Tyrant having Scytals and a TL Dev. The devs give you the ability to shoot while advancing to CC. That means more attacks, overall. IMO
A little pain never hurt anyone - Larry
You guys have left out a great HQ choice in the army, the warriors. in lower point games, they are much more abordable than the other HQ choices, and can still pack quite a punch.
D'OH!! Good point Wolfpack. Don't forget, they can have more wounds and more guns than a Tyrant. I forgot all about them.Originally Posted by Wolf_Pack
A little pain never hurt anyone - Larry
I think that venom cannons on your tyrant in games over 1500 points are very efective. They got 3 S7 attacks at range 36. It helps out alot versus hard to catch/ tough enemies like mech eldar or raven gaurd and even the occasional dark eldar. My friend plays mech eldar and raven gaurd and the VC is probably what wins me the game.
(Im talkin about a flying tyrant with a VC and talons.)
IMO, we should consider a 1500 to 1850 point game here. ...If you are talking 1500+ games, how do we have Elite slots to spare? You can take Dakka-fexes for 114 as Elite choices! Load up on them!I'm not going to consider warriors here because I consider them to be elite choices since we have tons of elite choices to spare.Good at CC. He is a good way to get Synapse up front quickly.1. Flying CC Tyrant (2 Scyths)Um... dont you mean Swift Flying Tyrant (Devourer/Devourer)? Take 2 TL Devourers. Thats 12 S6 shots rerolling to hit and to wound. Flying means you get to choose your targets and keep out of charge range.2. Swift Flying Tyrant (Devourer/Scyth)Other choice is VC+BS and sit back as close to 36" as possible. Either way, this version is a "walking" Tyrant and should include Guard as additional protection.3. Gun Tyrant (Venom/Devourer)I tried him a couple times. By himself he's not too bad, and infiltrate is ok. the problem is that he doesn't have fleet, and his retinue doesn't either. That means, after infiltrate, they are slow as heck and likely to get shot to pieces. Sure the BL can't be targetted, but he's not invincible. Also, with no ranged weapons their lack of speed hurts them. Honestly, as cool as he is, and useful to infiltrate to get an advanced Synapse, he's not all that he's cracked up to be. A Tyrant is probably better.4. Broodlord with stealers